I have $800 and I am a noob

Hi all. I brewed a tiny bit in college with plastic buckets, so I know a little bit about brewing, but not much.

I have been put in charge of a project to home brew GOOD beer. My friends and I don't want cheap hobby crap beer. We want really good beer. We're willing to buy whatever it takes for this.

We need to be able to bottle some of it, but we would also like to keg. I've been thinking three better bottles, two 5 gal corny kegs, a 10 gallon MegaPot, two taps with a temperature controller for our spare freezer. We have a propane burner to boil.

What kind of setup would you recommend with this kind of money? How can we learn as we go while also buying good equipment?

We don't really care to do overly complicated things. We're primarily concerned with the quality of the beer.

Well, first off, I would not plan on dropping $800 on day 1.
That said, $300 or so will get you rolling with a good kit and bottles and a beer ingredient kit for your first. I wouled do a batch or two and get the handle on brewing and then step up. Adding in a Corny keg and all the bits needed for kegging would be annother $150 to 200 depending on what you can dig up, I would shop around some.
Then add in the freezer adaptor and the rest
JMHO, YMMV

I personally have never had "cheap hobby crap beer" considering my fellow brewers and I use the same ingredients and methods as commercial brewers. And put a lot of attention to details such as temp control, and sanitization, and using the freshest ingredients.

Some folks make fantastic beer on a turkey fryer and in buckets (or on the stove), while some make it on huge expensive systems....it's not the toys that mark the difference between good and bad beer, it's the brewer, and the process he develops with experience, and care.

Rather than filling out a shopping list with glitzy toys, why don't you and your friends concentrate on learning the brewing process, and strive to make great beer using the most basic of gear. Even on your stovetop.

A fermenter is a fermenter whether it is a plastic bucket, which my last bronze medal beer was brewed in, or a stainless steel job. Great beer is made in everything and with everything, from the crudest setup to the state of the art...just like crappy beer is....

Hold off on your shopping list, read http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html and all the sticky's in this place as well as the threads with the most discussed topics. Start with a basic setup, and concentrate on being less of a noob who thinks 800 bucks worth of goodies is going to instantly make great beer, and learn what it takes to make great beer. Which is practice and patience.

Here is a decent starter kit.
http://store.nexternal.com/shared/S...oreType=BtoC&Count1=77175319&Count2=994315743
Add a large SS pot from Bass Pro for $30 or so and your in business

My suggestion is also to start slow. Otherwise you will purchase a ton of equipment and realize 3 months later it dosen't fit with what you guys want to do. More importantly, if you are going to buy a brew kettle I would go larger than 10 gallons simply because I can see you quickly going to 10 gallon batches with all your friends drinking the end result. 15 gallons is a good minimum size for a 10 gallon batch.

Revvy, you rock. You've been around here forever, yet still take the time to write well thought out responses to newbies that hits the nail right on the head. Just thinking of how many times you've answered the same questions, you impress me daily.

Just send me the $800 and I'll send you everything you need to get started

Scut_Monkey said:

My suggestion is also to start slow. Otherwise you will purchase a ton of equipment and realize 3 months later it dosen't fit with what you guys want to do. More importantly, if you are going to buy a brew kettle I would go larger than 10 gallons simply because I can see you quickly going to 10 gallon batches with all your friends drinking the end result. 15 gallons is a good minimum size for a 10 gallon batch.

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I kind of agree with this a 10 gallon kettle is a good starting point it will give you good flexability later. It's very good for 5-7 gallon batches now and would be perfect when you upgrade to use as a HLT. I'm running a single tier sytem with 3 kegs and have yet to have a need for 12 gallons + of sparge water. Bottling will get very old as soon as you keg the first time, but until then its not bad at all. As stated above do your research and get quality product the FIRST time thats the easiest way to save money. I've only been at it a for 1 1/2 years and I found between this forum and lots of trial and error there's alot to learn and improve on. I started out with a morebeer kit and a year later and countless dollars spent I built my single tier. Just remember you will never be done. Good luck

Oldyote said:

Just send me the $800 and I'll send you everything you need to get started

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Hmmm....
25 dollar turkey fryer with stock 7.5 gallon pot
50 dollar wort chiller
50 dollar modified 5 gallon cooler
10 dollar bucket fermenter
2 dollar airlock
5 dollar hydrometer
2 dollar thermometer
10 dollar auto siphon
15 dollar bottle of starsan
5 dollar bottle capper
2 dollar 144 caps
2 cases of bottles (you scrounged from the dumpster)
5 dollars rubbermade bin for a swamp cooler/temp control setup (with frozen waterbottles)

Sounds like a good markup to me!!!!

