Way, way, way over the top Sam Adams Utopia clone - #2

soo when are you massholes brewing this up? i'm using essentially your recipe for this on the 11th of jan. i made the mistake of bringing this thread up at a local HB gathering and they jumped on it so were running it but only a 5g size run. really its shooting for more like 7g into fermentors but hoping for 5g in bottles.

We are looking at the last two weekends in January.

Make sure you use the High Gravity yeast with a BIG starter (not high ABV, just another 5 gallon batch) also when mashing make sure you use lots of rice hulls!!!!

Also add the maple syrup twice about 2 weeks in and 4 weeks in stirring up the batch every 5-7 days for the first 3-4 weeks

FYI: I was at the Sam Adams brewery today and did a bit of research on Utopias. The recipe is similar but we are missing the Munich and are using 6row therefore we are substituting Munich for the 6 row since we have plenty of rice hulls.

So whats the final recipe (for now)
i am working on getting my self ready for a 17 lbs of grain for 2.5 gallons brew its gonna be great!!!!

FINAL RECIPE!!!

Utopias #2 Clone
23-A Specialty Beer
Author: PTN and Yeager1977
Date: 1/10/09

Size: 14.0 gal
Efficiency: 67.0%
Attenuation: 87.5%
Calories: 667.23 kcal per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.197 (1.026 - 1.120)
Terminal Gravity: 1.025 (0.995 - 1.035)
Color: 21.58 (1.0 - 50.0)
Alcohol: 23.72% (2.5% - 14.5%)
Bitterness: 58.9 (0.0 - 100.0)

Ingredients:
70.0 lb English 2-row Pale
23.0 lb Munich Malt
3.5 lb 2-Row Caramel Malt 60L
3.5 lb Toasted Pale Malt
2.0 lb Melanoidin Malt
4.5 lb Munich 10L Malt
6.0 lb German Smoked
4 lb Maple Syrup
4.0 oz Spalt Spalter (4.8%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
4.0 oz Tettnanger (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60 min
3.0 oz Hallertau (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 15 min
3.0 oz Hallertau Mittelfruh (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 1 min
4.0 ea White Labs WLP099 Super High Gravity Ale

this may be a stupid question but is there an extract version? if so, would anybody take the time to convert it?

Don't know if you would want to do an extract of this, but if you did you would need munich, and smoked malt still, and they woul dhave to be steeped a good long time.

yeager1977 said:

Don't know if you would want to do an extract of this, but if you did you would need munich, and smoked malt still, and they woul dhave to be steeped a good long time.

Click to expand...

Or a huge partial mash. The munich and pale could both go to LME and the rest be rolled into a massive partial.

A quick google found northern brewer to have munich LME as far as the smoked malt and other grains if you arent trying to do a full 14 gallon version, i would use the biggest kitchen pot you have mash it in the oven for an hour than use a funnel with a screen or folding colander and rinse some water over it into the brew kettle going to get 40-50 eff from that but would get some of the required complexity

well i think im in over my head... i have only done 4 extract recipes so I dont think i can handle this. didnt realize how difficult it would be...

don't let the size of the grain bill and the extra crap needed scare you out of attempting this man! of the group i'm doing this with i'm the only one with any experience in AG and as such will be watching over 2 different tuns and probably 2 kettles, doing a partigyle smoked ipa with the leavings.

well i never did a partial mash. i just figured i could get enough dme and lme to do a 5 gallon extract batch with about 20%

Ara,
I feel like I'm kicking the puppy here and I don't want you to take this the wrong way but if you've only done 4 brews so far you would honestly be throwing your money away attempting to brew this beer. It would be the brewing equivalent of painting the Sistine Chapel with Crayola Crayons. It might be beer but it wouldn't be good. Learn the fundamentals of brewing before you pick up 500 gallons of paint and spend a few years on your back. Between Yeager and myself we had around 30+ years of experience when we did version #1 last year and we were a bit intimidated by the technical challenges.

