Will this cheap 3500 watt induction burner work?

[tmendick]

That was my thought too, I've read the drop is somewhere between 100-125 depending on where you look. I will see if anyone else thinks I need to upgauge the wiring or not and go from there

 

[The_Bishop]

Yesterday was my first brew using the induction plate. It went very well; so well that I believe my gas burner may collect a lot of dust now. It was nice being in my garage and out of the sun while brewing.

Beer is a Munster Alt. 90 minute boil due to a mostly pilsner grainbill. No issues whatsoever.

Considering building a 15 gallon kettle and switching back to biab using this burner. Anyone use a Bayou 1316 with this burner?

 

[The_Bishop]

As I posted in the other induction thread:

I finally got around to insulating my kettle. Two wraps of reflectix, and one on the lid.

Also decided to do a heat retention test. Filled the kettle with 8 gallons of hot tap water. It settled at 120 degrees f. It's only dropped 1/2 a degree in 45 minutes. I'm more than happy with the results.

 

[The_Bishop]

Finally got a chance to run a test with the insulated kettle:

Tested with 8.5 gallons of water, from 62 degrees to boiling. I decided to use 8.5 gallons as a test because in all likelihood, that's roughly where my BIAB volumes should be.

This is with two wraps of Reflectix on the sides of the kettle, and a single layer on the lid. The lid seal wasn't perfect as I was using small binder clips to hold the reflectix in place and that wouldn't let the lid sit all the way down but I don't think there's a huge difference to be had. That being said, I have used gorilla packing tape to secure the reflectix to the lid and it'll sit flush now.

Time, Temp, Rate
0, 62
10, 85, 2.3
20, 108, 2.3
30, 131, 2.3
40, 153, 2.2
50, 174, 2.1
60, 194, 2.0
70, 212, 1.8

With the insulation, 1.5 gallons more volume, and a colder starting temp, I hit boil in 70 minutes. Was able to throttle the plate back more and keep a good rolling boil. Given that this was able to boil 8.5 gallons of water I'm now convinced that 10 gallon batches are indeed possible with this plate using a tall, narrow kettle and decent insulation.

And, because I had the hot water there and I was curious how the insulation would work at mash temps, I replaced some of the water with cooler water to hit 152.

Time, Temp
0, 152
15, 152
30, 151
45, 150
60, 150

A 2 degree drop over 60 minutes is fine, as far as I'm concerned. It's no big deal to fire up the plate and stir at the 30 minute mark if I'm really hell bent on keeping mash temps nailed down.

Now, if only my new counter-flow chiller would show up, I could *really* finish my stand...

 

[actionjackson905]

"I finally pulled the trigger on the Advantco 3500 induction burner, and ran a test yesterday.

This is 7 gallons of water in a Bayou 1044 kettle, uninsulated and uncovered. The Bayou 1044 is non-magnetic, yet seemed to work just fine."

How is possible? Induction works on alternating electro magnetic field no?

My understanding is that the kettle/pan/pot has to be magnetic?

Also I thought that all Bayou kettles were already induction compatible.

I'd love to go to induction, but I'm not yet prepared to upgrade a 16 gal kettle at this point.

AJ

 

[augiedoggy]

Disclaimer: not an electrician, but I think under 100' you should be fine as long as it's the only thing on that breaker. Check a voltage drop calc but you are only looking at a couple percent and the unit isn't pulling a full 16amps

http://www.rapidtables.com/calc/wire/voltage-drop-calculator.htm

Its not really 3500w... They always round up... from what I remember reading its more like 3200w

 

[augiedoggy]

I've read they sell stainless plates that are for induction that one would lay in the bottom of a non induction kettle... some kettles will work drastically better than others depending on the type and thickness of the stainless in the bottom.

 

[tmendick]

I wouldn't use the plates, according to a few people on this thread using them has a tendency of blowing the fuse. I have also seen that the magent test in not always right for induction (some magnetic post dont work, and some non-magnetic ones do)

 

[thatfatbastard]

How is possible? Induction works on alternating electro magnetic field no?

My understanding is that the kettle/pan/pot has to be magnetic?

Also I thought that all Bayou kettles were already induction compatible.

I'd love to go to induction, but I'm not yet prepared to upgrade a 16 gal kettle at this point.

I have an OLD Brewer's Best 10 gallon stainless kettle and it works fine with my induction cooktop, it is also non-magnetic. I have a newer 15 gallon Polar Ware kettle that is also non-magnetic and works. I am not using any plates or other "helpers" with these pots.

I would ask around and see if anybody you know has an induction cooktop and ask them if you can try your kettle on it.

 

[Jakor]

Sorry to bump this thread, but I had a question for those who have had experience creating a pigtail converter to plug the IC3500 into their existing appliance outlets.

