WTF?!? Landlord woes

[flyboy]

I've seen too many posts like this on this site and many others. But it seems time to add my own landlord woes now. On Tuesday, we go a letter from the landlord saying that our appartment was not meeting health standards and we had 5 days to clean it up or we were going to get evicted. When I called she told me our appartment smelled like stale beer and urine, we had dirty dishes all over, and storage was not put away. It took me a bit of digging but the "stale beer and urine" was the smell of hops in the pumpkin ale I made. There was a strong smell of hops but I didn't think that it smelled bad. The "dirty dishes" were by beer bottles that I took out to get to my equiptmen. And the "storage not put away" was my secondary. But wait. There's more. Found out that she tried to call the police on me earlier for "making moonshine". The cop that talked to her knew me and told her that it wasn't moonshine and that what I was doing was legal. He told me that she's mormon and doesn't like me making beer in my appartment. So she's saying I'm greating a health hazard and attracting insects when I make beer. The sick part is our lease isn't up until the end of July and if she gets us evicted, we still have to pay the remainder of the lease. This is discrimination but I can't prove any of it in court. I'm being screwed and the only thing I can do is bend over and smile and say "Please sir. Can I have some more?".

 

[Yuri_Rage]

I'm sorry, man, that stinks!

I hate when people's personal agendas cloud their judgment.

 

[Schlenkerla]

If she doesn't really like it you can bail on her. Find a better place to live. I've bailed on a rental once before they can't do much to make you pay. I was transfering from a JuCo to a 4 year university had three months of lease left asked to be let go of the lease after 3 years and offered to clean the place well too. They wouldn't work with me. I said F'em and left it after I got my stuff packed up. I didn't pay them a cent after that. The rest is history. If she's really upset she'll be happy to see you go.

I'd first talk to the lady, possibly appologize and mind you P's & Q's for the time being. If you are having brewing smells eminating from the apartment open windows and have the stove fan going. Light a candle to burn up some of the odor. You might even try to explain that brewing requires sanitary conditions, it may slightly appease her.

Just try to keep the place clean, don't give her and excuses, she shouldn't be snooping in your appartment either. If she does I'd file a complaint as matter of record. You have a right to privacy.

BTW - Eviction is pretty hard to do in a lot of states. You have to be darn right criminal or violent to be evicted. Make sure you pay on time though.

 

[Bobby_M]

Yeah, actually the landlord needs to provide notice of an inspection. They can't just go in. That's tresspassing and any action she takes based on what she's saw is completely out of bounds. Similar to police and search warrants. The only time they can enter unannounced is if the downstairs appartment is getting flooded due to your tub overflowing or something.

 

[MikeFlynn74]

Check the local laws-

If you get evicted I Highly doubt you have to pay anything.

Here in Alaska Its damn near impossible to evict anyone. I had my sister in law stay with us for a few months while she was waiting on state assistance. When I found out she was using welfare money on crack I promplty told her to GTFO. I was met with the cops who said reguardless of what she was doing or who she was endangering I could not kick her out even though she didnt pay rent. I went to court to get a restraining order which was not granted. However The judge gave her 1 week to move and told her not to come back. I asked the judge if after that time had passed and I found her in my house, Could I treat her like an intruder? The judge looked at her and said yes.

 

[Mothrog]

I'd hold on to that cop's name. Something tells me if she tries to evict you, and you can pull a cop behind you to support you in whatever action she takes against you, you'd be fine and wouldn't have to pay a dime. I'd also, as others have said, check your local and state renters' rights laws. In most states, unless there was an emergency or prior notice was provided, she was trespassing.

 

[BlindLemonLars]

The sick part is our lease isn't up until the end of July and if she gets us evicted, we still have to pay the remainder of the lease.

No way, no how. They cannot kick you out of your home, and still charge you rent. Even if such things are spelled out in the lease contract, contracts do not supercede the law. Anyhow, it's hard as hell to evict at all, and if a tenant digs their heels in even slightly, it generally takes at least a year. Landlord/tenant law is heavily biased towards protecting tenants.

My advice would be to tidy up your bottles/carboys and such, and politely explain your activities. Do what you can to reduce odors, and as Schlenkerla suggests, show her that brewing in fact requires strict sanitation practices. If none of this appeases her, tell her to stuff it and start planning to move in July. She won't be able to kick you out before then. If she takes matters into her own hands and removes ANYTHING from your apartment, then god help her...you'll be able to eviscerate her in court and collect all kinds of damages.

She clearly hasn't done her legal homework, as AZ law gives you 10 days to correct violations, not 5.