But hell, it's only money and I'm a huge believer in giving new experiences your best shot and let the devil take the hindmost. If you can afford it and go into it with the attitude, "I'm going to try this, it's going to be a couple of hundred dollars worth of education and the worst that can happen is I'll learn a few things," then give it a try. Good luck and I'd be glad to try a glass of your beer when it's done.

PTN

Yelp Yelp (puppy runs to other side of the room and lays down) i am fully expecting that this will be by far my most epic brew (have one brew a week since SWMBO got me a starter kit for xmas last year 47 AG batches) scaling it down to 2.5 gallons im only out 50 bucks if it hits the fan.

What brew are you guys doing for the starter beer?

Wel I am doing a 10 gal AG brown ale. 25 lbs of 2row (Brewing it tomorrow with PTN, and had to beg him to bring me 10lbs of grain as I thought I had 25, but 10 of it is wheat...) 4 ounces roasted barley, 4 ounces chocolate malt, 1lb 60 crystal 3 ounces of Hallertau for 60min and 2 ounces of cascade for 10 min

Here is the starter modified to fit style and a decent efficiency. THis is what I am brewing tomorrow.
4M Brown Take 2
11-C Northern English Brown Ale
Author: Yeager1977
Date: 12/22/09

Size: 10.0 gal
Efficiency: 70.0%
Attenuation: 80.0%
Calories: 167.3 kcal per 12.0 fl oz

Original Gravity: 1.051 (1.040 - 1.052)
Terminal Gravity: 1.010 (1.008 - 1.013)
Color: 18.48 (12.0 - 22.0)
Alcohol: 5.32% (4.2% - 5.4%)
Bitterness: 25.1 (20.0 - 30.0)

Ingredients:
1.0 lb American Caramel 60°L
.25 lb Chocolate Malt
.25 lb Roasted Barley
20 lb American 2-row
0 lb English 2-row Pale
2.0 oz Hallertau (4.5%) - added during boil, boiled 60.0 min
2.0 oz Cascade (5.5%) - added during boil, boiled 10.0 min
4.0 ea White Labs WLP099 Super High Gravity Ale

Schedule:
Ambient Air: 70.0 °F
Source Water: 60.0 °F
Elevation: 0.0 m


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Paul, Thank you... thats exactly the answer i needed. i'd be in over my head (as i basically believed from the start) so thank you for being honest. down the road, this will be on my to do list.. but not now. thanks and good luck

paulthenurse said:

. It would be the brewing equivalent of painting the Sistine Chapel
PTN

Click to expand...

Oh.. my.. flucking... God.

So now you're the f'in Michelangelo of brewing!?!?!?

Ara... You can brew this beer. Anyone can brew this beer. The point that Paul didn't really make because he's a freakin' Neanderthal is that it takes years of experience to taste it and tweak it along the way between the boil kettle and the absolute final product. With a specialty beer on this level, you will need to make adjustments on the fly during fermentation to get exact flavors you want... as excruciatingly painful as it is to admit, it's something Paul is pretty decent at. Also, you would need to really know what you're doing with yeasts in order to get this beer to finish at the ABV level they're shooting for.

But... make no mistake... we're not talking about freakin' Michelanglo and at the end of the day, it is grain, hops, water and yeast.

IF you made it would it come out "as good" (which is 100% subjective) as what these guys have done?? Who knows? Probably not since they have a lot of experience behind it but there was a beer that won Best Of Show last year for one of the largest brew competitions in Massachusetts... it was a stout extract batch from a guy who had made exactly one beer prior to that.

It might not have the right "oak overtones" or blah blah blah... but it'll be beer and as Paul tried to say in his own neanderthal way... if you want to spend a few bucks on a big grain/extract bill... the experience of trying to do it might be worth it.

Best case scenario, you've made a pretty damn nice huge beer... worst case scenario, you've made a crappy beer but have learned a ton wiuth the questions you might have along the way and asked this forum.


