EarthBound
Well-Known Member
I just wanted to say that I think what you are doing is absolutely amazing/incredible/inspiring.
Agreed!
I just wanted to say that I think what you are doing is absolutely amazing/incredible/inspiring.
audger said:to all of those people brewing in used stainless barrels commercially (not just private home brew)- how are you getting around the fact that reconditioned/used barrels are NOT FDA approved for food use?
is there a recertification process of some sort? or do inspectors just not check for this? or...?
i ask because my friends have been talking about starting a nano, and i was looking at using these barrels up until i noticed they arent approved for food use. CT state health department confirmed that used barrels are no good to brew in (commercially).
to all of those people brewing in used stainless barrels commercially (not just private home brew)- how are you getting around the fact that reconditioned/used barrels are NOT FDA approved for food use?
is there a recertification process of some sort? or do inspectors just not check for this? or...?
i ask because my friends have been talking about starting a nano, and i was looking at using these barrels up until i noticed they arent approved for food use. CT state health department confirmed that used barrels are no good to brew in (commercially).
That being said I don't think the typical inspector would know if the drums were used or not. Who is to say where that scratch came from.
Agreed!
I completely agree. Most inspectors look at the big picture, who you are, what you know, do you appear to have your act together,and sign off without digging. But there's a small percentage (usually the ones who DON'T understand the industry, or are just plain an*l) that dig, dig, dig and nitpick until they find *something* wrong, saying "it's my JOB to find something wrong." In this case, demanding "brewing system FDA/ANSI certification" documentation.
These are the ones that will shut you down for using unapproved equipment. Only the person building and operating the system can decide if it's worth that risk....
Ok I'm gonna talk about the elephant in the room. You say that you are only gonna be in this system for the short term. I'm in a similar situation. Can u make enough money at a 1.5 bbl
to get you into a bigger system? Right now I'm trying to decide if I want to go nano with the knowledge that I'll go bigger in the near future, or do I save the money on a small system, brew on my home rig and use that system to lure investors to dive all in with a 10 a 20 bbl system.
The more
I think about it, the more I'm having trouble justifying spending the money on a system that I'll outgrow in short time. Have you thought about the same?
This thread just kills it!!
Well done sir!!
Cheers
Jay
Total: 42,175.00
Next cost of production and profit on a per sixtel basis with GA distribution system for two base beers:
Blonde Ale 40 gallons
Total: $152.45
Cost/sixer: $19.06
Pale Ale 40 gallons
Total: $171.12
Cost/sixer: $21.39
Wholesale cost of 1/6 barrel $60.00
30% gross distributor fee: $18.00
Net to Brewery $42.00
Net Profit Pale Ale $20.61
Net Profit Blonde Ale $22.94
Lets round this profit down to $20/sixer net profit
At full capacity of 128 sixers per month, that is a gross profit of $2560/month before expenses.
Having to go thru a distributor kills all the profit compared to your business model
If i'm missing something, please let me know. BTW Cruelkix, I didn't mean to hijack the your thread. You really are helping me figure this out
Kinda
All you guys that started with 55 gallon drum systems or the 1.5 BBl systems.
If you did it all over again would you go bigger if you could have? Do you wish you held off, stacked a few more bucks away and went for the 2 or 3 BBL?
As I read this thread and get caught up in it. I wonder if just stepping up to that next level would be a better option. If it was feasible....Just pondering.....
Cheers
Jay
Cruelkix - I was just looking at your costs and was wondering if you had considered the items below. I know you had the Miscellaneous 500 so maybe its covered there...
What will you serve your beer in? If glass you will need to clean them, if plastic you will need to purchase cups. Factor in that glassware will be broken and maybe stolen.
Yeah, there is definitely a little bit of cost associated with this, but the majority of it is in upfront costs for glassware and sinks and such, which I have capture in start up costs. Replacement of broken glass and cleaning solutions will be the continued cost and should be relatively minor, but good catch
Are you the only employee? What if you're unable to work at times? Will you have a bartender? A janitor to clean the facilities? Floors, windows, wipe tables, clean bathrooms? What happens when someone spills?
