Why do all of my beers have the same taste? WTF?

[culaslucas]

Ever since I've been kegging, all of my beers have the same taste to them. Honestly it tastes a little like apple juice mixed with starsan. Even the darker beers taste this way (except BK's Pirate Ale - the rum covers it up).

It's really making my beers undrinkable because they all have this off-flavor.

I ferment in both plastic and glass, several different of each. Use a 3 tier Sanke/Cooler/Sanke system. I sanitize with StarSan.

I've searched but had no luck. Any ideas?

 

[culaslucas]

wait.

I just got to thinking about my description of the taste. I store my starsan in thick plastic apple juice bottles (treetop) that I use for apfelwein. I've been doing this ever since I started brewing. Has anybody experienced off tastes from storing starsan in a similar way?

This really sucks, I feel like I've ruined the 40 gallons I have in the pipeline.

 

[Revvy]

Wow that was the quickest problem solving I have ever seen....

I was goign to suggest perhaps you had an infection throughout your kegging system..but it sounds like your issue is that you've been making batches of apfelstarsan and using that to sanitize your keg with.

Sorry about that. But at least we know with it being starsan, that it ISN'T my initial concern.

 

[culaslucas]

thanks Revvy (and Yuri)

As of the last 2 batches I've been using a corny keg and i'm still experiencing some of the 'apfelstarsan'. What do you guys store your starsan in?

What I don't get is how such a small amount of 'apfelstarsan' could impart such a strong taste on my beers. My cream ale honestly tastes like 1/2 apfelwein, 1/2 cream ale (i'm drinking it right now). There's no way a tablespoon of 'apfelstarsan' could do this is there?

 

[Yuri_Rage]

You must have accidentally deleted it, c. I restored it for you.

 

[Revvy]

I am not a kegger so I cannot really help figure out why beyond a possible infection you could get a bad taste throughout the system, or even if a tbs or two of apfelstarsan can get through their enough to affect it...but I do hear that people who buy kegs that were used to store rootbeer need to replace the o rings to truly get rid of the taste, so I am wondering if apfelwein soaked o rings could taint the beer.

Or even just some piece of rubber that is infused with it, that the beer passes through on the way to your glass.

Having said all that, and again, I really don't know kegs. I don't store all that much starsan...Usually just a quart spray bottle with distilled water, and a couple gallons here or there, that mix with distilled and store in "milk jugs" that I bought the distilled water in.

I do have a couple gallon apple jugs from my first batch of Apfelwein, that I used to store pre-boiled water in, and they all tasted or more like, smelled, like apple..EVEN filling them with oxyclean and letting them sit for a couple days. Apple is a b!tch to get rid of.

 

[adamjab19]

I've been having a lemoney type taste come out in my kegged beers. I naturally carbonate with 5oz of priming sugar. What do you carbonate with?

 

[Picobrew]

I've been having a lemoney type taste come out in my kegged beers. I naturally carbonate with 5oz of priming sugar. What do you carbonate with?

I sometimes have a lemony taste in my kegged beers - but only while they are still carbonating. After a bit of chill time (in the latest case, 1 more day), they tasted great.

 

[culaslucas]

Revvy you don't keg??? Blasphemy! J/k.

Adam - I force carbonate.

I just did a taste test of the Starsan in the corny vs in the apple juice containers. HOLY CRAP - the apple container one tastes like sour apple - like one of those Warhead candies.

Unbelievable. I never ever thought there could be such a pungent taste. I've been storing starsan in these bottles for over a year - who knew they could eff up all of my beers for the past year.

This blows - I'm pissed because I've thought my beer tastes like **** this whole time because I suck at brewing only to find out it's these damned apple juice bottles.

On the flip side of the coin, now I have hope that I'm not a ****ty brewer.

 

[Revvy]

Okay, more than likely you are not a ****ty brewer....Especially with 40 gallons under you belt...

The thing now is, what do you need to do to recondition the kegs if anything, or do you think it is JUST from racking your beer onto apfelstarsn soaked walls of your kegs, and your lines???

are any of your tainted kegs empty???can you do a sniff test or even run some water through it and smell/taste what comes through the system?

 

[chefmike]

I have been storing star san in a keg as well as a bucket. I find it easy to blow some star san through my BMBF/party tap/ into buckets or cleaned kegs.

on a lighter note... we aren't supposed to fear the foam... but many have learned to fear the apfelwine.... perhaps apfelwine has the power to turn star san to the dark side.... FEAR THE APFEL FOAM!!!!!!

 

[chefchris]

This thread makes me laugh. I saw the title and was gonna ask if you worked for Lagunitas ... *rim shot*

Then you solved your own problem, which was odd. Why does my beer taste like apple juice after I sanitize it? Wait .... I store my star san in apple juice bottles.

Awesome thread. Glad you got the problem fixed.

 

[culaslucas]

Okay, more than likely you are not a ****ty brewer....Especially with 40 gallons under you belt...

The thing now is, what do you need to do to recondition the kegs if anything, or do you think it is JUST from racking your beer onto apfelstarsn soaked walls of your kegs, and your lines???

are any of your tainted kegs empty???can you do a sniff test or even run some water through it and smell/taste what comes through the system?