...f'in "sistine chapel"... pa-lease

If there is ANYONE out there who can draw I'll send you a bottle of the Utopia if you can draw a picture of Michelangelo as a Neanderthal. Use your imagination and creativity. Think 'avatar' as you draw. Think PTN - Michelangelo - Neanderthal. It should be easy. My knuckles drag on the ground. Children and n00b's run screaming in the opposite direction when I walk down the street. I was born with a mash paddle in my hand, except I'm a cheap yankee bastard and I wouldn't be caught dead spending a lot of money on a fancy pants mash paddle. How about Me/Mike/TheGiecoNeanderthalGuy climbing up some staging with some paintbrushes in my back pocket to brew? Maybe a bag of pork rinds?

PTN

FWIW, I wasn't all that impressed with the Sistine Chapel either. 500 people packed nuts to butts staring up. I'd have done it differently, I'd have had more naked woman and not as many saints. The saints were a wicked drag and what naked woman there were looked like they could kick an NFL linebackers ass.

How was the Mona Lisa?

Small and far away. There was a lovely naked lady on the wall to her left, however with a great rack, so it sort of made up for it.

By the time Yeager got his **** together yesterday I just needed to head for home, that's why I didn't come by. I am making a Turducken today and I had a bunch of prep work to do. I figured you would be guarding the Duchess with a blunderbuss anyways.

PTN

Not defending her at all... hey... the club chipped in to help pay for those kegs so everyone's dues give them a small share of those kegs.

Oh... wait....

Ya, ya, ya. Shut up.

PTN

Do you guys have the brownin the fermenter yet? I have the yeast spinning stepped it up to 250 ml this morning (from a slant 10ml than 50ml) gonna go to a L on sunday ready to pitch into the brown on tuesday.

Yup Its in the fermenter 10 gallons at 1053 with 1/2 gallon starter off of 2 vials and a pound of liquid extract. Bubbling like a banshee

Ok so a date has been finalized! Jan 23rd. I will be starting heating up water around 8am. As time gets closer I will ask to see whose coming so we can plan food accordingly!

Maybe I should bring Bertha over? (insert maniacal cackle here) I bet LeeAnne would LOVE that!

PTN

haha ill post a pic of my smoker and its trailer! got my brown in the fermenter today

Version #2 will be brewed on Saturday, January 23 at Yeager's house in Norton Mass. Be there or wish you were!

PM either Yeager or myself for directions, especially if you are a maniacal axe murderer. Yeager LOVES to have unusual, interesting people over. Bring your axe and hang around after the rest of us leave. Believe me, everyone who knows and loves Chris will be more than willing to dig deep and post bail.

PTN

I'll make some calls....

our sw mich version is slated for mash-in @9am on jan 9th, 2010.

Are you doing this recipe in half?

I think I'm going to attempt this, but only next time I make a grain order and at 2.5 gallons. I'm going to primary ferment with Nottingham and then use Wyeast 4347. Have you guys considered using 4347 to finish as it has more alcohol tolerance than any other yeast I've found.

Actually, the WhiteLabs 099 has a tolerance of about 25%. I suggest going straight with that, otherwise you won't reach the ABV and it will completely sweet... Also last year we died out for a little while around 16% then we added champagne yeast and rekicked in the 099 and the champagne yeast and that got us to 23%

You're right...d'oh!

Notty wouldn't even begin to get this off the ground. Stick with what worked.

PTN

yeager1977 said:

Are you doing this recipe in half?

Click to expand...

yeah shooting to get 6g+ into fermentor.

had an interesting discussion with the head brewer at arcadia ales centering on which yeast would ferment the best for this. his opinion is that starting with anything other than wlp 099 would be a hard sell for the yeast to do much with that massive amount of sugar.

My head hurts........

yeager1977 said:

My head hurts........

Click to expand...

There is an old saying about New Years Eve being amateur hour. Certainly seems to be the case here.

PTN