I will initially be the only employee. My first hire will be a bartender, followed VERY shortly after by a cleaning crew, then long term a head brewmaster. Anybody spills and its my problem. State law makes you have a mop sink.
Are you going to have TVs? Do you need to pay cable/satellite service?
Initially I wasn't going to start with TV's, however, the place I'm looking at right now is very close to the football stadium, so that may change very quickly. I have some money in the RENT/Utilities for internet/cable. Internet is a must have of course.
Will you do growler fills? Those will need to be billed at a separate rate.
Good call on this one. I will be filling growlers, and yes they will be at a discounted rate ( a little, but not much). I'll have to think about how to incorporate this considering I have no idea how many it will be. I could do a percentage of pint sales I suppose.
How often do you think you'll lose a batch?
This is a good question. I have been very lucky in my brewing *knocksonwood* and hopefully I will lose maybe 1 or 2 a year, however, considering how many experimental beers I am making there is a good chance some will be straight up horrible and I'll have to dump it. Not sure on this one.Another good catch.
If you change the price of your beer will your demand/volume change? Will you have a happy hour or any other promotions?
No happy hour to start. Most people coming into a small micro brewery are not there for cheap beer. I don't think $4 vs $5 vs $6 will make to much of a difference. Dry Dock is packed with people all day everyday and a lot of there pints are like $6-$8 for high ABV stuff/special stuff.
While working in MI. for a number of months in 2010/2011 I got to experience a start up brewery get off the ground.
They took a page or two from Sam's book "Brewing Up Business". Their model seemed very similar and they started on a Sabco system brewing three brews a day 6 days a week. Now that is dedication in my book.
In the last year and a half they have made three expansions, both in the brewery and the tasting room/bar. A coworker who lives in the area and now frequents the brewery informed me they are looking for space for a production facility.
I have a suggestion in addition to a "happy hour" or growler fills that worked well for the brewery above. A mug/glass club where the club member pays say $25-$50 for their own beer vessel. What they get in return is up to you, reduced cost of a pint, members only happy hour, invitations to members only new release party's. You get the idea. This will get you some regulars who can produce a repeating monthly revenue that helps you plan for you future investments while also providing you with a group for marketing studies.
I have seen this model produce favorable results in a number of establishments. Good luck.
I seem to recall hearing something to the 10-15% range. Its not hard in CO to evaporate quickly if need be.
I'm not sure the heating elements will be on tri clover. But they will have easy disconnects from the panel. I've only seen one person that makes a tri clover to 1" pipe thread and thats Derrin and they are $70 a piece. With 6 elements ...... no thanks. I'll probably just punch holes in teh sides of the kettles like I did on my current rig. Use the gasket and a 1" SS nut. I'd rather CIP it if I can.
For chilling I think I will need a plate chiller or a CFC. I currently no chill. So it will be a switch for me. No chill will not be possible with Plastic fermenters and 35 gallons per batch. It will take days to get down to temp. If I go Plate, hops will be an issue to resolve. CFC might be the better route.
I dont seperate the hops from the wort currently. I just try my best to keep as much as possible out of the fermenter, but I don't think that will be a big deal when I get the conicals. It will settle out and I can just dump the trub. I'll get it figured out. I was thinking of using whole leaf and a big ass hop spider? Or using pellet and dealing with it being in my fermenter like I do now. My Brewery is called "High Gravity Brewing, Inc.". Hops aren't usually a problem and I've never detected any off flavors in my big bold ales.
But its stuff like this that makes test batches a necessity. I'll have 3 months of beer I can't sell....... I'm going to have to have lots of parties.
You put 100% of the hop matter into the fermenter?
Update for people that think this thread has died .... I hate real estate. I'm still hunting .....
http://denver.craigslist.org/bfs/3047169130.html
just ran across this, if it works out do i get free beer as a finders fee???
Dude that is pretty awesome. You should jump on that!!! I actually may have found a place last night. I was at the city getting permits for the property this morning. So far zoning is good with it .... I have a long way to go.
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