Yeast fermentation temps

[mike_bkk]

I have been reading and studying about yeast fermentation temperatures. I am a little confused and have a couple of questions. Let's use Kveik Voss as an example. The packaging says temp range, 77-104f and optimal 95-104f. Does this mean that it is better to ferment in the optimal range? The confusion comes in that I have also read some articles and some you tube videos saying it is better to stay in the lower side of the temp range, say 80f. I believe the fermentation will be slower at a lower temp. For a beginner like me is something I should be concentrating on at this point, or concentrate more on just getting a first batch of something that is drinkable.
I ask because I am going to brew my first batch with a Mr. Beer kit, but change the yeast to Kveik Voss based on some you yube videos I have watched. Thanks

 

[Jag75]

This may be the case of profiles that 80f put off differently the say 95f. Take hefeweizen yeast . Higher on the temp you get banana , lower temp you get clove.

It also could be because the person who wrote that didn't have temp control. When fermentation begins, the temp of the beer rises. So if you pitch in the 90's it could shoot to high. So 80f pitch it could rise to 90f , within the yeast temp recommendations.

I've never used that yeast strain. However it is important to stay within the yeast recommended temps.

 

[mike_bkk]

Thanks for the info and advice. I plan to control the temp at around 95f.

 

[Teufelhunde]

Thanks for the info and advice. I plan to control the temp at around 95f.

I have used the Voss a couple of times, and likely will again, as to my tastebuds, it lends kind of a orangey, citrusey note to the beer. It may be different for you, and as well, my Voss beer NEVER clear, they stay hazy. Once again, you may find it to be different....

 

[mike_bkk]

Thanks for that. What temp do you ferment at? Do you anything special when the fermentation is complete?

I have used the Voss a couple of times, and likely will again, as to my tastebuds, it lends kind of a orangey, citrusey note to the beer. It may be different for you, and as well, my Voss beer NEVER clear, they stay hazy. Once again, you may find it to be different....

 

[Deadalus]

You picked an outlier as your example. Voss Kviek can ferment really hot compared to typical ale yeasts, its range is wider too. This yeast strain happens to produce flavors that are acceptable/desirable at those higher temperatures. I've only used it once so I can't provide a best temperature for it. Staying within the optimum range is generally a good idea, a little on the lower side of it is good because the yeast will produce some internal heat.

 

[Teufelhunde]

Thanks for that. What temp do you ferment at? Do you anything special when the fermentation is complete?

I ferment at 90 with Voss and nothing out of the ordinary in process, just let it rest for a week or two, then bottle....

 

[mike_bkk]

You picked an outlier as your example. Voss Kviek can ferment really hot compared to typical ale yeasts, its range is wider too. This yeast strain happens to produce flavors that are acceptable/desirable at those higher temperatures. I've only used it once so I can't provide a best temperature for it. Staying within the optimum range is generally a good idea, a little on the lower side of it is good because the yeast will produce some internal heat.

Yes I was counting on that. Being that I live in Thailand and using an old fridge with a temp controller I think it may be to my advantage with the high temp.

 

[mike_bkk]

I ferment at 90 with Voss and nothing out of the ordinary in process, just let it rest for a week or two, then bottle....

Do you bring the temp down when you let it rest? I am glad you mentioned resting as I was wondering about that.

 

[Deadalus]

Yes I was counting on that. Being that I live in Thailand and using an old fridge with a temp controller I think it may be to my advantage with the high temp.

Ok but it doesn't make a good example for your question. It has a wider fermentation range and a higher optimal temperature than most brewing yeasts.

Is room temperature around 95F? Your refrigerator won't heat it, you may need a heating mat to keep it that hot. Given you have the fridge and the temperature controller, a more normal ale yeast would work fine as you could cool the yeast if room temperature is too hot. I do this in the summer in the USA when my basement warms up too much for ale yeasts.

It is a good yeast though for ambient temps over say ~75F and without temperature control because it's not going to produce off flavors provided you aren't brewing in Death Valley, CA for example.

 

[mike_bkk]

You bring up a good point. The absent temp where I live can be 90 t0 100 degrees. Inside it is warmer. I was planning to measure the temp in the room I am going to ferment in as well as the temp in the fridge. Then make a call as to whether to keep it out of the fridge and in the dark, or keep nit in the fridge.
Or maybe wait until full-on summer to use this yeast when the temp will for sure be warm enough. Please keep giving me info and advice this is so helpful for me.

 

[Teufelhunde]

Do you bring the temp down when you let it rest? I am glad you mentioned resting as I was wondering about that.

Yes, after 3 days at FG, I remove it from the Ferment chamber to room temperature....

 

[Deadalus]

I thought perhaps you weren't converting that correctly but it really is that hot there! It doesn't sound like you will need heat at all then. If you kept it insulated at night it wouldn't lose too much heat but I don't know what the daily variation might be. It would most likely be just fine in your fridge you could experiment with a similar amount of water. I brewed with it the one time and I think it was in the low 80's and it was fine. It did express that orange flavor that it is known for. The part of your question where you are wondering how the Voss Kviek will behave at the different temperatures is sound.

