Wyeast 3711 -- I'm officially impressed

[Montanaandy]

OK my turn with 3711. Brewed up a variation of Jamil's Saison from BCS. My OG was around1.074 if memory serve me correct. Decanted the 2000ml starter and hit the BB but the wort was only down to 70' because that is as cool as I can get it sans a pre-chiller (which I am going to look into). Place it on a Brew Mat with an insulation cylinder and this stuff took off like a rocket after about 6 hours. Blew the airlock out late last night so I went to a blow off. Still churning like mad this AM and had top mop up some StarSan overflow off the floor and replace the blow off growler with a fresh one. Pretty aggressive yeast. Looking forward to the results and not getting stuck with an OG that moves at a snails pace (3724). Montanaandy

 

[android]

tried one tonight. this SOB carbed the bottles in 3 days. i wasn't for sure, but i had a suspicion that they were carbed, so i stuck one in the freezer. VERY dry, still some body (i even mashed at 154), i carbed at 3 vols too, so it's pretty spritzy. not quite the amount of yeast flavor i was hoping for, but i know it will improve with some age.

 

[passedpawn]

My saison using 3711 went from 1.061 to 1.004 in 3 wks. It is bottle conditioning now. I added some ginger for an edge.

I'm using it in a Houblon Chouffe tripel IPA right now. I'm thinking that is a good match. We'll see.

I'm drinking the 3711 saison now. Although it finished low ( OG: 1.061, FG: 1.004) it still has a smooth, medium mouthfeel. I wanted it to finish dry. I had caramunich and wheat in there so I guess that could explain it.

Taste is superb. 3711 comes off with a slightly farmy, slight bubble gum, and quite a bit of spice (maybe thats the ginger I put in there though). It is very good.

I also used 3711 to make a belgian IPA (Houblon) that might be my best clone ever. I thief'ed a sample today and it is dead nuts. More on that one later. It needs a couple more weeks ferment then at least 2 or 3 weeks cold lagering.

 

[Amity]

Same story as you all: Started out at 1.061, 2L starter pitched at 75F. Within a two weeks, it was down to 1.002 (corrected).

Tastes great so far (3 weeks old, just kegged it today)

 

[Homebrewtastic]

I really love this yeast too. I used it for my peach saison with really exceptional results. It dried out nicely and left a great silky mouth feel and some nice pepperiness. I fermented pretty warm. It got as high as 86.

I saved the cake and pitched directly onto it with a sour mashed beer.

 

[boostsr20]

I made a traditional Saison recipe with this yeast and it went from 1.061 to 1.006 within 4 days. Super impressed and it smells fantastic. The sample tasted so good that my next batch was intended to be a belgian Wit but I decided to just pitch onto the 3711. Anyone try a lot of wheat with this yeast? Here is the list. Also used some bitter orange and lemon zest.

5.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 48.78 %
4.25 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 41.46 %
0.50 lb Cara-Pils/Dextrine (2.0 SRM) Grain 4.88 %
0.50 lb Wheat, Flaked (1.6 SRM) Grain 4.88 %
0.75 oz Williamette [5.50 %] (30 min) Hops 8.0 IBU
0.75 oz Cascade [5.50 %] (10 min) Hops 3.1 IBU

 

[android]

i couldn't find the comment i'm thinking of (maybe it was in the other 3711 thread), but someone mentioned a little bit of an 'orval-style' aftertaste in this beer, which i'm totally picking up. it kinda hits on the back of your tongue, hard to describe but my buddies that were over trying this beer the other night picked it up right away. anyone else?

 

[passedpawn]

Be careful with this yeast. I just made a Belgian Tripel IPA. It's gone from 1.082 to 1.007 in 16 days. It might still be dropping. I know for a fact that it has dropped from 1.013 to 1.007 in the last 6 days.

I would consider skipping the sugar addition on a saison or belgian. Or mash high. Or both. My tripel is starting to get a slight alcohol bite that I'm not really happy about. I really hope it is done (it's almost at 10% ABV - ugh). My recipe has 9% beet sugar.

Unfortunately, I did a double infusion mash to maximize the fermentability. Woops.

Also, this yeast seems to be a very poor flocculator. I cold crash and gelatin, so I know I'll be able to knock it down. But for others who don't, there might be a long period for clearing. Of course, since it is still (apparently ) fermenting, I guess I shouldn't expect the yeast to have dropped yet.