I currently brew in an apartment that I rent, so I do not want to make any permanent changes to the electrical configuration. I have fairly easy access to my washer/dryer's outlet, which appears to be a Nema 14-30 type outlet. When I google how to convert Nema 14-30 to 6-20P, all I get is forum posts for people attempting to set up electric fast charging stations for their cars, with little relevant information for my situation.

Can anyone with a stronger electrical background confirm if converting 14-30 to 6-20P is possible and safe? I know it will be a 20-amp appliance on a 30 amp breaker, but I won't ever have it plugged in when I am not around.

Thank you for any information you can provide!!

 

[nutty_gnome]

Has anyone been able to hook one of these up to an Auber PID for accurate temp control? Not sure how to search for that. N_G

 

[brettwasbtd]

Has anyone been able to hook one of these up to an Auber PID for accurate temp control? Not sure how to search for that. N_G

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/navigating-hbt.html

 

[IslandLizard]

Sorry to bump this thread, but I had a question for those who have had experience creating a pigtail converter to plug the IC3500 into their existing appliance outlets.

I currently brew in an apartment that I rent, so I do not want to make any permanent changes to the electrical configuration. I have fairly easy access to my washer/dryer's outlet, which appears to be a Nema 14-30 type outlet. When I google how to convert Nema 14-30 to 6-20P, all I get is forum posts for people attempting to set up electric fast charging stations for their cars, with little relevant information for my situation.

Can anyone with a stronger electrical background confirm if converting 14-30 to 6-20P is possible and safe? I know it will be a 20-amp appliance on a 30 amp breaker, but I won't ever have it plugged in when I am not around.

Thank you for any information you can provide!!

Sure you can use that 14-30 outlet for the IC3500. Connect to both Line poles and the Ground. Leave the Neutral pole unconnected.

Just make an adapter/extension cord with a 14-30P on one end and a 6-20R on the other.

Since it's an extension cord I think it's OK to use #12 gauge wire if it's not crazy long. However, that extension cord will not be protected by the 30A circuit breaker. If you want that protection, you'd need to use #10 wire.

If you're close enough to the dryer outlet you could cut the plug off your IC3500 cord and wire it to a 14-30P instead, but you'll void your warranty and cannot plug it directly into a 6-20R later.

 

[brettwasbtd]

Sorry to bump this thread, but I had a question for those who have had experience creating a pigtail converter to plug the IC3500 into their existing appliance outlets.

I currently brew in an apartment that I rent, so I do not want to make any permanent changes to the electrical configuration. I have fairly easy access to my washer/dryer's outlet, which appears to be a Nema 14-30 type outlet. When I google how to convert Nema 14-30 to 6-20P, all I get is forum posts for people attempting to set up electric fast charging stations for their cars, with little relevant information for my situation.

Can anyone with a stronger electrical background confirm if converting 14-30 to 6-20P is possible and safe? I know it will be a 20-amp appliance on a 30 amp breaker, but I won't ever have it plugged in when I am not around.

Thank you for any information you can provide!!

Disclaimer: not an electrician so take advice at own risk

Whenever this comes up it likened to plugging in a lamp to standard 15 or 20 amp socket. The lamp uses wire that is not graded for a full 15 amps, but the unit doesn't draw that much. In the lamps case only needing 100W. The induction cooker has built in fuse to protect it from overdrawing.

@Dustbow was kind enough to send me some pics of the adapter he made:

 

[trussell]

To add to what brettwasbtd said the breaker on a circuit protects the house wiring not what's plugged into it.

Also 12 Ga wire is fine. The unit 3500W/220V=15.9 amps and 12 Ga is good for 20A.

 

[Jakor]

Thanks for the replies and the picture brewasbtd. Looks like I'll be making a home depot run this week to see what I can peice together.

 

[rayf]

A 20 amp appliance connected to a 30 amp breaker is NOT a good idea. If something would happen to go wrong the Induction unit would burn before the breaker kicked. The same thing would happen if you used 12 gauge wire. The wire would burn before the breaker would protect the circuit. If you use 12 gauge wire on a 30 amp circuit you are asking for trouble.

 

[Siberian]

The unit has a 15-amp fuse inside, so I don't think it should be drawing more than 15 amps.

Well, I had that original 15-amp fuse blow (around brew day 40 with the unit). Which is happily hard wired to the circuit board and not easily replaceable.

I added wire on each side and put in a new fuse, that blew after about 5 brew days.

Replaced it with another 15-amp slow burn, that blew after 20 minutes.

I'm currently flirting with disaster, since I've hard wired around the fuse. :rockin:

 

[The_Bishop]

A 20 amp appliance connected to a 30 amp breaker is NOT a good idea. If something would happen to go wrong the Induction unit would burn before the breaker kicked. The same thing would happen if you used 12 gauge wire. The wire would burn before the breaker would protect the circuit. If you use 12 gauge wire on a 30 amp circuit you are asking for trouble.

