Yeast Starters....Just starting and ordered some things

[fendersrule]

1.004. Fermentation happened enough.
Taste like flat clean beer.
I decanted it down to 500-600 ML

swirled it. It’s inside warming up.

 

[fendersrule]

Nailed everything.

 

[A1sportsdad]

I let my starter go on a stir plate for about 36 hours then move the flask into the fridge to let it cool and separate. Then I decant off most of the wort on top of the yeast, swirl it up and pitch it. Don’t have to let it warm up. Once it warms up in the fermenter it will go to work. Starters work great. I do them for all my beers now.​

 

[fendersrule]

Wow. 9AM, or 16 hours after pitching. Usually I see obvious signs o fermentation, but seeing a full roll at this point is awesome.

It probably was full rolling way before 16 hours too.

 

[IslandLizard]

Wow. 9AM, or 16 hours after pitching. Usually I see obvious signs o fermentation, but seeing a full roll at this point is awesome.

It probably was full rolling way before 16 hours too.

A fresh starter like that can give you lift off in less than 4 hours.

A few observations:

• What temp is this fermenting at? Are you controlling those temps somehow, with a water jacket, ice packs?
• That's a very full fermenter!
• If you can, place that blow off container much lower, in case you experience suck back at some point later when activity slows.
• Don't stick that blow off tube too deep in there either, and keep the sanitizer amount at a bare minimum, just enough to do the job. What's in there now is probably more than you'd need.

 

[IslandLizard]

1.004. Fermentation happened enough.
Taste like flat clean beer.

View attachment 706746

Looking good!
1.004, yup, it was done!

Thank you for going the extra mile for science, and providing peace of mind (at least here).

 

[fendersrule]

Reply below!

A few observations:

• What temp is this fermenting at? Are you controlling those temps somehow, with a water jacket, ice packs?
  • 64-66F is what I plan to keep 1098 at. I fill the kettle with about 5G of water and I use large ice packs to control.
• That's a very full fermenter!
  • Yep! I need to -.1G off of my recipe. I'm comfortable however with the full level due to temperature control and adequate blow off space.
• If you can, place that blow off container much lower, in case you experience suck back at some point later when activity slows.
  • Agreed. I typically keep the level of the sanitizer lower than the level of the beer. Suck-back with a large hose like that is highly unlikely though. Correct me if I'm wrong...I worry more about this using 1/4" blow off tubing.
• Don't stick that blow off tube too deep in there either, and keep the sanitizer amount at a bare minimum, just enough to do the job. What's in there now is probably more than you'd need.
  • I typically fill the sanitizer lever as minimum as possible to where the hose tip is fully submerged. A lot of this is determined by the stiffness of the hose. The hose was really stiff last night because of the cold weather (I brew outside) and a very cold StarSan tub. Now that the hose is more pliable, I drained some of that liquid that you see. I passed out pretty early last night!

 

[IslandLizard]

Correct me if I'm wrong...I worry more about this using 1/4" blow off tubing.

1/4" ID is not blow off tubing.
But 1/2" ID could be. And you're right, suck back is more likely with thinner hoses. It's all about the (displaceable) volume.

 

[fendersrule]

For some reason, I cannot make Amber ales for the life of me. I've been told that I make stellar sours, IPAs, Pale Ales, Hefes, and Stouts.

But for ambers, I just suck. Hopefully the yeast starter is what was needed to finally make them "good". I'm hoping this one has good body and a nice bready finish, like Mac and Jacks!

This Amber is dry hopped with 1Oz of citra. I'm going to begin dry hopping now for all beers going forward when I replace the blow-off tube with a burper--probably in a bout 2-3 more days or when fermentation has obviously slowed down.

Since it's winter, I may even consider storing this thing in the garage a couple days before bottling....wouldn't hurt right? Wouldn't necessarily buy me anything though.

 

[VikeMan]

Since it's winter, I may even consider storing this thing in the garage a couple days before bottling....wouldn't hurt right? Wouldn't necessarily buy me anything though.

If your garage is colder than wherever you are fermenting, I wouldn't recommend it, unless you have a way to prevent air from being sucked into the fermenter.

 

[kmarkstevens]

IslandLizard, having trouble quoting today. Will cold crash my next starter and then test the FG. Hadn't thought of that before but makes great sense to confirm the ferment is completed.

 

[fendersrule]

Y’all like my new 3L flask?

just made 2L of DME and added the slurry from the 1L jar.

boil off rate was more than 200ML so I’ll remember that for next time. Added some spring water to compensate and put it right at 1.034.

I can see that 3L is going to be a perfect size for bigger beers.

it already started to ferment after a few minutes. Expect this to be a rocket.