On a five gallon batch and with an active yeast, you can expect a roughly 2-4F increase due to yeast activity. Depends on the room temperature too. When I am not familiar with how a specific yeast expresses at the higher end of it's optimum range, I aim for the low side to account for the rise in temperature from the yeast and I always use temperature control. Some yeasts do express some flavors you might like at higher temperatures but some don't and I'd rather have a little less flavor than something unwanted. I don't know if many people let it ferment as high as 100F to give you feedback. Given what you said about the optimum range, your local climate, and that you have the fridge and controller, I would set it at no higher than 100F because even in the fridge the yeast can overshoot the temperature a degree or two.

 

[Zambezi Special]

Kveik likes it hot!
I use it without cooling in our summer (about 110 F).
I keep the fermenter in a coolerbox lined with a duvet to avoid temperature fluctuations.
I leave it for about 10 days before bottling although fermentation is done in 1 or 2.
I find it improves the taste. Bottles carbonate under the same conditions. Done in about 2 days, but I leave them about 5 days. Then minimum 2 days in the fridge

I find the high temperature improves the taste.

Kveik is a monster!

Other yeasts to look at in your climate would be most Belgians and saisons.
When you got your fridge sorted, almost anything goes

 

[mike_bkk]

Great advice from everyone. I think it will be good to do some tests with water and see how the temp acts in the fridge set to keep it around 90f and out of the fridge. Then I can have a better idea of the best way to proceed. I will keep updating as I go and let everyone know what I learn. What an exciting journey!!

 

[eliastheodosis]

I've used Voss a few times but never pushed the temperature. I can confirm that it is not really any slower at about 72-74F. It ferments strongly and reliably and it kicks off similar orange/citrus flavor to what other people here are getting when they push it warmer. I can't compare to warmer ferment temps, of course, but that's my experience. You seem to know this, but as others have said you picked a freak yeast. I wouldn't overthink the temperature too much because of that. I think anywhere between 72F and surface of the sun should be an acceptable temp to make you a good beer I want to make sure I stress something Zambezi said, though, because it's important...

I keep the fermenter in a coolerbox lined with a duvet to avoid temperature fluctuations

Keeping the temperature fluctuations to a minimum will be more important than the actual temp at which you ferment. Minimizing temperature fluctuation is important for every single yeast, as least as far as I know. I just looked at Thailand weather and it goes from 70s at night to 90s during the day. A 20+ degree temp swing, especially at the wrong time during your fermentation, should be the bigger concern in my opinion. If your yeast are slowing down in fermentation and then your temp drops 20F degrees then those yeast will likely go dormant. Your beer might not be totally done, but the yeast could just stop. That could screw up the beer. For this reason I also wouldn't drop the temp for a rest until the fermentation is done.

Sorry if I repeated anything from above. I was reading through and all the advice you're getting from others is great. I saw Zambezi also suggested saisons and I will definitely second that. You could make a killer saison at a wide temp range as well. You might get more changes in the fermentation profile across the temperature range but you can still get a tasty beer. Just pay attention to the recommendations for each yeast. Not all saison yeasts like it really hot.

 

[mike_bkk]

I was also thinking about the fluctuations, which is why I was thinking to use the fridge. With those ambient temps, I am thinking the fridge will act to help control fluctuations and if it gets too warm then the controller can turn it on to bring it down a bit.

 

[eliastheodosis]

I was also thinking about the fluctuations, which is why I was thinking to use the fridge. With those ambient temps, I am thinking the fridge will act to help control fluctuations and if it gets too warm then the controller can turn it on to bring it down a bit.

Looks like you're thinking about things the right way. I haven't tried to deal with those kinds of temp swings, honestly. You're on the right path trying to control the fluctuations. I'm just not sure how well the fridge will do at keeping it warm over the night if where you have the fridge is going to drop to 70F. Anything you can do to keep the beer warm overnight in those conditions is also going to help.

Kveik is pretty hardy though, too. Hopefully it will absorb a little bit of fluctuation and still turn out well. Just go for it! You'll figure out how the yeast perform for you in your specific conditions. It always takes some practice to figure it out

 

[Teufelhunde]

I was also thinking about the fluctuations, which is why I was thinking to use the fridge. With those ambient temps, I am thinking the fridge will act to help control fluctuations and if it gets too warm then the controller can turn it on to bring it down a bit.

If your controller will account for heat as well as cooling, you might look at something like this: FermoTemp® - Electric Fermentation Heat Wrap
I use one of those in my fridge (just loosely placed around the fermentation jug, and my controller will keep my temp within 1-2 degrees of where I set it.

 

[seatazzz]

One of the advantages of the kveik yeasts is how fast they take off; I've had one get to full krausen within 6 hours of pitching, at 80°. May have been less time, I just checked it at 6 hours. So, if you pitch your yeast during the warmer part of the day, and get it right in your ferment fridge, the yeast should take off quickly; the heat that the yeast produces during the process should keep it warm enough overnight as long as your fridge remains closed. Don't be surprised if the krausen drops the very next day, either; as others have noted, kveik is a beast of a yeast. Once primary fermentation is complete the temperature will naturally drop to whatever the ambient temperature is, and it's quite safe to leave it there for a couple of days to let the yeast clean up after themselves.

 

[mike_bkk]

Thanks for the advice. I think I have a pretty good plan coming together.
My house is all concrete and the room fridge will be in gets quite warm. I will test it but I hoping it will keep throught the night without cooling down very much if at all