Why is first batch best so far ?

[stupidwhitecat]

Why is it that my first batch of home brew is the best I’ve made so far? This baffles me the most after looking back knowing what I know now and recognizing all of the mistakes and faux pas I made. I still consider myself very much a beginner. I have been home brewing for just a little over a year and just did my sixth brew. I’m still doing extract brews, have moved from kits to my first attempt this weekend at my own recipe. While brewing this batch I cracked open one of the last remaining bottles from my first brew. After each brew I will set aside a six pack of each batch and put it away and open one on occasion. I try to remove the nostalgia of it being “my first brew” and look at it objectively as far as the clarity, taste, carbonation, etc. It amazes me the most looking back at how the brew went, I‘m not sure much actually went right. First I used dry yeast vs. liquid. I didn’t know that Easy Clean was not a sanitizer. That was all that came with my kit so that is what I used to clean (and sanitize) all of my equipment from brew to bottling. I attempted to use a 5 gal brew kettle to “boil” 3.5 gal of water on my electric range. It barely got to a simmer the whole time. It took me an hour and a half to cool the wort using my bath tub and ice. Now I have a propane burner and 10 gal kettle, a wort cooler, and know the difference between sanitizer and cleaner. Yet, to me it is the best brew I’ve done so far. And I’m not alone. Far and away it is the favorite of family and friends that I have shared most of my brews with. I’m not sure if it was beginners luck or what, but I’m hoping that my most recent brew turns out as good as the first.

 

[Braufessor]

There are a few possibilities -

1.) could be as simple as the fact that you like that "kind" of beer best. Have you brewed the same beer again? Or, have the other beers been different? Also, if you are not brewing consistently good kit beer, I would be hesitant to start making up your own recipes. At the very least, find tried and true recipes from others and put them together by buying ingredients.

2.) Dry vs. liquid yeast...... The dry yeast of today is actually very good, and there is a much higher yeast count in dry than liquid. If you are not going to make a starter for liquid yeast, you are better off with dry yeast.

3.) Sanitizing/cleaning - one of my first thoughts is this could be an issue somewhere. Your first batch is also the time when all of your equipment is new and clean. After that, any issues with sanitizing could become a real problem. In particular - sanitizing bottling bucket spigot (taking it COMPLETELY apart), auto siphons, tubing, bottling wand (TAKE IT APART), bottles, etc..... your equipment is never as clean as it was when it was new.

Those are a few thoughts that pop into my head.

 

[flars]

It could be that your first brew was one that would improve with a long bottle conditioning time.
It could be that your later brews are being consumed to young.

 

[Foosier]

Another thought is you might have gotten lucky with the fermentation temps for that first brew. Controlling fermentation temps makes a big difference in your brews. I would make sure you are able to keep to the low end of the yeasts preferred temp range as much as possible.

Also, the pitching rate as Braufessor mentioned is very important. Dry yeast is better if you don't use a starter. I did liquid yeast without a starter a few times and it worked, but I will say that it was not as good as batches where I used a starter (which is super easy to make.)

 

[akrawiec]

I always took a ton of notes while I brewed. Everyone has their own methods that work best for them and if you don't follow the same methods even following the same recipe you won't get beer that tastes the same. Also, don't forget about the water, I have well water high in carbonates so its great for dark beer but when I brew any pale ale I have to cut my water with distilled and mash hop to cut the mineral content and alkalinity.

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[JordanKnudson]

Also, don't forget about the water, I have well water high in carbonates so its great for dark beer but when I brew any pale ale I have to cut my water with distilled and mash hop to cut the mineral content and alkalinity.