Good luck man, I hope you can defuse the situation without too much grief. Remember though, the law is on your side and you will prevail. I'm soooo glad I own my home, and don't have to deal with this sort of crap!

 

[Sir Humpsalot]

To cover up the odors, I recommend patchouli incense. It covers up the brewing smell. After that, she should stop complaining. :cross:

 

[MikeFlynn74]

Also tell her brewing is part of her religion and if she trys to squash that you will sue until you are the owner of the apt.

Trust me- she doesnt have the money and she has the only thing to lose.

 

[Brew Runner]

Get some of that marijuana-smelling incense to cover up the ferment funk.....:cross:

I hate to say it, but sometimes being nice and yielding to badge-happy authority is more beneficial in the short run. If you can fight the good fight and win, by all means do that first. However, if you cannot, sometimes it's less inconvenient to at least shine someone on. Explain to the LL that you didn't mean to cause a problem, and assure them/show them that you're not doing anything illegal, dangerous, damaging, or weird.

Then again, HTH do they know how your apartment smells or what's in it? Does that count as breaking and entering?

 

[Dude]

I'd hold on to that cop's name. Something tells me if she tries to evict you, and you can pull a cop behind you to support you in whatever action she takes against you, you'd be fine and wouldn't have to pay a dime. I'd also, as others have said, check your local and state renters' rights laws. In most states, unless there was an emergency or prior notice was provided, she was trespassing.

Especially if you gave said cop a sixxer of some good homebrew.

 

[Jesse17]

I am a landlord myself, and I'll tell you what I know.

First from the looks of it she is just objecting because she's a Mormon who likes to control everyone who isn't. (look at Utah) not because of the 'sanitary conditions'. But you might be able to appease her with straightening up a little and some freshener.

If she wants to evict you, she can. A 30 notice is all she needs to terminate the rental lease, and she doesn't need to give you a reason (or the real reason anyway) so it doesn't matter if the beer really was part of your religion. However, she can't charge you rent for the remainder of the lease if she does.

If you simply don't move out if she does evict you, it would be very easy for you to stay. In Montana it takes about 3 or 4 months of a series of court actions to forcefully get someone removed...according to the law...in actuality it takes much longer because the judges are so concerned about the poor bas$%ted that refuses to move...and every landlord is apparently a son-of-a-you know.

Also, if you skip out on the lease she can charge you rent for the remainder of the lease or until she re-rents it. She can even garnish your wages etc. but 95% of the time it's more work than it's worth for the landlord, if she can even find you afterwords...but if she really wanted to, she does have your SS# and could garnish wages/tax returns with it. She can also place the debt on your credit record with little effort.

I doubt she entered your apartment without giving you notice, or you letting her in. But if she did, file a complaint about it, and then if she screews with you again, just file a complain that she is retaliating for the first complaint.

My biggest advise to you is: If you want to stay, clean up and try to appease her. If you don't want to stay, let her evict you, and she can't charge you rent.

Oh yeah, search for 'Landlord Tenant Law, (insert your state here) or 'Landlord Tenant Help, (insert your state here) on google, most states have hotlines that you can call for all the legal advise/support you might need or want to know. At the very least they will tell you what you/she can and can't do.

Let us know how it works out.

 

[EvilTOJ]

As soon as you said she's Mormon my very first thought was "well that's why, she's mormon and therefore thinks she's better than everyone else". She's definitely looking for reasons to kick you out because her religion tells her beer is evil and she should not accociate with it even by proxy (you). I had to deal with that kind of crap when I lived in Utah and boy howdy do I not miss it in the slightest!

I agree with everything Jesse says (also because that's my name too!) try to make nice with her for now, then if she tries to kick you out and does it, just move and don't pay the rest of the lease. You're under no obligation to pay for a service you're not actually getting (meaning renting). Also, take pictures of her complaints. She says a carboy is unwanton filth? Take pictures! Of everything! If she says that that's not what it was like before, then where's HER pictures? If that makes sense.


Although I do agree with her that pumpkin ale smells rank. :cross:

 

[srm775]

I'm no tenent/lessor legal expert, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn. However, from everything I've seen, it seems most of what everyone has said is pretty accurate.

Lease: Lease is a contract. A contract can only be enforced if both parties to the contract are receiving something of value ... you receive a place to live, she receives money. If you don't have a place to live, she can't receive money for it. The law is, theoretically, about establishing an equilibrium.

As far as her terminating the lease for no reason, I'm not sure about that. I would think there would need to be some reason, but perhaps not. Call the local code enforcement and find out. But, if she does, then you'll certainly have plenty of time to find a new apartment and be rid of her. It might work out for the best.