Here's a picture of a saison I made with this yeast. You can see that it did not clear well (but is a very fine drink... take my word for it). I don't believe I used gelatin on this beer

 

[ChshreCat]

i couldn't find the comment i'm thinking of (maybe it was in the other 3711 thread), but someone mentioned a little bit of an 'orval-style' aftertaste in this beer, which i'm totally picking up.

I think you were looking for this one: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/wyeast-3711-v-3724-tasting-notes-187360/

Be careful with this yeast. I just made a Belgian Tripel IPA. It's gone from 1.082 to 1.007 in 16 days. It might still be dropping. I know for a fact that it has dropped from 1.013 to 1.007 in the last 6 days.

I would consider skipping the sugar addition on a saison or belgian. Or mash high. Or both. My tripel is starting to get a slight alcohol bite that I'm not really happy about. I really hope it is done (it's almost at 10% ABV - ugh). My recipe has 9% beet sugar.

I think your beer is going to finish with something around the specific gravity of air.

 

[jmo88]

Because of this thread, I adjusted my saison recipe to handle the big attenuation.

Fermentables
Belgian Pilsen Malt 9lb 0oz (76.6 %) In Mash/Steeped
US White Wheat Malt 12.00 oz (6.4 %) In Mash/Steeped
US Munich 10L Malt 12.00 oz (6.4 %) In Mash/Steeped
German CaraMunich III 4.00 oz (2.1 %) In Mash/Steeped
Sugar - White Sugar/Sucrose 1lb 0oz (8.5 %) End Of Boil

Hops
US Willamette (4.5 % alpha) 1.76 oz Loose Pellet Hops used 90 Min From End
German Hallertauer Mittlefruh (5.0 % alpha) 1.06 oz Loose Pellet Hops used At turn off

The recipe is essentially from BCS. But I mashed at 154 and doubled the Caramunich to help deter the yeast from attenuating too much. I even kept the table sugar in the recipe. I got it to finish at 1.005 and that's perfect. Exactly what I wanted.

 

[dcHokie]

i just used 3711, pitched a 1L starter @ about 74-75 deg, had airlock activity within 5-6 hours, but I have the weirdest krausen. It's been moving right along for 4 days now, and it is a thick (viscous) and bubbly krausen, but it's only about 3/4 inch high. I was expecting something massive from all the accounts I've read.

 

[boostsr20]

Be careful with this yeast. I just made a Belgian Tripel IPA. It's gone from 1.082 to 1.007 in 16 days. It might still be dropping. I know for a fact that it has dropped from 1.013 to 1.007 in the last 6 days.

I would consider skipping the sugar addition on a saison or belgian. Or mash high. Or both. My tripel is starting to get a slight alcohol bite that I'm not really happy about. I really hope it is done (it's almost at 10% ABV - ugh). My recipe has 9% beet sugar.

Unfortunately, I did a double infusion mash to maximize the fermentability. Woops.

Also, this yeast seems to be a very poor flocculator. I cold crash and gelatin, so I know I'll be able to knock it down. But for others who don't, there might be a long period for clearing. Of course, since it is still (apparently ) fermenting, I guess I shouldn't expect the yeast to have dropped yet.

Here's a picture of a saison I made with this yeast. You can see that it did not clear well (but is a very fine drink... take my word for it). I don't believe I used gelatin on this beer

Its been a week and a half since I've brewed my saison with it. I transfered to secondary 2 days ago and its already starting to clear sitting at 78 degrees. Not sure why your having trouble with yours. I will take a pic of it in a few.
EDIT: Here is my ingredient list. No clearing agents at all and it will probably get another 2 -3 weeks before cold crashing. If its already starting to clear after 2 days I'm sure it will be fine for me. The carboy on the left is the Belgian Wit style ingredients using this yeast. Curious to see how that turns out.