Right - good points.

Boring Background: The first few batches didn't taste like Apfelsan (I just cracked open and drank a Dubbel, IPA and Haus Pale I've been storing for about a year - ) It was shortly after those that I made my first Apfelwein - looking back at my tasting notes I started noting these off flavors shortly thereafter - even in bottles. It seems so obvious now that the apple bottles from that apfelwein batch were causing the terribleness. I thought this was just a 'homebrew taste' or something I've been messing up and I've been putting homebrewing on the back burner for a while as a result - last time was like 5 months ago. I went apesh!t my first 8 months and brewed 85 gallons - 40 of which is still in my keezer waiting to be drank and 15 is still in the ferm closet (all apfelsanny mind you).

Conclusion: I have absolutely no extra kegs. I suppose I'll brew another batch soon - using NONAPFELSAN and see how it turns out. For the new batch I will be sure to smell the keg, do a 'hot water taste test', and replace my lines, o rings & poppets. If this solves my problem, I'm sad to report you will be seeing a lot more of me again.

Conclusion pt. 2. - I might have to recruit several bums to come drink all of this ****ty tasting beer so I can fill up my pipeline again.

Thanks for all of your help guys - you freaking rock.

 

[giligson]

One day I made a batch of star san and poured the gallon batch out into different containers - one of them used to contain welches grape juice. I will attest to the fact that the starsan smelled exactly like welches just a few days later.

 

[ahansler]

Are you sure you haven't over carbonated? Carbonic acid, in excess, can give the flavors you are describing.

I would brew a 10 gallon batch next time and force carb one keg and use priming sugar in the other. Or just bleed off your current keg and let it mellow for a while.

 

[oldschool]

Ever since I've been kegging, all of my beers have the same taste to them. Honestly it tastes a little like apple juice mixed with starsan. Even the darker beers taste this way (except BK's Pirate Ale - the rum covers it up).

It's really making my beers undrinkable because they all have this off-flavor.

I ferment in both plastic and glass, several different of each. Use a 3 tier Sanke/Cooler/Sanke system. I sanitize with StarSan.

I'm not sure if this had been mentioned, but C. Papazian talks about brewers developing a "house flavor" no matter what yeast they are using due to the type of environment in which they are brewed. Such as, wild yeast and bacteria only present in that particular area. I guess technically it's an infection. I guess you may have a different issue.

 

[ThickHead]

Great...now i am second-guessing using that freshly emptied apple juice jar that I boiled up last night to store my extra yeast washing water.

 

[Revvy]

Great...now i am second-guessing using that freshly emptied apple juice jar that I boiled up last night to store my extra yeast washing water.

Time for the sniff test.

That provokes a good guestion; Would apfelstasan and apfelyeast make for a better Apfelwein?

 

[ThickHead]

Time for the sniff test.

That provokes a good guestion; Would apfelstasan and apfelyeast make for a better Apfelwein?

Oh, the cap smelled like apples before I boiled it. The small piece of rubber under the cap is saturated I am sure. I am thinking of using bottled water for my extra water now. I am also second-guessing the 1 gallon glass bottle of apple juice I bought specifically for the glass jar (to use for brewing and bottling).....lol.

 

[Revvy]

Oh, the cap smelled like apples before I boiled it. The small piece of rubber under the cap is saturated I am sure. I am thinking of using bottled water for my extra water now. I am also second-guessing the 1 gallon glass bottle of apple juice I bought specifically for the glass jar (to use for brewing and bottling).....lol.

Yeah I remember how the caps of my juice bottles seem to hold it in the most. I have been storing the empty jugs open to keep them constantly airing out.

That's why I am wondering if O ring replacements are going to be neccessary for the OP.

 

[ThickHead]

Yeah I remember how the caps of my juice bottles seem to hold it in the most. I have been storing the empty jugs open to keep them constantly airing out.

That's why I am wondering if O ring replacements are going to be neccessary for the OP.

Good idea. I may go ahead and do the same after a good bleaching of the cap. I did a soak of the jar upside down (with the cap on of course) with PBW before the boil too. Still smelled of apples. Oh well, I'll just replace that half-gallon with bottled water during the wash. Shouldn't hurt things too much even though the bottled water wasn't boiled to remove oxygen.

 

[culaslucas]

Well my bottles were plastic - glass might be easier to clean.

I'm just going to play it safe and do full o ring replacements - no way am I going to chance this again.

I'm doubting it's excess carbonic acid - my beers are at 11psi. I had a leak on the air side of one of my kegs and poured a glass - was totally flat but still had the apple taste.

Regarding the apfelsan + apfelwein question - I did win first place at Dredhop last year for my Apfelwein. Very interesting

 

[Ohio-Ed]

Has anyone else had an issue with Apfelwein flavors in a keg after cleaning and re-using it? I just emptied a keg of Apfelwein and cleaned it to go back into use for my next batch of brew. I guess I could replace o-rings, poppets, etc or save it just for Apfelwein... any thoughts?