Your landlord can't enter your residence without notice unless an emergency. If she's just coming into your house without your permission then you should file a complaint. And, send her a letter by registered mail stating that she is not to come into your residence without your permission. That stuff is not right.

One word of advice ... document everything. Also, take very good care of your apartment and take tons of photo and even video of the place before you leave. One area that she can really nail you on is your deposit, and if you fight with her, then it's going to be something she'll go after.

 

[Bobby_M]

The landlord has to be able to prove that she incurred costs due to your negligence or actions in order to keep any deposit money. The reasons for losing deposit are usually outlined in general on the lease.

Eveyone has different opinions of what "messy" are. I've done inspections with my dad when he had four rental apartments and I've seen some nasty SHHHH that the tenents saw no problem with. Standards of hygeine are all over the map. I'm not saying you're a slob, but it's not outside the realm of possibility ;-)

 

[njnear76]

Once they threaten you, it's time to leave. I went through the same thing. It wasn't pretty. I no longer felt comfortable living there and I wanted out. It's not worth living under terms, which you feel are not fair.

The most you will lose is your deposit. Chances are you will never get that money back anyways. Almost no one stays at a place until their lease is up. Even if you do, there are many landlords who will just not give it back.

Try to buy a condo if you can.

Mike

 

[chione]

First don't assume if you skip out she will not come after you because it is not worth her time. She sounds like a fanatic and the type that would spend hour of time to get $10 out of you.

Second get a pair of magic underwear and book of mormon.

 

[flyboy]

Thanks, everyone, for your support. What happened was she came in to inspect the heater and saw our apartment. The night before we got news that a friend of our in Bovina,Texas died from a heart attack and I decided that get some pizza instead of cooking dinner ourselves and we would clean up in the morning. Then when the landlord come in, she sees my wife standing in the middle of the hall doing laundry with the trash and recycling next to the door ready to go out with empty beer bottle on the kitchen table from the night before. We spent the entire weekend going over the apartment with a fine tooth comb trying to get it cleaned up to meet her expectations. I'm worried that there's no way we can meet up to them, though. We shut the door on a couple of mormon missionaries a while back and she hasn't been very happy with us ever since. We did find another apartment a couple blocks away from where we are now. So, I could continue to go to flight school and my kids can stay in the schools they are now. Anyway, just keep us in your thoughts and prayers.

 

[MikeFlynn74]

Yea whats up with those DBag missionaries!

Answer the door naked. That really gets them in a bind.

 

[Cheesefood]

If you created a "noxious odor" ten whether you thought it was bad or not there was a complaint. She has the right to tell you not to make anything that'll stink, and every married or dating guy here will attest to having at least one covnersation about "the smell". In addition, the garbage created does stink. You and I might not complain, but it's not fair to subject others to a smell they don't enjoy.

 

[zoebisch01]

Once they threaten you, it's time to leave.

Yeah pretty much. The writing is on the wall. That and the fact of you shutting the door on the evangelists proves that it is only really an uphill battle from here on out. Keep in mind though, unless she has a better reason, if you pay the rent on time and don't destroy the place that is in your favor.

If you have to stay, I'd simply try talking to her and see what her reaction is (explain to her the news of your friend). If you have paid on time, don't hassle her and don't destroy her property then you have a lot going in your favor (that is really mostly what landlords care about anyway, in most cases).

 

[The Drizzle]

My apologies to the threadstarter. If I were you, I'd look for another place to live. Nothings worse than a landlord or anybody else trying to tell you how to live.

 

[DUCCCC]

To the OP,
If there's anyway possible, and I am just throwing this out there, you might really want to look into buying a place. With the amount of foreclosure, and places sitting on the market for months right now, you should be able to own a place for what you rent one for. Even if you don't really want to spend the rest of your life there it might just be the best 5 to 7 year investment at the moment.

I am a first time home owner just this year, and I'm 39. I'm the sole supporter for my wife and 2 kids, and a large dog. For just a couple hundred more a month than we were paying in rent I got an awesome home that's twice the size of what we were renting. I got a 30 year fixed loan, so my payments aren't changing, unless my escrow amount needs to for taxes or insurance, but the loan payment is fixed. I get to paint any room any color I want (really what SWMBO wants ) and I got an office/hobby/fermenting room in the deal.

Of course if I didn't have kids I might not have gone this route, but it still might be worth looking into for you.

Good luck with the LL,
Matt

 

[olllllo]

Please keep the topic to the matter at hand. Extrapolating behavior based on the person's religion may have the unintended consequence of bringing into discussion our own personal faiths.