I was a noob this time last year. But three things helped me more than anything else...and they can all be had for free from these interwebs:
1.) This forum.
2.) Listening to the free Brewing Network podcasts.
3.) Reading How To Brew by John Palmer

After that, just brew. A lot. I think, from last count, I've brewed over 200 gallons in under a year. I've made a ton of mistakes, and will continue to...but I'm learning a lot. And my beer is becoming very good. It just takes time.

I will say, though, that one of the most important piece of brewing seems to be the ability to control fermentation temperature. People on this forum have built some awesome (and cheap) fermentation chambers. Find one that fits your budget/ability/space requirements and make it happen.

Money doesn't make good beer, good technique makes good beer.

KayaBrew said:

Money doesn't make good beer, good technique makes good beer.

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If I had room on my sig, this would go there!

If you're willing to start out spending that kind of money, you might as well start doing all grain and kegging (like you mentioned). All grain gets you quality beer and it really isn't all that hard. Your first few times you might screw a few things up and fumble but it's just about getting coordinated and getting the general process down. You'll see a lot of DIY stuff on here, so you have to decide how good you are at that. If you're good at DIY you can make some nice stuff without spending a lot of cash. If you aren't, you might just end up damaging a perfectly good piece of material.

A mash tun made from a cooler is a very easy one to do which will save you money and still get you quality results on your beer. You can make a wort chiller, but I've seen a lot for sale that are better than what I've made...and it's easy to screw up the copper pipe by kinking it or hurting yourself if you have joint problems . Don't buy bottles, you can get these for free from bars or friends that drink beers with pop-tops. Probably the most expensive parts are going to be:

- Kettle
- Fridge (to convert to keggerator)
- Draft Tower w/ Faucets
- Drip Tray
- Kegging System (corny kegs and CO2 w/ accessories)

You can always go cheaper on stuff like using a turkey fryer, etc but you'll come to a point where you want to go bigger and that $25 pot could have gone towards a 15 gallon brew kettle that will cost you around $180-380 if you buy it pre-made.

Get yourself a starter kit for about $100 and a bayou classic pot and burner for $60 (something like this)...
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0000BXHL0/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Less than $200 and you are all set. You can save the other $600 and spend it later down the road once you have got a good grip of the basics and want to do more advanced stuff.

Also just came across this https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f11/did-i-just-score-194927/

seems like a great deal and you could have a very flexible mashtun for very cheap

Do some price comparisons including shipping charges and find the best deal. Welcome aboard.

Try this:
Go to Google.
Type in A Homebrew Supply Store
and click on "I'm feeling lucky".

Forrest

Keep in mind I am pretty inexperienced but after reading these forums and brewing a little(only 2 so far but I have found a couple things to make things will make things easier) I would go with at least

Basic brewing kit

These things, in my opinion, will make brewing easier and more enjoyable
Auto siphon
Star San
Spray bottle(mix a Star San solution with RO or distilled water and put it in here)
Oxiclean Free(as in "no odors" not "no cost")
Wort chiller
Bar Keeper Friend
depending on how you are sanitizing bottles, a bottle tree is pretty nice to have

Since you have the money
Turkey fryer
10+ pot(that way you don't need to buy a new pot when you go to a full boil)

Austinhomebrew said:

Do some price comparisons including shipping charges and find the best deal. Welcome aboard.

Try this:
Go to Google.
Type in A Homebrew Supply Store
and click on "I'm feeling lucky".

Forrest

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Revvy said:

Hmmm....
25 dollar turkey fryer with stock 7.5 gallon pot
50 dollar wort chiller
50 dollar modified 5 gallon cooler
10 dollar bucket fermenter
2 dollar airlock
5 dollar hydrometer
2 dollar thermometer
10 dollar auto siphon
15 dollar bottle of starsan
5 dollar bottle capper
2 dollar 144 caps
2 cases of bottles (you scrounged from the dumpster)
5 dollars rubbermade bin for a swamp cooler/temp control setup (with frozen waterbottles)

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A great shopping list! However, don't just shop at your LHBS or an online store. Check out the DIY section using the search function for some of these, such as the immersion wort chiller. By the way, you'll need some food-safe tubing. Calling some of the online companies (AHS) or your LHBS (Local Home Brew Store) will help you in details.