1.50 lb Light Dry Extract (8.0 SRM) Dry Extract 13.04 %
6.00 lb Pilsner (2 Row) Bel (2.0 SRM) Grain 52.17 %
2.00 lb Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 17.39 %
1.00 lb White Wheat Malt (2.4 SRM) Grain 8.70 %
1.00 oz Goldings, East Kent [7.20 %] (40 min) Hops 19.2 IBU
1.00 oz Hallertauer [3.80 %] (15 min) Hops 3.6 IBU
1.00 oz Hallertauer Hersbrucker [2.40 %] (5 min) Hops 1.4 IBU
0.50 oz Coriander Seed (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
0.50 oz Orange Peel, Bitter (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
0.50 oz Grains of Paradise (Boil 5.0 min) Misc
1.00 lb Candi Sugar, Clear (0.5 SRM) Sugar 8.70 %
1 Pkgs Belgian Saison (Wyeast Labs #3711) Yeast-Ale

Hard to see in the pic but the top 2" can be seen all the way through easily.

 

[Montanaandy]

This yeast was such a pleasure to use compared to 3724 which I am STILL fighting with after 6+ weeks. I will take a gravity reading sometime later this week and if the TG is in the single digits I will probably go ahead and keg it because I need beer in the pipeline. Montanaandy

 

[android]

i just used 3711, pitched a 1L starter @ about 74-75 deg, had airlock activity within 5-6 hours, but I have the weirdest krausen. It's been moving right along for 4 days now, and it is a thick (viscous) and bubbly krausen, but it's only about 3/4 inch high. I was expecting something massive from all the accounts I've read.

my krausen was fairly minimal also. good beer nonetheless!

 

[SumnerH]

This yeast was such a pleasure to use compared to 3724 which I am STILL fighting with after 6+ weeks. I will take a gravity reading sometime later this week and if the TG is in the single digits I will probably go ahead and keg it because I need beer in the pipeline. Montanaandy

After much comparison I have to disagree, somewhat. 3711 is a lot easier to use, but really doesn't make a great tasting Saison. I'm very intrigued by the option of starting with 3724 and then using 3711 to polish it off, but a plain 3711 Saison has a lot of odd off-flavors and isn't what I'm looking for in the genre. It's somewhat close, though, and the version I pitched with Roeselaire turned out pretty well 4 months later.

So I certainly wouldn't recommend against this yeast, but I can't endorse it from my experience if you're looking to use it to make a straight Saison--3724 is a _ton_ more work but makes a really great-tasting final product. 3711 is much easier to use and it definitely attenuates amazingly well, and it's not bad, but it doesn't really make a great final product on its own. I am quite hopeful that a mix of 3724 as the starter and 3711 to finish up will be easy to use and give a delicious end product.

 

[Montanaandy]

After much comparison I have to disagree, somewhat. 3711 is a lot easier to use, but really doesn't make a great tasting Saison. I'm very intrigued by the option of starting with 3724 and then using 3711 to polish it off, but a plain 3711 Saison has a lot of odd off-flavors and isn't what I'm looking for in the genre. It's somewhat close, though, and the version I pitched with Roeselaire turned out pretty well 4 months later.

So I certainly wouldn't recommend against this yeast, but I can't endorse it from my experience if you're looking to use it to make a straight Saison--3724 is a _ton_ more work but makes a really great-tasting final product. 3711 is much easier to use and it definitely attenuates amazingly well, and it's not bad, but it doesn't really make a great final product on its own. I am quite hopeful that a mix of 3724 as the starter and 3711 to finish up will be easy to use and give a delicious end product.

Interesting to read your comments which are much appreciated. As I have stated in prior posts, I am still struggling with 3724 but I will say that the samples have smelled and tasted great. It has just been a bear to get it to get down to TG.

I suspected that there had to be a bit of a trade off in using 3711 in that it is much more cooperative and easy to use compared to 3724.

I agree that the next time I use 3724 I will use 3711 if the gravity is stuck.

I will say that I have learned quite a bit about 3724 and the next time that I brew with it I will be better prepared in terms of initial fermentation temps (as high as I can get them) and how this yeast acts. I did wash the yeast and I have read that it is easier to use in successive generations so that gives me some comfort.