We are all just speculating anyways, please keep it civil.


Please use the Report a bad post button instead of taking matters into your own hands.

 

[Cheesefood]

What it's going to come down to is who needs whom more. Sounds like she's confident she can replace him with a non-brewing tenant. If you need her place more than she needs you, talk to her and see if there's a compromise. Otherwise, look for a new place and ask if she'll release you from your lease. Finally, if there's no where else to go, then hang up your carboys.

Make sure when you find a new place you specifically mention that you intend to brew beer and ask if anyone on the floor or in the building will object.

What she's doing isn't discrimination. It's a bit fascist. Even if you owned a condo you'd probably offend someone with the odor so you need to be careful in planning your next home to find one that suits brewing.

 

[uglygoat]

you could always hang some pentagrams up in the windows, upside down crucifix etc... that's what i'd do.

 

[Brew Runner]

Yeah, my aunt lives in a condo and the homeowners' association is a bunch of DBags. Instead of fixing stuff as it breaks and slowly raising fees over time to cover it, they waited until the roof fell apart and charged everyone $12,000 this year to replace it. The guy the guy upstairs has a tank of a wife as well and she klip-klops around the house at all hours and they can hear it through their ceiling....even after addind a few grand in insulation in it. I guess she can't even go outside for a smoke without someone else complaining, either.

 

[eddie]

Or just get a case of Budweiser and spray it all over the carpet then piss in the corner and move. She already assumes this is what's going on so why not give her what she wants?

 

[Jesse17]

Please keep the topic to the matter at hand. Extrapolating behavior based on the person's religion may have the unintended consequence of bringing into discussion our own personal faiths.

We are all just speculating anyways, please keep it civil.


Please use the Report a bad post button instead of taking matters into your own hands.

You're absolutely right. I made the following comment:

I am a landlord myself, and I'll tell you what I know.

First from the looks of it she is just objecting because she's a Mormon who likes to control everyone who isn't. (look at Utah) not because of the 'sanitary conditions'.

and I apologize for it. I originally meant it more as "From what the OP has said, and from what I know of being a landlord, it sounds like she personally has a bigger objection to the beer than to the sanitary situation."

Being the drunk I was at the time, I had to throw in the part about being a Mormon and (look at Utah) part, and I should not have.

I'll try to use better judgment next time.

 

[MikeInCtown]

I would still check state laws as applicable. Where I live, even if she was "checking on the heater" she would still need to give you notice that she needed to enter. As said before, there needs to be a clear emergency to enter without notice.

As to rent, even if you are evicted, you would normally be responsible for rent up until the time you leave. She can terminate the lease, but she would need to prove you violated the terms of the lease and even then you could request a hearing in front of a judge and she has to prove her allegations to break the lease. Best thing to be is up to date on rent.

Someone else mentioned how they let a relative stay with them. Your state must have pretty liberal rules that determines residency. Here, in order for you to be considered a resident, you have to be able to secure your belongings. This means locking doors generally. Merely having a door with a knob doesn't cut it and they would be considered a visitor or guest.

Anyway, someone mentioned speaking to someone about your situation. I would second that and advise you to do it quick, even if you are moving.

 

[homebrewer_99]

I don't think she has a leg to stand on. All of her points can be explained away just as you posted in the original post.

The fact that she may not like alcohol and you brew it is none of her business. You are not selling it so nothing illegal is taking place regardless of her misconceptions.

Sounds like threats based upon religious conviction. I think you could probably sue her for reverse religious discrimination practices. :rockin:

Re-read your lease for back-up.

As for the urine smells??? I just had to go, man...

 

[dibby33]

You're absolutely right. I made the following comment:

and I apologize for it. I originally meant it more as "From what the OP has said, and from what I know of being a landlord, it sounds like she personally has a bigger objection to the beer than to the sanitary situation."

Being the drunk I was at the time, I had to throw in the part about being a Mormon and (look at Utah) part, and I should not have.

I'll try to use better judgment next time.

Looked fecking civil to me. Chill out peoples.

 

[flyboy]

I think we passed. She came in yesterday, left her card on the kitchen table and left. I don't know what that means but I'm thinking we're ok. I did hide all the beer making stuff. I put the beer bottles in rubbermade containers and moved the rest of the stuff to a storage unit. But I won't rest easy until our lease is up in July when we can move. I have a realitor friend that is looking into getting us a lease to own condo for about $100 more a month then we're paying now in rent. But until that happens, we're stuck here. Anyway, thanks everyone for your support.

 

[Evan!]

dum, da dum dum dummmm...

you aren't giving up brewing, are ya?