I agree. Water is something that makes an incredible difference in your beer. I remember when I brewed my very first batch, I used store-bought spring water (I had no idea why I was doing so, as I didn't really have a handle on the concepts yet. I just had a vague idea after my first read-through of How to Brew that maybe that was a good idea). It turned out quite well, and I thought I was off and running. I brewed a second batch, again with store-bought water, but this time when I went to bottle it, I used tap water to create the priming solution. Thought nothing of it. The brew ended up tasting a little plastic-y, but I figured I had caused an infection or oxidized it along the way -- not that it could have been that small amount of tap water, that was just crazy! So I brewed a third batch, and this time I used straight, untreated tap water for the beer itself. Terrible. Tasted like full on melted plastic, and smelled just as bad. Turned out it was simply a matter of getting to know my water better, and treating it for the goals that I wanted to achieve. In that particular case I discovered that the cause was that my municipal water was treated with chloramines, which is a bit different than the mineral profile to which akrawiec is referring. The point is, your water can change your beer drastically. Sometimes you luck out and it just works for you. Other times it can wreck a whole batch. Most of the time, though, when you don't take control of your water, it just makes "blah" beer. Not bad, necessarily, just not that great taste that you had imagined and hoped for.

 

[stupidwhitecat]

Lots of good input here. I should back up first and say that none of the brews so far have been bad, just not AS good as my first brew.

I have thought about the length of time they have been bottle conditioning and that may play a role.

Another issue may be that trying to compare them objectively is difficult because every beer I did so far was a different style. I wanted to try a bunch of different styles but have not repeated any one yet.

I have used the liquid yeast only once as far as pitching straight from the pack. The other times I made a starter because they were higher gravity beers.

I don't think sanitizing is an issue. First I am very particular about sanitizing and cleaning. Yes everything is disassembled. I'm not getting any off flavors or smells that would indicate an infection.

Fermentation temp may play a role. Although I believe that they have always been in the acceptable range and I do monitor. However I am at the mercy of ambiant temp. I am in the south so no basement. Everything is fermented at room temp which can vary based on the season. But always between 70-75F.

I am also very particular about notes. I have a tablet program (BrewR- awsome program. Highly recommend)that I imput all of the batch ingredients in and also make notes on each batch.

As far as water that has been consistant throughout. I have city water only and do not know the quality. So I have always used bottled water.

 

[stupidwhitecat]

I agree. Water is something that makes an incredible difference in your beer. I remember when I brewed my very first batch, I used store-bought spring water (I had no idea why I was doing so, as I didn't really have a handle on the concepts yet. I just had a vague idea after my first read-through of How to Brew that maybe that was a good idea). It turned out quite well, and I thought I was off and running. I brewed a second batch, again with store-bought water, but this time when I went to bottle it, I used tap water to create the priming solution. Thought nothing of it. The brew ended up tasting a little plastic-y, but I figured I had caused an infection or oxidized it along the way -- not that it could have been that small amount of tap water, that was just crazy! So I brewed a third batch, and this time I used straight, untreated tap water for the beer itself. Terrible. Tasted like full on melted plastic, and smelled just as bad. Turned out it was simply a matter of getting to know my water better, and treating it for the goals that I wanted to achieve. In that particular case I discovered that the cause was that my municipal water was treated with chloramines, which is a bit different than the mineral profile to which akrawiec is referring. The point is, your water can change your beer drastically. Sometimes you luck out and it just works for you. Other times it can wreck a whole batch. Most of the time, though, when you don't take control of your water, it just makes "blah" beer. Not bad, necessarily, just not that great taste that you had imagined and hoped for.

This is interesting. Like I mentioned I have not noticed any off tastes or smells in any brews so far. But they may be subtle enough I haven't noticed them. Like you mentioned I use bottled water for the boil. But when making a starter or the priming solution I have always used tap water. I may need to try the next brew all bottled for every step.

 

[Braufessor]

Another issue may be that trying to compare them objectively is difficult because every beer I did so far was a different style. I wanted to try a bunch of different styles but have not repeated any one yet.

Fermentation temp may play a role. Although I believe that they have always been in the acceptable range and I do monitor. However I am at the mercy of ambiant temp. I am in the south so no basement. Everything is fermented at room temp which can vary based on the season. But always between 70-75F.

.

Well - these are two things that seem to narrow it down a bit. I think some/a lot of it could be the simple issue of comparing apples to oranges.