I think that there is a place for both 3724 & 3711. When I have the time/inclination to use 3724 and get what could perhaps be termed a more traditiional Saison I will use that. When I want a quick and painless Saison that is perhaps not quite as traditional I will use 3711. I believe that each will produce a great beer either way. Montananady

 

[dcHokie]

my krausen was fairly minimal also. good beer nonetheless!

thanks android, that's reassuring. mine is below, it's been chugging along slowly but surely, but much more conservatively than i was anticipating. From what I'd heard about this strain & factoring in a couple LBs of wheat in my grain bill I was expecting a blowoff....I had a good crush, decent efficiency, hit my OG, and my temps were in range, couldn't think of anything 'off' here, so the thin krausen was slightly disconcerting. Eh, I'm probably just obsessing b/c it's the only thing I've got in primary right now. I just pulled it outta the swamp to let it warm a bit...

 

[android]

yeah, i had almost 25% wheat in mine and my krausen looked almost identical to yours.

 

[JNye]

I pitched mine on Sunday and had a nice krausen by Monday afternoon, and by Tuesday afternoon the krausen had already dropped back in. Today (wed) it looks like its done...gotta take a gavity reading later
(EDIT...1.010). It was fermenting at 80-84. I wonder if this is too high? seems like most of you are maxing out @ ~ 78*, what does everyone think?

 

[BigBadMikey]

Saturday I pitched at 18:00. OG was 1.071. Took a reading today , it just under 1.010. Looks like a couple of more days and she's done. I also fermented around 80. This is my first saison with this strain. Like JNye, i hope the higher temps will not screw it up.
So far it tasted pretty good. 3711 kicks some serious butt.

 

[Montanaandy]

Saturday I pitched at 18:00. OG was 1.071. Took a reading today , it just under 1.010. Looks like a couple of more days and she's done. I also fermented around 80. This is my first saison with this strain. Like JNye, i hope the higher temps will not screw it up.
So far it tasted pretty good. 3711 kicks some serious butt.

I hope so too but I doubt that the higher temps will hurt anything. I put mine on a Brew Mat + insulation to get things started and I ended up in the mid-high 80'F for several days. As we all know, this yeast churned like a monster for several days. Took it off that after about 5 days and wrapped the heating pad + insulation around it and held the temp around the mid 70'F for the next several days. Saw that any real activity had stopped and took the heating pad off and just kept the insulation on. Held at about 68'F for a while and now is down to 66'F which is at the low end for this yeast. I am going to take a gravity reading in the next day or two to see where I am at and will go from there. Montanaandy

 

[Tim27]

Is a blow off needed for this yeast? I am about to use this yeast next week.

 

[BigBadMikey]

I ferment in a 7 gallon conical. It did not come close to the blowoff port. However, if you ferment in a carboy I would recommend a blowoff.

 

[Montanaandy]

I needed one pretty much from the start. I did add 1 lb of sugar though so there was a ton of food for the yeast to feed on. Montanaandy

 

[passedpawn]

Is a blow off needed for this yeast? I am about to use this yeast next week.

In 3 batches with this yeast I haven't had anything close to a blowoff. I do a controlled temp fermentation for the first 2 days, tho (~ 75).

 

[ChshreCat]

I haven't needed a blowoff, but I've never needed one. I do use fermcap in the boil though.

 

[SumnerH]

I didn't need a blowoff; it ferments well, but it's not explosive like a hefe or trappist yeast.

 

[wvlheel]

This was my first saison, and I used 3711. First, the fermentation was outstanding - very consistent with what everyone else has posted.

With rgards to taste - I was quite impressed with the final product. However, I kept the initial fermentation temps low - mid 60's - and allowed it to ramp to room temp (low 70s) over a few days. I also added spices - cardamon, lemon zest and black pepper - to the boil - maybe I cheated.

I will say that my saison took a long time to carb, but I cold crashed for nearly a week before bottling and I'm not sure that my priming sugar was uniformly distributed.

This beer has gotten better and better - i'm at 2 months in bottles right now and wish I had slowed down the consumption. My OG was 1.65 and it finished at 1.005 - impressive.

I'm definitely making this again and adding more spices and waiting at least a month before opening anything!

 

[ChshreCat]

Try it once without the spices. You might like it!

 

[joel6615]

Quick question, just kegged mine (after one month in primary) and is sitting under pressure at room temperature73ish, would you guys leave at room temp or move over fridge and cool to about 60? OG1.074 TG 1.004...it's a beast. Second, how long would you keg condition? I was planning to leave at room temps for 2 weeks to a month, then move to kegerator and put on the gas for 2weeks to a month. Sound reasonable?