 

[APendejo]

I think we passed. She came in yesterday, left her card on the kitchen table and left. I don't know what that means but I'm thinking we're ok. I did hide all the beer making stuff. I put the beer bottles in rubbermade containers and moved the rest of the stuff to a storage unit. But I won't rest easy until our lease is up in July when we can move. I have a realitor friend that is looking into getting us a lease to own condo for about $100 more a month then we're paying now in rent. But until that happens, we're stuck here. Anyway, thanks everyone for your support.

When you do get the condo the very first thing you need to do is get yourself on the board of directors. You think having just one LDS landlord is bad, wait till you have to deal with a gang of condo nazis.
I bought my condo 10 years ago and after the first letters I got about my cigars and Harley I took action. I requested all the daily operation cash receipts from the prior years and proceded to dig up so much impropriety, fraud, and embezzelment that I gave the board an ultimatum, quit or get fired.
I have been the pres. of our board for the last 7 out of 10 years. The only thing I do now is sign checks, schedule maintainance, and tell residents to settle their own beefs because I will smack them with the cc&r's. I live in a very nice quiet civil little community of 29 condos, It is part of my investment for retirement.
AP

 

[TheJadedDog]

The worst thing about condos is that it is like paying a mortgage and rent; you get all the worst things about renting without any of the benefits of buying. But that's just my opinion.

 

[brauhaus]

as an inspector, unless she can prove that you are a HAZARD to her building (fire, health and safety-wise) she might have a hard time getting you out, she can complain about the smells and such, but without documentation and police records to back up every incident it's just her word against yours.

and as far as condos and townhouses, the associations and fees can be ridiculous, like mentioned before, get yourself involved and make an effort to show that you mean business and people will respect you and leave you alone....

 

[APendejo]

The worst thing about condos is that it is like paying a mortgage and rent; you get all the worst things about renting without any of the benefits of buying. But that's just my opinion.

I paid 78 thou for my condo in 1997, I have never refinanced, the last for sale condo in my community closed escrow last week. The purchase price was 327k. I would consider that a pretty fair benefit.
AP

 

[skinfiddler]

If she doesn't really like it you can bail on her. Find a better place to live. I've bailed on a rental once before they can't do much to make you pay. I was transfering from a JuCo to a 4 year university had three months of lease left asked to be let go of the lease after 3 years and offered to clean the place well too. They wouldn't work with me. I said F'em and left it after I got my stuff packed up. I didn't pay them a cent after that. The rest is history. If she's really upset she'll be happy to see you go.

I'd first talk to the lady, possibly appologize and mind you P's & Q's for the time being. If you are having brewing smells eminating from the apartment open windows and have the stove fan going. Light a candle to burn up some of the odor. You might even try to explain that brewing requires sanitary conditions, it may slightly appease her.

Just try to keep the place clean, don't give her and excuses, she shouldn't be snooping in your appartment either. If she does I'd file a complaint as matter of record. You have a right to privacy.

BTW - Eviction is pretty hard to do in a lot of states. You have to be darn right criminal or violent to be evicted. Make sure you pay on time though.

I evicted eight people since August. (Obviously not for brewing beer) I can also tell you that my company regularly gets letters and phone calls from former tenants who "skipped out" wanting to pay what was owed because the couldn't get a loan or in many cases rent another apartment. It is a legal judgment against your credit if the landlord wants to pursue it.

I don't think she has enough to evict on the facts stated here anyway. She has been made aware that you are not engaged in unlawful activities. You might put that in writing for her quoting statutes. She cannot evict you solely on disagreement with your activities or lifestyle based on HER religious beliefs.

As long as you are not breaking things, causing a public nuisance and are paying your rent as described in your lease there is not much she can do. I would get my lease out out and review it carefully (perhaps with a lawyer) for "wiggle-wording" which might be illegal thereby voiding your contract. (You cannot be bound to a contract whose terms are not legal). In most cities you can contact free legal services champing at the bit to "stick it to the Man."

Have her put in writing any threats of eviction with itemized reasons. Be sure to get receipts for all rents paid. She has to in (most states) give 24 hrs notice before entering your premises. that should give you some time to get things squared away.

I would exercise all options befor skipping out on a lease.

JW

 

[flyboy]

I'm not going to skip out on the lease. I'm just not going to sign another one and finigh this one out legally. I did have a friend of mine that owned and rented property inspect my apartment to make sure we weren't nissing the obvious. Both he and the realtor friend of ours gave us a thumbs up on Tuesay night before our landlords inspection. Right now it's a buyers market in Phoenix.