What's the big deal with kit brewing

[Kharnynb]

everyone can and should do what they want.

there's a difference in hopped extract(like your cooper's kits) and extract brewing, but you'll get into that when you want to customize your beers more(or not, whichever)

coopers has their own website, and forums with loads of modification recipies and fun change-ups that could keep you busy for years if you want to.

first tip with coopers and other "prehopped extract" kits, throw away the instructions and look online for advice. don't just add sugar to the kit, but add the matching dry or liquid malt extract.

 

[madscientist451]

by no means am I saying that my Coopers Lager is as good but I'm thoroughly enjoying drinking it...and I have two kids and enough time to do extract kits...

Enjoying drinking it? Enjoying brewing It? Tell the snobs to bugger off! (can we say that on HBT?) Seriously, ask those pushing all grain if you can stop by and try their creations so you can compare to what you are brewing. Bring some of yours along and you can see for yourself if its worth it.
When your kids are grown you'll have way more time for brewing and other hobbies, so do what you can for now and don't worry about it.

 

[cmac62]

You could do that with my extract vs all-grain version of the deception cream stout from the recipes section. The extract version is much better!

That being said, don't let money be whats holding you back from all-grain brewing. I love my setup and its literally:

10 gallon igloo cooler (add ball valve an some washers to make a mash tun)
Homemade immersion chiller (probably $25 total) and I chill 6 gallons to 68F in about 12-15 minutes
10 gallon aluminum stock pot from Amazon
Brew bag (for cooler mash tun)

Total: ~$125-150 dollars

Keep in mind that I now can order grain in bulk and only send about $15-25 per batch instead of extract batches that used to be $30-40.

Trog, the only issue I have is with the aluminum pot. I would spring for the SS just to be on the safe side.

I started brewing at my LHBS, with his equipment (except the bucket, capper & bottling equip), but I have had some really good extract beers and I know my taste buds aren't overly fussy. If it is beer (decent at least) I'll drink it. Especially if I made it.

 

[TwistedGray]

Enjoying drinking it? Enjoying brewing It? Tell the snobs to bugger off! (can we say that on HBT?) Seriously, ask those pushing all grain if you can stop by and try their creations so you can compare to what you are brewing. Bring some of yours along and you can see for yourself if its worth it.

That's what we have the FotHB thread for Homebrew trading

 

[troglodytes]

Trog, the only issue I have is with the aluminum pot. I would spring for the SS just to be on the safe side.

I hear you and many people are split on the ss vs aluminum. But I'll tell you I have done over 30 batches in this kettle and the only thing I could ever have a complaint about is the fact that when brewing outdoors in the winter it takes more to get to boiling (due to heat exchange).

Its been pretty well established there is no danger as long as you get that nice oxidized coating, and at this point, my kettle very well oxidized.

That said, I would definitely go with ss if I had the budget, but I anyways seem to find a new addition to get/make for my brew house before splurging on a new kettle, while my current one is still going like a champ.

 

[Justin Archer]

And we're off to the races!

View attachment 560354

I think we shopped the same sale. I only have the Belgian left, though. That Swig of Sunbeams is great, dude! A lot of positive from my buddies. And I can’t stop drinking them. The stout is in the bottles for a week today and I couldn’t wait so tried one last night. Coming along very nicely. I am getting a lot of coffee up front with a nice semi sweet chocolate finish.

Edit: just realize you had a different Belgian than me. I have a relaxed brain.

 

[TwistedGray]

View attachment 560364

I think we shopped the same sale. I only have the Belgian left, though. That Swig of Sunbeams is great, dude! A lot of positive from my buddies. And I can’t stop drinking them. The stout is in the bottles for a week today and I couldn’t wait so tried one last night. Coming along very nicely. I am getting a lot of coffee up front with a nice semi sweet chocolate finish.

That's alarmingly scary!

With that said I also have another IPA, pale ale, and enough stuff to make a few sours, too.

 

[Justin Archer]

That's alarmingly scary!

With that said I also have another IPA, pale ale, and enough stuff to make a few sours, too.

I’ve been wanting to do a saison soon.

 

[LittleRiver]

... I have two kids and enough time to do extract kits...where I would not have the time to do all grain...so my question is why does everyone that brews constantly push all grain???? Or you're a cheater if your extract brewing...

I agree with everyone else, brew the way that makes YOU happy. There is nothing wrong with extract brewing.

I think you're over estimating the time it will take you to brew all grain. It can be very comparable to the time required for extract brewing.

One thing not mentioned yet in this discussion is that all grain brewing is fun. I think you would really like it.