Revvy said:

KayaBrew said:

Money doesn't make good beer, good technique makes good beer.

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If I had room on my sig, this would go there!

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I'll take this one, if it's OK!

Dave

well, mebbe stupid question, but, considering you were outta game for some time, what do you want to do? All grain, partial mash or just tinker with the cans?

I started with the cans and my first gear set landed for about 40$. Still, really nice beer and lots of fun!

why all the hating for the guy wanting to buy nice stuff? There's no need to buy cheap if you can afford it - just don't expect that it's going to make *better beer* just because it's nicer kit.

And $800 doesn't really buy you stuff that's all that nice, either, if you're also looking to get into kegging.

-find a $100 7 cuft deepfreeze on craigslist
-$80 digital temperature controller
-~$400 4-keg setup with kegs, lines, QD's, CO2 tank, regulators, perlicks, towers and drip trays
-$50 turkey fryer with a 30qt pot
-$50 converted picnic cooler mash tun
-$100 of miscellaneous crap like a refractometer, autosiphon, bench capper, etc.

You're at $800 right there, and it's not exactly the cadillac of brewing systems. Add in a barley crusher, a nice 50' or 100' immersion chiller, and some bottling aids like a bottling tree and a vinator, and you're approaching $1k for some relatively mediocre (but very complete) kit.

I would like to add that the biggest difference in my beer was temperature control. Probably more important than even grain versus extract. That being said, if you have a basement that stays at 65 degrees year round, this will not be as important to you as it was to me.

Revvy said:

Hmmm....
25 dollar turkey fryer with stock 7.5 gallon pot
50 dollar wort chiller
50 dollar modified 5 gallon cooler
10 dollar bucket fermenter
2 dollar airlock
5 dollar hydrometer
2 dollar thermometer
10 dollar auto siphon
15 dollar bottle of starsan
5 dollar bottle capper
2 dollar 144 caps
2 cases of bottles (you scrounged from the dumpster)
5 dollars rubbermade bin for a swamp cooler/temp control setup (with frozen waterbottles)

Sounds like a good markup to me!!!!

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I would have sent at least a 10 gallon pot

I'm so new that each brew so far ( 2 kits and NCbeernut's Deception Stout ) have sent me running here for help / aide and encouragement. That said, I love going to the local brewpubs and pour houses - luckily in NC we seem to be getting more and more - and one thing I hear when I talk beer is " I remember when I started with nothing more than a plastic bucket and a box kit ....

The wheel did not need reinventing once it was made the first time....

cklages said:

I would like to add that the biggest difference in my beer was temperature control. Probably more important than even grain versus extract. That being said, if you have a basement that stays at 65 degrees year round, this will not be as important to you as it was to me.

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This is the right idea. Until you can control fermentation temps and pitch lots yeast, you won't have awesome beer. You'll have good beer.

Buy a temp controller and use it with your fridge as a fermentation chamber. This is way more important than allgrain vs extract, IMO.

Thanks for the replies guys. For those who think I haven't googled this stuff, I have. I've been doing quite a bit of research. I wanted some second opinions to compare to my list.

One of my biggest problems is I don't have a good "LHBS." There's really just nothing around here, so I'm doing this almost entirely online.

Second, my friends are pretty hard core about food. They all make a decent living and are very passionate about anything food/drink. We're going to start roasting coffee soon. We know all of the best restaurants in this area, and we debate about the various nuances of flavors.

The reasons that I mentioned I wanted GOOD beer was for this reason. We're not doing this for kicks and giggles. We want good equipment that will make us good beer. I understand that most of this is technique, but I also don't want to short change us on equipment for what we want to do.

Sounds like I'll be going with my original plan -- two to three Better Bottles, an 8-10 gallon MegaPot, two kegs, two tower faucet taps. We have a deep freezer.

Thanks for all the help. Keep the suggestions coming.

tarentinos said:

We want good equipment that will make us good beer. I understand that most of this is technique, but I also don't want to short change us on equipment for what we want to do.