Fermentation temps - 70-75 is probably on the very high side, at best. If you are talking about ambient temperature being 70-75, then it is definitely too high. For most ales, you want the BEER temperature to be mid to upper 60's. The variation of seasons could very well be an issue - if your first beer was lucky enough to see mid 60's and others saw mid 70's, or higher (if we are talking temp. of beer which is warmer than the room it is sitting in)..... that could very well be an issue to look at.

Fermentation temperature is probably one of the most significant components to brewing consistently good beer. Sanitation, yeast count/health, temperature...... You get those issues down and you are well on your way to consistent beer. Don't have those 3 and you will almost never brew consistently good beer.

 

[Braufessor]

Also - what beers have you brewed? Just curious to the styles. May also play in with the effects of temperatures as some styles play nice with 70's and others don't.

 

[JordanKnudson]

Also - what beers have you brewed? Just curious to the styles. May also play in with the effects of temperatures as some styles play nice with 70's and others don't.

+1. Saisons, for example, would have no problems in this range (some people ferment them all the way up into the 90s, though not usually for the whole time). But if you were trying to brew something with a really clean yeast profile, the higher temp could get in the way.

 

[akrawiec]

Yeah fermenting in the 70s you might be getting esters or fusal alcohols giving your beer off flavors....on another note, if you have soft water or plan on using spring water you might give brewing with Belgian yeasts a try, they play nice in higher temps...some even up to 80 degrees but keep in mind Belgians are supposed to give off esters in the flavors so plan on getting banana or clove notes. Also keep in mind about your carbonation levels, if you over carb your beer or if you get oxygenation issues when you keg or bottle the beer will have cardboard flavors. I was lucky enough to score an old fridge and am using it to ferment in at a constant 65 degrees for most ales using a temp control box...having a constant temp is priceless when brewing if you don't mind having a fridge to ferment in.

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[stupidwhitecat]

Yes I wondered about the temps. I'm not sure what I can do about it. I am from PA originally. I miss basements for the cool temps and also the extra storage. I am in coastal NC now so we get a lot of heat/humidity obviously about 6 mons out of the year. The remainder are mild. But our house temp is always somewhere between 70-75 +/- a few degrees. In the summer the AC is on almost 24/7 to keep the house at 75. I don't want to even know what the electric bill would look like if we wanted to keep the temp in the 60's. We have a spare fridge in the garage. Would most fridges be able keep a temp in the 60's? That seems too warm.

As far as beers brewed so far, IPA, Double IPA, amber ale, kolsch. Doing another IPA now. The amber ale and the kolsch were the best. The two IPAs were good just not great. I will have to look back at my notes to see what was brewed when and see if there was a correlation to the time of year.

 

[JordanKnudson]

Were your IPAs from kits? I don't know why, but kit IPAs were always the least successful for me before I started making my own recipes. That's not to say that they aren't good inherently or that other people don't get great results, but *I* never had much luck with them, even with controlled water profiles and relatively stable mid-range temps for the yeast. They just came out "meh." I always thought it was weird. When I started making my own recipes, suddenly I was getting better results. I suppose it's probably just that I was able to tailor them to my own tastes a bit more, but it's just interesting to hear you say that your IPAs were "good just not great" too. (Sorry this is just an anecdote and not actual suggestions)

 

[stupidwhitecat]

Yes, everything up up until this point has been a kit. The brew I started this weekend is my first attempt at a recipe. It is also an IPA. The kit IPAs I had again were ok, totally drinkable just didn't impress me. The bitterness wasn't there for an IPA, neither were the hops aroma or the characteristic hop flavors.

 

[akrawiec]

Try using a specific bittering hop like warrior or magnum.

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[akrawiec]

Also are you using extract or all grain? Extract can be unpredictable because generally you end up with a blend of grains in extracts. All grain in the way to go....cheaper too just more time consuming but the beer is much better.