All grain gives you complete control over your recipe and the final taste of your beer. You do have some control with extract, but not to the same level that you have with all grain. Making an analogy to cooking, it's like the difference between buying a piece of meat that is packaged pre-seasoned ready-to-cook, vs selecting a fresh cut of meat and seasoning and preparing it your way. There is a satisfaction in learning the craft of it, as well as a satisfaction in the final product.

All grain brewing does not have to be expensive, complicated, or time consuming. You do not need an expensive or complicated rig to brew all grain.

Read up on BIAB (brew in a bag). It is an elegantly simple, inexpensive, and fun way to do all grain brewing. My last BIAB brew day was 4hrs start to finish (everything cleaned up). I didn't take any shortcuts, I did a one hour full volume mash, a one hour boil, and I milled my own grains.

Some folks are successful in doing shorter mashes and boils, but I don't feel the need to do that. While the mash water is heating up I grind my grains, weigh my hops, and get organized. During the mash I do other things (yard work, go run errands, etc). During the boil I get the fermenter cleaned up and sanitized, get my chiller ready, etc.

If you like extract brewing you will probably like all grain brewing even more. It's fun.

 

[TGFV]

Coopers kits can keep you busy and entertained for batches forever, while your own extract recipes can lower costs significantly for a few more minutes time.

I use coopers kits for roughly 75% of my beers because the kits are 15$ where I live and all I need is 3-4$ in specialty grains or fruit, a kilo of either Pilsen or light DME and yeast slurries I have been saving for generations (unless doing a new style). There are so many styles and innovations to do with them that you can have 4-5 planned recipes that you end up ignoring the last few because even more have caught your eye. You can also easily branch into grafs and braggots with no problems.

The only shortcoming I find is doing sours and low ibu saisons, for those I always do scratch extract recipes.

 

[TwistedGray]

Making an analogy to cooking, it's like the difference between buying a piece of meat that is packaged pre-seasoned ready-to-cook, vs selecting a fresh cut of meat and seasoning and preparing it your way. There is a satisfaction in learning the craft of it, as well as a satisfaction in the final product.

I disagree with your analogy because even an extract brewer can build his own recipes. I think if I were to make an analogy to meat it would be more like, "Extract brewing is like buying a sirloin steak whereas all grain brewing is like buying a cow."

 

[C.N. Brewer]

I say brew what you like, I started with ingredients kits and have been working on making my own recipes recently. I love extract brewing, it’s a lot of fun. Home brewing is an awesome hobby, and you can do it anyway you like.

 

[TwistedGray]

I say brew what you like, I started with ingredients kits and have been working on making my own recipes recently. I love extract brewing, it’s a lot of fun. Home brewing is an awesome hobby, and you can do it anyway you like.

Agreed

There's nothing preventing an exact brewer from making amazing beers

 

[VTX1300]

I have had awesome extract beer and some all grain that were just awful. All depends upon the details. I do all grain because i enjoy the challenge of mastering the entire process from grain to glass. Like all have said here, do what works for you and enjoy they hobby.

 

[Mismost]

They just put in a craft brew pub here in town. I stopped by and tried a flight of their beers. A friend was there and told the guy I made good beers and wines. Owner wanted to sample them, so I took a few up there. He loved them and offered me a job! I didn't need a job. When we started talking about HOW i made it....extract with a bit of grains, mini mash extract style. He said that wasn't real brewing. I said really? You loved it just a minute ago. It's an attitude...my way or the highway.

My brew day takes about hour on day one, 20 minutes on day two, and then however long I wish to ferment, clear before bottling. I do not have a entire day to spend watch crap boil in a pot and hoping I get just the right amount of efficiency. I break about every rule in the book and still make beer that folks like to drink. Extract is easy, I like easy.

 

[troglodytes]

On one hand, its kind of a jerk move saying its not real brewing..because it is. But on the other hand, if he runs a business I'm sure there are various reasons (batch cost, control of wort fermentability, final SRM in light beers) why they can't brew extract brews, so if you did get a job as a brewer there you'd have to learn their system. But lets be honest, if any of us homebrewers got a job as a pro brewer, we would have to go through the same learning curve.

 

[Jako]

one of the guys at my LHBS let me try a extract beer he just made... i was the best beer i think i have ever had. it was a double IPA with all the hops added in at flame out then a tonnnnnn of cryo hops in the dry hop. it was also fermented with a wine yeast i forget the strain but it was amazing.

 

[NGD]

They just put in a craft brew pub here in town. I stopped by and tried a flight of their beers. A friend was there and told the guy I made good beers and wines. Owner wanted to sample them, so I took a few up there. He loved them and offered me a job! I didn't need a job. When we started talking about HOW i made it....extract with a bit of grains, mini mash extract style. He said that wasn't real brewing. I said really? You loved it just a minute ago. It's an attitude...my way or the highway.