 

[deuc224]

I have a 2L, 3L and 5L flask and to make my yeast vials i use the 2L then move to 3L. Honestly be careful because that starter will creep out the top of it. Happened with a WLP 001 and Wyeast 3068, then ran wild, i have a Osphaug going right now in a 3L that ill move to a separatory flask tonight and let it crash, then fill the vials to 25ml of yeast and 25ml of glycerin mix and freeze. Then ill have 100million yeast cells ready for brew days.

 

[VikeMan]

Then ill have 100million yeast cells ready for brew days.

100 Billion, perhaps?

 

[fendersrule]

Seems like 100 Billion is a little low for most beers? That's basically a fresh liquid pack.

Seems like I'd want to be storing 200 Billion cells for most pitches...

 

[fendersrule]

Here is my 2-step starter that should have a minimum of 510 billion cells.

This is after 8 hours in the fridge. Letting it go over night, and through the next-mid day.

 

[fendersrule]

@IslandLizard

For science, that 1L+2L starter was on the stir plate (at the second step) for 36 hours.

In the fridge for nearly 48 hours.

1.006 gravity.

It tasted pretty good, actually. Had a great bread-english bite to it.

 

[TennBrewer]

I always build a 1 to 2 liter starter from liquid yeast depending on my batch size. Lately, I have been considering using the canned wort, not to make the initial starter but to activate the decanted yeast from the starter and pitch it all into the fermenter. First, I would make a starter, as usual, with DME and let it ferment until finished. Then, let it sit at least overnight in the fridge (at 40 degrees). The night before I plan to brew, take out the starter yeast, let it warm up close to room temperature and decant it. Take a can of wort and make up a 1 liter starter and pitch the decanted yeast into it and leave it on the stir plate until the next day. I think the yeast should be pretty active the next day and I will pitch the whole thing into the just-brewed batch chilled and transferred to the fermenter. My goal here is to pitch yeast which is already actively fermenting and hope it carries on in the fermenter with little to no lag time. BTW, I usually sterilize the flasks and glass jars in the oven at 350 degrees for 1 hour. They have aluminum foil caps and remain relatively sterile until I use them, cooled down of course. I've been doing this for awhile now and have not had any issues with sanitation.

 

[studmonk3y]

Part of the fun of this hobby for me is the DIY aspect. So I built my own stirplate a few times over the past decade or so. My latest and greatest version uses an AC shaded pole fan motor, some big rare earth magnets and a ssd fan speed controller. I even made it so I can daisy chain other stir plates to control from the same speed controller. I don't bother boiling directly in the flask, so I use a 2.5 gallon glass cookie jar. Even with a slightly domed bottom, the strong magnets have no trouble holding on to the stir bar. I think that is key. Just this past weekend I built up an 8L starter over multiple steps for pitching into 6 gallons of 1.080 OG Doppelbock I brewed.

Showing stirplate and jar.

pulling a huge vortex in 2.5 gal of water.

 

[fendersrule]

I have a science question.

We all know, or have been told, that dry yeast does not need starters. I agree 100%.

But let's say, I'm brewing 15 gallons of something (group brew). It would have to suck to buy 4-5 packets of yeast.

Can't I just make a US-05 starter to save some costs?

 

[VikeMan]

Can't I just make a US-05 starter to save some costs?

Yes, you can. But you may find it's not all that much cheaper once you factor in DME (and energy) costs.

 

[fendersrule]

Easier to just buy 5 packets of yeast then for 15 gallons of 1.065 wort and sprinkle appropriately. That's $25. Or rehydrate and count on 4 packets. That's $20.

It's still more than building a starter, but yep, if you factor in the time/effort to use a starter can for 1L ($5) + 1/2 lb of DME for the 2L ($3?) the time costs, Then you're only saving $10-15 bucks for 1 hour of work. That may be worth it though.

ASSUMING US-05 is 18 Billion cells per gram conservatively (debatable, but I would agree with this and I think most would), then one packet is not quite enough but close (and arguable) for a 1L + 2L step starter to cover such example, but 2L + 2L is should cover it with ease, though. In a 2L + 2L example, then DME is the only thing that makes sense. That's $6 + 2 hours of "work".

Just trying to think for the future. Thinking out loud.

I typically use 1.5 packets for greater than 1.060 (obviously, up to a point) without rehydrating as my go-to rate for Safale.

Brewing for myself making starters from dry yeast makes zero sense. I'm trying to think ahead for group brew days where US-05, S-04, or Nottingham is called for and my equipment is being used to make a double, or triple batch!

 

[deuc224]

100 Billion, perhaps?

LMAO, yeah my biggest problem is drinking while messaging. Imagine the step up starter i would have to do?!!!