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[Braufessor]

From the sounds of everything, I think you are really doing alright. The one sort of "problem area" seems to be your fermentation temps. I would make that a priority. If at all possible, get a small chest freezer or dedicate a fridge and buy a temp. controller that will allow you to keep temps in that mid 60 range for your ales.
A couple thoughts if you have not quite found an IPA that meets expectations.
1.) experiment a bit with sulfate levels. You can do this simply with your already finished beer. Add .1-.2 grams of gypsum to a pint of your hoppy beers. Sulfate can help accentuate hops. This is about the right amount to mimic adding 100-200ppm of sulfate. If you find this makes a desirable difference, you may want to pursue some water additions for you hoppy beers.
Water is not usually a real big deal with extract because extract already has minerals in it and you do not need to worry about mash temp. Using RO or spring water is actually a good way to go with extract. However, very hoppy beers do benefit from 150-300ppm of sulfate, and if you don't have that level, your hoppy beers could end up sort of dull.
2.) Could just be that you have not found the right beer yet. Dead Ringer by Northern Brewer (they give recipes on line) is a very popular IPA kit - mimics Bells Two Hearted Ale.
3.) Check out some of the most popular, well received IPA recipes on HBT here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f69/

 

[JordanKnudson]

Water is not usually a real big deal with extract because extract already has minerals in it and you do not need to worry about mash temp. Using RO or spring water is actually a good way to go with extract.

I agree that RO/distilled or spring water is a good way to go with extract. It's not that water isn't a big deal with extract brewing, though. It's that, because it is nigh impossible to get the specific mineral profile information for the extract, you have no starting point from which to calculate additions. Thus, it's better to go with a nice clean water and hope that the extract's mineral profile suits the beer that you're making. But just to be clear, water is important in all brewing, it's simply that in extract brewing there are unknown variables (i.e. the extract's mineral content) that keep you from being able to do much about it beyond treat for unwanted chemicals.

Not to nitpick, sorry about that! I've just seen enough kits that tell you "If your water tastes good, it will make good beer" to feel that the clarification is needed.

 

[Braufessor]

I agree that RO/distilled or spring water is a good way to go with extract. It's not that water isn't a big deal with extract brewing, though. It's that, because it is nigh impossible to get the specific mineral profile information for the extract, you have no starting point from which to calculate additions. Thus, it's better to go with a nice clean water and hope that the extract's mineral profile suits the beer that you're making. But just to be clear, water is important in all brewing, it's simply that in extract brewing there are unknown variables (i.e. the extract's mineral content) that keep you from being able to do much about it beyond treat for unwanted chemicals.

Not to nitpick, sorry about that! I've just seen enough kits that tell you "If your water tastes good, it will make good beer" to feel that the clarification is needed.

I agree with everything you said. I have heard the "if it tastes good it is good to brew with" too...... My water tastes great. However, the 260 bicarbonate # causes all kinds of problems for brewing.

 

[Early8]

There is lots of great feedback on this thread. I would add one more thought from my own experience which doesn't sound like your issue. I find that when I get comfortable and start playing with recipes that I stray from the goal. Discipline when brewing rewards. If you change to many variables at once when you become comfortable can show itself in less successful beers. Keep it simple and stay on target. I find that full wort boils are very important. Chilling rapidly is very important. And fermentation temps to fit the yeast and style are absolutely important. Keep it simple and don't change to many variables at one time.


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[Pscdouglas]

It could be that your first brew was one that would improve with a long bottle conditioning time.
It could be that your later brews are being consumed to young.

THIS ^^

I still can't wait to try a batch even if it one I have brewed before and know about it's flavors and nuances. I am impatient. You are too. Best practice is to let beer age for at least a few weeks, and longer is better. Even the American IPA style is better left untouched for a few. The flavors work well when left to play together for a little while.

 

[akrawiec]

I would have to disagree about the chilling rapidly part...I've been brewing all grain for over a year now and use a wort chiller...whether it cools in 15 min or 45 min it makes no difference in how the beer tastes...one of the biggest myths out there is that you have to rapidly cool the wort after the boil. Oxygenation of the wort for the benefit of the yeast on the other hand isn't a myth but you don't need an oxygenation kit of that, just pour then wort over a colander and that'll add sufficient o2 into the wort prior to pitch.

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