Stop propagating bad information. Circuit breakers are there to protect the wire inside the walls, *not* the appliances plugged in.

 

[rayf]

Stop propagating bad information. Circuit breakers are there to protect the wire inside the walls, *not* the appliances plugged in.

The only bad information being propagated is telling someone that it is ok to plug these things into an improper circuit.

The only reason I chimed in at all to begin with is the fact that bad information is being PROPOGATED!
There is not one Electrical inspectors on this planet that would sign off on this type of Jerry rigging.

I'm not trying to be a know it all or anything. This practice worries me.

 

[rayf]

By the way, I am an electrician.

 

[The_Bishop]

You *are* passing along bad information.

Breakers in your main panel are designed to protect the house wiring. Period. When you plug into the outlets should have it's own protection.

Ever look at a lamp cord? Not very heavy duty. No fuse in a lamp, generally. Do you plug it into the 15 amp capable outlet in your wall?

This is the same concept. The danger is when you plug too large of a load into that circuit. The draw is too high, the wiring begins to heat up and... the breaker trips, shutting down the circuit, like it's supposed to.

You may be an electrician, but you show a very limited understanding of how wiring works.

 

[gromitdj]

Ever look at a lamp cord? Not very heavy duty. No fuse in a lamp, generally. Do you plug it into the 15 amp capable outlet in your wall?...

I'm no electrician, but have been perplexed by the advice not to use a 20 amp appliance in a 30 amp outlet/breaker for this reason. Conceptually, there is no difference.

I can buy that the wire should be capable of 30 amps so that it doesn't burn up trying to handle an overload current before the breaker trips.

Additionally, would an inspector check anything that gets plugged into an outlet?

 

[rayf]

There is a reason you can not plug the thing directly into a 30 amp receptacle. 30 amp breaker with 12 guage wire is not a good wiring practice. Larger wire with a lower rated breaker ok. Smaller wire with higher rated breaker not OK. I absolutely have a perfect understanding of electrical wiring.

 

[gromitdj]

...I absolutely have a perfect understanding of electrical wiring.

Then please explain why it is acceptable to plug a personal heater that draws less than 2 amps into a 15 or 20 amp circuit. Given that I agree with the necessity to provide adequate wire gauge to supply the breaker current.

I'm not trying to incite anything. I would honestly like to understand the difference.

 

[trussell]

I'm on the side that you can plug any electrical device into an outlet and the breaker size doesn't matter as long as you're not trying to pull more amps than the breaker and wiring can handle. Many light duty items have a 18 Ga cord. because they only draw a few amps its fine. Got item that draws close to 20 amps that is going into a 20 amp outlet the cord better be able to handle it so 20 Ga or higher wiring.

Any real electrical inspector would tell you the breakers in you panel are there to protect the house wiring. Think about it it runs in the walls and can't be seen so you want a breaker to trip long before the wire would get too hot.

I got my IC 3500 on a circuit with a 30 Amp GFCI breaker and 10 Ga wire. I did that for future expansion of my electric brewery. Been working fine for a year and a half.

 

[jeffmeh]

I don't think it would be of much consolation that the breaker is protecting the house wiring if an appliance shorts, overheats, catches fire, and burns the house down. Not likely, but it is certainly safer if the appliance is fused to protect its own wiring, or if its wiring is rated to match the house breaker. Certainly worth considering with a high current brewing system.

 

[iBrewR]

. . . it is certainly safer if the appliance is fused to protect its own wiring, or if its wiring is rated to match the house breaker. Certainly worth considering with a high current brewing system.

So, you'll be going around your house re-wiring all your lamps and other appliances with 14 gauge (or 12 gauge if plugged into a 20 amp circuit) cord?


Now, the dude on here that bypassed the internal fuse because it kept blowing ....... he has a problem.

 

[jeffmeh]

So, you'll be going around your house re-wiring all your lamps and other appliances with 14 gauge (or 12 gauge if plugged into a 20 amp circuit) cord?

Of course not. I said it would be safer, not that I would be willing to invest what is necessary to achieve zero risk. I also said that for a high current device it is worth considering. Perhaps you could cut the snark, and tell me what part of my prior statement is incorrect.

 

[trussell]

I don't think it would be of much consolation that the breaker is protecting the house wiring if an appliance shorts, overheats, catches fire, and burns the house down. Not likely, but it is certainly safer if the appliance is fused to protect its own wiring, or if its wiring is rated to match the house breaker. Certainly worth considering with a high current brewing system.

Generally many appliances such as this aren't left running unsupervised. Electric brewer or no I do have a ABC fire extinguisher in my shop so it the appliance in question did catch fire I can deal with it.

BTW if the appliance shorted it would suddenly draw a lot more current and would trip the main breaker for that circuit. Again not much of a problem.