My brew day takes about hour on day one, 20 minutes on day two, and then however long I wish to ferment, clear before bottling. I do not have a entire day to spend watch crap boil in a pot and hoping I get just the right amount of efficiency. I break about every rule in the book and still make beer that folks like to drink. Extract is easy, I like easy.

Real question is, how were his beers?

I’m jealous that you can wrap up your brewing process in an hour. Still takes me 2.5-3hrs to get from fill up to pitching. Still I enjoy the process and the results.

 

[Randomnoob]

So I'm brand new to brewing I 've done a total of 2 batches 1 I've been drinking (coopers Lager) and turned out great!!! The other (Coopers Real Ale) is still in the FV. But the couple people I know that brew are already asking or telling me you need to do all grain...now I've had all grain brews and by no means am I saying that my Coopers Lager is as good but I'm thoroughly enjoying drinking it...and I have two kids and enough time to do extract kits...where I would not have the time to do all grain...so my question is why does everyone that brews constantly push all grain???? Or you're a cheater if your extract brewing...

I like doing my all grain brews, but right now I have a new baby at home and homebrewing time is very short so I stick to doing extract recipes. I do have a few all grains planned ahead in the year to come but otherwise, I'm working on converting my favorite recipes to extracts. Not a big deal and they still make tasty beers. The only thing I don't like about extract beers is the price. All-Grain is cheaper.

 

[troglodytes]

I like doing my all grain brews, but right now I have a new baby at home and homebrewing time is very short so I stick to doing extract recipes. I do have a few all grains planned ahead in the year to come but otherwise, I'm working on converting my favorite recipes to extracts. Not a big deal and they still make tasty beers. The only thing I don't like about extract beers is the price. All-Grain is cheaper.

Our daughter is now 1 year old and on a regular sleep schedule, so guess who now has 8PM to 7AM free. I do my brewing at night and its aprice I'm will to pay timewise because its saves me cost over extract and I generally tend to do a 80% of my beers as very dry finishers, saisons, dry pale ales, etc. So I mash really low and usually finish at and FG of 1.004 to 1.012. I've had problems getting extract brews to finish lower 6 to 8 points higher than that, which sucks when your brewing a saison you want to finish as close to 1.000 as possible.

 

[NGD]

The only thing I don't like about extract beers is the price. All-Grain is cheaper.

I hear this reason quite a bit, but I have a hard time getting the reason through my thick head. Most extract kits are $4-13 higher in price and add something along the lines of 1-3hrs to your brew day. Your time has to be pretty cheap to make up the difference.
On the flip side, I get the attraction of tweaking every aspect of your brew to differentiate it. Its fun and obviously a labor of love. It allows one to produce a beer that is completely unique to them and their brewinf style. Money however is not saved with all-grain.

I view kegging vs. bottling the same way. I bottle some so I can share, not because its faster or better (although belgians and stouts do seem better bottled conditioned)

 

[govner1]

I hear this reason quite a bit, but I have a hard time getting the reason through my thick head. Most extract kits are $4-13 higher in price and add something along the lines of 1-3hrs to your brew day. Your time has to be pretty cheap to make up the difference.
On the flip side, I get the attraction of tweaking every aspect of your brew to differentiate it. Its fun and obviously a labor of love. It allows one to produce a beer that is completely unique to them and their brewinf style. Money however is not saved with all-grain.

I view kegging vs. bottling the same way. I bottle some so I can share, not because its faster or better (although belgians and stouts do seem better bottled conditioned)

As someone that started as an AG brewer I agree re the cost of extract kits. But, keep in mind that a lot of the work & time involved have already been done.
Yes, AG may be “cheaper” but you need to consider the cost of equipment needed for AG, I.e., Mash Tun, HLT, extra heat source, etc.

I’ve done a few partial mash brews on group brew days when it was impractical to move my system and made some good brews.

Keeping in mind the learning curve, limited resources, space, etc. it is a perfectly good way and ultimately less expensive way to start brewing.

 

[mxstar21]

Extract beers are a great way to go if you don't feel like going all-grain. Going with a good yeast strain and adding steeping grains can make a world of difference.

 

[Kharnynb]

If you buy kits anyway, the price difference is very little, once you start buying bulk grain, it is a lot more.

But in the end it's a time and energy issue, if you want to be quicker, with less equipment and don't mind paying a bit more per brew, go extract.
If you want to go into more detailed malt bills, do more yourself and like to do own recipes, all-grain wins out.