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The equipment doesn't make the beer, the brewer does. Nice equipment makes your brew day more enjoyable, but that's basically it.

If you enjoy cooking - it's the same sort of deal. If you can't make a killer meal with just some basic, cheap items, then you're not much of a cook. Higher-end kitchenware is great, but it's 99% about making the cook more comfortable and/or productive than it is about making the food better.

There is, of course, a certain cost-of-entry required to make good beer. Without some method of temperature control, for example, you don't have a hope. However, this cost is much much much less than $800.

Like previous people have said, temperature control is a major factor and I see you live in FL. Whether you have a $5500 Brew Magic setup or a $100 stove top setup, if you don't have control of your fermentation temperatures, your beer will not taste good.

The first thing I would suggest is read, read, read. I read "The Complete Joy of Homebrewing," and "Designing Great Beers" before I even touched a brew pot. Those are great books, the latter is a little more advanced. And of course, this forum has been a HUGE help for me, pretty much if you have a question about brewing, there has already been a topic about it or someone around here has the answer. Get the basic process down, and then start brewing. Mistakes will be made, I've made a lot, but you learn from them and become a better brewer. Pretty much any equipment you use will make good beer, as long as you use quality ingredients and know the process.

Wish I had 800 bucks to spend on brew gear!

Seriously though - I would spend $400 bucks and do an all grain set-up on the cheap. Doing some homework and some doing most of it yourself you should have a sick set up for that $. While getting that down and your brewing practice, which will take months, get your kegs going. I think it would take a year or so to be set up like it sounds like you want to be doing it properly. Making tasty brew all along the way..

That said, you can make award winning beer with a $100 or possibly less set-up easily if you know what you are doing..

If you have the time I would consider looking into taking a beer making class. For some, reading only gets you so far. A short class could help you avoid a few simple mistakes and teach you a lot about individual ingredients and their effect on the final product...which when you are starting out can take weeks or months (and gallons of beer) to learn.

Revvy said:

Hmmm....
25 dollar turkey fryer with stock 7.5 gallon pot
50 dollar wort chiller
50 dollar modified 5 gallon cooler
10 dollar bucket fermenter
2 dollar airlock
5 dollar hydrometer
2 dollar thermometer
10 dollar auto siphon
15 dollar bottle of starsan
5 dollar bottle capper
2 dollar 144 caps
2 cases of bottles (you scrounged from the dumpster)
5 dollars rubbermade bin for a swamp cooler/temp control setup (with frozen waterbottles)

Sounds like a good markup to me!!!!

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This with an imersion chiller, and a chest freezer with a temp control for fermenting in. Seriously, thats it. I would brew my first few batches, and see what else from there.

nanofreak said:

This with an imersion chiller, and a chest freezer with a temp control for fermenting in. Seriously, thats it. I would brew my first few batches, and see what else from there.

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He's got a chiller listed on there. I totally disagree with the swamp cooler being enough for accurate temp control.

If I had 800 dollars at the beginning of this journey and someone to tell me how to spend it, I would start with temperature control. You have a freezer, that's great. Get a controller (40-100, depending on what you want.) Then, I'd get a stir plate and an erlenmeyer flask so I could do a yeast starter (50 bucks if you go cheap, which is totally fine.)

I'd get a couple of carboys (40ish each.) Better Bottles and the newer 6 gal PET bottles out there are just fine, too.

I'd get two used kegs, a co2 tank, and a regulator (about 100 for the whole setup used if you can find it.) You can serve from picnic taps for starters (20 bucks.) You need a second fridge at this point, but they're easy to come by.

I'd build a picnic cooler mash tun with a copper manifold (60-80 bucks.)

I'd buy a ten gallon pot with a ball valve, or one that I could install a valve in. The prices can vary, but if you want long term and you still have money, why not get a good one? (We'll go 150 bucks!) You will need a second vessel that can hold hot water for sparging. I'd say a 10 gallon igloo cooler is fine, or a second pot will do. Igloo is a LOT cheaper. 40 bucks.

You have a burner. That's great.

Get a hydrometer or two (20 bucks), a sample tube (3 bucks) a wine thief (10 bucks), some star san for sanitizing (10 bucks), something to stir your mash (I love heavy paddles, so 20 bucks), and it never hurts to have a bucket around for sanitizing things. And a spray bottle. (20 more bucks total.)

