Question: Yeast Nutrient Substitute

I've been making some ciders/applewines over the past month and having a blast! I want to start doing a little more experimentation but I live in a part of the world where there are no brew stores or supplies (except lots of great juices). I know that some fruit juices are a more hostile environment for yeast and that yeast nutrient can help them.

I've read about people using raisins as a yeast nutrient. Is this actually helpful? If so, do they need to be prepared in some way, like boiled and mashed? How much for a 5 liter batch?

Alternately, what exactly is store bought yeast nutrient? Maybe I can get some through my company's "science" department.

Thanks in advance for the replies!

Do what you can to get yeast nutrient. A tiny vial will last you a long time. That said, much of yeast nutrient is just...dead yeast. Gross right? You could always hydrate a yeast packet in a very small amount of water, cook it dead, and then use that as nutrient.

Otherwise, you might want to write to White Labs to ask what they put in theirs. Zinc and phosphorous also play an important role.

From Keller's site:

"Yeast Nutrient Substitute


We recently moved to Africa and I...forgot to bring yeast nutrient.
Do you know any good substitutes? Shannon and Jenny Burke, Thies, Senegal


There are numerous authorities that cite different ingredients and proportions. Proprietary yeast nutrients usually contain DAP (diammonium phosphate), which supplies nitrogen and phosphorus; urea, which supplies nitrogen; citric (and perhaps other) acid; trace amounts of biotin; and yeast hulls. The formulations of these nutrients are not generally public knowledge.

Less secret are the formulations of yesteryear. Pre-World War II recipes used malt extract and lemon juice as nutrient, while many post-war recipes used to use ammonium sulphate, magnesium sulphate, potassium phosphate, and citric acid for yeast nutrient. Both, I am told, worked well enough, but not as well as today's formulations. I would suspect that it would be easier to order a packaged nutrient from an out-of-country supplier and pay shipping than to find DAP and the other constituents locally and experiment with proportions. Still, a chemist (druggist) might be able to mix the following nutrient for you without problem:

ammonium sulphate...........130 grains
magnesium sulphate........... 20 grains
potassium phosphate.......... 70 grains
citric acid ...........................260 grains
This makes an ounce of nutrient, enough to make four gallons of non-grape wine or two gallons of mead. While not as good as commercial formulations, it still should work well enough. The absolute against-the-wall substitute is malt extract and citric acid (lemon juice) mixed half-and-half."


At the very least, you could pick up a packet of bread yeast & boil it to kill it & add that to your must as a makeshift yeast nutrient, and a pinch of epsom salts will help too.
Hope that helps. Regards, GF.

Awesome info guys. Thanks a lot. I'll be sure to pick up a vial when I'm in the States this summer, but until then the dead yeast and epsom salts sounds like a good substitute.

Cheers

You said that you lived in a part of the world where there are no brew stores or supplies, I am now also living in a part of the world where I can find nothing.
How did you find brewer's yeast? Did you use another type of yeast as substitute? Or did you culture some years from the bottled conditioned beer?
Please help.
Thank you.

fengjinliew said:

You said that you lived in a part of the world where there are no brew stores or supplies, I am now also living in a part of the world where I can find nothing.
How did you find brewer's yeast? Did you use another type of yeast as substitute? Or did you culture some years from the bottled conditioned beer?
Please help.
Thank you.

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Are you in a part of the world where you can order and have things shipped to you? If so, you can find all of the stuff you need at online brew shops and amazon.

Regular Baker's yeast boiled in water for 10 minutes will do wonders, I also suggest Organic Raisins. I added 1 oz raisins (chopped and steeped in water) into one gallon of juice, and the difference in fermentation speed between just yeast and yeast with raisins was obvious. There is no noticeable difference in flavor at that ratio, but I did it just for a taste test.

Brancaster, I can get order and have things shipped over but I am trying to cut cost and looking for an alternative way if possible. Any suggestions or advice where I could get my yeast from?
MindenMan, thank you. I read about that and I am going to try using that. I just need to get the yeast first.
By the way, I just got this nutritional form brewer yeast that is deactivated. Is there a possible to make the yeast alive again for brewing? Any response is much appreciated. Thank you.

fengjinliew said:

Brancaster, I can get order and have things shipped over but I am trying to cut cost and looking for an alternative way if possible. Any suggestions or advice where I could get my yeast from?
MindenMan, thank you. I read about that and I am going to try using that. I just need to get the yeast first.
By the way, I just got this nutritional form brewer yeast that is deactivated. Is there a possible to make the yeast alive again for brewing? Any response is much appreciated. Thank you.

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There are some recipes in which you can effectively use bread yeast, like JOAM; but for the most part, ale or wine yeast is far superior. Depending on where you are, you might have some viable alternatives. Some fruits have yeast growing on them already, grapes & apples are 2 examples & this yeast was originally how the fruit/juice was fermented. You could also try to harvest & culture yeast from a bottle of beer; it's been done before. If there's a brewery or winery nearby, you might ask them for a vial of yeast.
What part of the world are you in?
Regards, GF.

fengjinliew said:

Brancaster, I can get order and have things shipped over but I am trying to cut cost and looking for an alternative way if possible. Any suggestions or advice where I could get my yeast from?
MindenMan, thank you. I read about that and I am going to try using that. I just need to get the yeast first.
By the way, I just got this nutritional form brewer yeast that is deactivated. Is there a possible to make the yeast alive again for brewing? Any response is much appreciated. Thank you.

Click to expand...

I'm a little confused. Your original post asks about yeast nutrient, but here you're asking about live yeast.

Depending on where you're located in the world, you should be able to get a 2oz bottle of dry yeast nutrient shipped to you via amazon for about $6 + ($4-$7) shipping depending on where you're located. 2oz should last you quite a while, but you can choose larger quantities.

Now if you're looking for actual yeast, I'm not entirely sure on shipping or where to find exactly what you're looking for. Amazon sells and ships all kinds of yeast, but where you're located will determine if you can get it or not. Good news is, if you can get it shipped to you, it doesn't weigh much...so you can order in bulk for the same shipping price and not have to worry about it for a while.

According to this post cider is better without any nutrient:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=518060

I just started a nutrient free batch myself but it is too early to tell how it will turn out.

jsiddall said:

According to this post cider is better without any nutrient:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=518060

I just started a nutrient free batch myself but it is too early to tell how it will turn out.

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I think that all depends on how you like your cider to taste.

I'm doing a few batches myself for experimentation. One of those test batches is going to be a gallon with nutrient and one without.

brancaster said:

I'm a little confused. Your original post asks about yeast nutrient, but here you're asking about live yeast.

Depending on where you're located in the world, you should be able to get a 2oz bottle of dry yeast nutrient shipped to you via amazon for about $6 + ($4-$7) shipping depending on where you're located. 2oz should last you quite a while, but you can choose larger quantities.

Now if you're looking for actual yeast, I'm not entirely sure on shipping or where to find exactly what you're looking for. Amazon sells and ships all kinds of yeast, but where you're located will determine if you can get it or not. Good news is, if you can get it shipped to you, it doesn't weigh much...so you can order in bulk for the same shipping price and not have to worry about it for a while.

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Sorry for confusing you. I was asking about both yeast nutrient and yeast.
I will try to look it up on amazon or brewer supplies in another country.

fengjinliew said:

Sorry for confusing you. I was asking about both yeast nutrient and yeast.
I will try to look it up on amazon or brewer supplies in another country.

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Let me know what you find out. I'm curious about it as well.

Dead, boiled baker's yeast works as a great nutrient; I have used it both beer and cider with noticeably positive results.