That's about 660 dollars.

OH! You need a wort chiller. 60 bucks for that.

720 bucks.

A bottling bucket is about 20 bucks. You can get used bottles and clean them. You'll need a wing capper and some caps. Should be another 20 bucks.

760 dollars. What am I missing? Ingredients for your first batch can be cheap enough that you should be able to get all you need from what I've listed.

I've bought all of this and much more. Can you make good beer for less? Probably. Would I go back to making beer without a freezer, a good way to make starters, and kegs? No, I would not. If you're passionate about the project, and you see yourself going at it full bore, that's my list. If you have 800 bucks to blow, that's rad and I think you should. Go economy! My next big purchase will hopefully be a triple wide fridge/freezer for fermenting, so it isn't always cheap and there's always more you can do.

I just wouldn't make beer with less than I've stated above knowing the quality I can achieve now.

Of course, I'm obsessive and I will talk to you for days on end about process and everything I do if you'll let me. My picnic cooler mash tun looks like a pile of ****, and I will continue to use it until it somehow breaks, but the things I put in it and get out of it are all dependent on my knowledge of what to do and when. The most important thing to remember is to have fun. That's what it should be all about.

lots of good suggestions here. if you feel your going to stick with brewing you might want to jump right in with a sizeable kettle. after my first coopers can kit my freinds and I got a 15g kettle for 10+g batches. that was only about 4 or 5 batches ago, our 25g kettle was just delivered yesterday a few freinds can go through a 20g batch fairly quick. but as already stated its not the equipment that makes good beer...

Agree to all of the above. I brewed my first batch recently, using a ~$100 starter kit from LHBS, plus $40 of doodads I felt I needed to make the process actually work, such as a hydrometer jar, long-handled paddle, etc. So $140 for a 5-gallon batch, and that includes the initial ingredients.

I soon decided this home brewing thing was for me, and that I wanted to do full boil for my next batch. So while this first one was fermenting I ordered a Bayou Classic burner + 9 gallon kettle, and a wort chiller: totaling another $150.

Hopefully that's it for a while, investment-wise, as I explained to SWMBO: "for the next year at least, I buy no beer, only ingredients"

superjunior said:

lots of good suggestions here. if you feel your going to stick with brewing you might want to jump right in with a sizeable kettle. after my first coopers can kit my freinds and I got a 15g kettle for 10+g batches. that was only about 4 or 5 batches ago, our 25g kettle was just delivered yesterday a few freinds can go through a 20g batch fairly quick. but as already stated its not the equipment that makes good beer...

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Yeah I think this should be stressed more. Especially if you are going to be sharing every batch with a bunch of buddies, there will come a time you want to brew a 10 gallon batch. Or maybe you want to split the batch and do half on oak chips or with 2 different yeasts or different dry hopping regimens. Since you have money to spend, a 10 gallon system up front is a good idea. 25 gallons seems nuts to me, but maybe some day...

If you can find someone selling keg shells, those are awesome for converting into 15 gallons kettles. I'm in the same city as New Belgium and they periodically kick out "bad" kegs that won't hold pressure or whatever to the homebrew club. Then you just need someone with metalworking tools to cut a hole in the top and drill a hole for the ball valve and you're golden. And it will cost closer to $50 than $350. Just make sure the keg you're getting is not stolen!

I kind of went the other way as far as starting slow and inexpensive...I have spent over $1k. I planned it so I can stay at this level for a bit without the immediate need for upgrading/sizing. I got 3 cornies, gas bottle, mainfold, gauges, tubing, a couple 6.5 gallon glass carboys, couple buckets, 15gal. kettles, cooker, immersion chiller, aeration stone and regulator etc....everything I need to get going. Even have a couple pounds of hops in my freezer already..BUT I have yet to brew a drop as I am at sea for another month. There is a ton of good info. here and I am sure the OP will have no problem spending his $$ wisely.

Docjowles said:

25 gallons seems nuts to me, but maybe some day

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I thought the same thing just a few short months ago :cross:

Yeah I brew in a small apartment on my stovetop with the least amount of equipment you can pretty much get away with, and my beer still comes out great. the only expensive thing I really splurged on was my kegerator that I built