Normally when I do BIAB, I remove and squeeze the bag and place it in a steel crate which sits on the brew kettle. I then pour 170-degree water over the bag until I reach about 6 gallons for pre-boil volume. 3 batches ago I had two straight batches that stopped at 1.020. I mash around 152. No extra non-fermentables in there. Should I be pouring 200-degree water on the bag or stick with 170? I don't want tannins, but I'd like a more fermentable wort. The grains were double crushed in all instances and I use PH stabilizer which usually helps with my efficiency as well. I just want to know what temp water you use to pour over the grains if that is part of your BIAB process. Thanks. My most recent batch had pretty bad efficiency as I only got 1.044 OG (recipe called for 1.055), but it did ferment down to 1.012 at least.
What water temp for sparge?
- Thread starter eadavis80
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I think the sweet spot for sparge water is 168-170°. I don't think you want to go over 170.
I always sparge with 168 or so. Unless you are doing a mash out where you want to raise the grain bed temperature to 170 to stop the enzymatic process, IMO the temperature of the sparge is not critical. You are just washing the remaining sugars out of the grain. In a homebrew setting you are unlikely to meet the temperature and pH levels that would extract tannins. So that is not much of a concern.
If you are using the 5.2 pH stabilizer, from what I hear, ditch it. It seems it doesn't really work.
Efficiency hits in BIAB are almost always traced to a poor crush of the grain.
If you are using the 5.2 pH stabilizer, from what I hear, ditch it. It seems it doesn't really work.
Efficiency hits in BIAB are almost always traced to a poor crush of the grain.
Any temperature below 170 works for sparging.
Your low FG is most likely not related to your sparge temps and more likely your mash temps.
Check your thermometer lately?
Your low FG is most likely not related to your sparge temps and more likely your mash temps.
Check your thermometer lately?
Alright - I'll stick with 170 or less for sparge water. Just weird that 2 batches had good OG's and high FG's and then the next one had a low OG but a good FG. Whatever - it's still 15 gallons of decent beer for football season - Aletoberfest, Oatmeal/Coffee/Vanilla stout and Brown Ale.
SlitheryDee
General Manager
I keep an induction cooking plate in my shed for heating sparge water. It never really gets over about 140F, but I figure that's good enough. People say that cold water is good enough, but I like my sparge water to be hot to cut down on the time it takes to come to a boil later.
Yep, you can sparge with cold water if you want, but it takes longer to get the wort to a boil that way.
Sparge water temperature doesn't matter at all, as long as it's not too hot (over 190 or so as a guess).
BigJoeBrew
Well-Known Member
I brewed yesterday and do a dunk sparge with hot temp water from the tap. 120ish degrees, works everytime. Remember the starches have already been converted, you are just rinsing the sugars off of the grains. I feel dunk sparge surrounds the grains again, and gives a good rinse. Not sure that if the pour over always gives the same results.
Yeah, usually I get pretty decent efficiency with this strategy and usually get a decent FG out of the brews - just kind of funny on these last few, but whatever. I guess I'll just be sure to mash a little lower to get more fermentable wort next time (as I did on my last brew). Maybe I was a little higher on my mash on the ones with the better OG's, but the disappointing FG's. As for the PH stabilizer, I know a lot of people say it's worthless, but I've done much better with my efficiencies overall since I've used it and since it's only $1/batch, I figure why not.
If you don't get off flavors from it ( I did), you could continue to use it but it shouldn't impact your efficiency at all. Something else is going on if your efficiency is increasing. Your conversion efficiency shouldn't be changed by whether or not you use that stuff (or any other 'stuff') if your pH is at all in range. Since it can't correct your pH, there is some other reason if it's your conversion efficiency that is improved. If it's brewhouse efficiency that is improved, that's due to better/more efficient lautering or sparging or less kettle losses. Again, that's good but not due to using 5.2 stabilizer.
Dude, you need to be careful just sparging to reach a certain pre-boil volume. If you make a light beer you're in danger of over-sparging. If you're trying to make a strong beer, you're likely to leave wort sugars behind.
As for sparge temps, I'd say anything between low mash temps to 168F.
Here are some podcasts about mashing that I like to recommend for threads like these: Part 1, Part 2.
As for sparge temps, I'd say anything between low mash temps to 168F.
Here are some podcasts about mashing that I like to recommend for threads like these: Part 1, Part 2.
What do you mean that I "need to be careful just sparging to reach a certain pre-boil volume"? My kettle is only 8 gallons so I use about 6 gallons with the mash on a 9-11 pound grain bill. That's what I can fit. Then, I remove the bag and sparge over the bag to get to 6 pre-boil gallons. Is this wrong? It's generally worked fine. I'm confused and hoping you can help me out here.
Sparging water temperature is not really that critical. Many brewers assume that using sparging water that is too hot will extract tannins, but that's not really true since brewers have been decocting (boiling) their mash for centuries and they don't have tannins. I tend to use sparging water temps in the 160F to 180F range.
The thing that I find is most likely to pull tannins and silicates out of your grain and into your wort is oversparging or allowing the runoff gravity to fall too low. This issue shouldn't be likely for BIAB brewers.
The thing that I find is most likely to pull tannins and silicates out of your grain and into your wort is oversparging or allowing the runoff gravity to fall too low. This issue shouldn't be likely for BIAB brewers.
Because you can oversparge or undersparge if your beer is supposed to be very low gravity or very high gravity. Oversparging can allegedly lead to off-flavors if you get too carried away. Undersparging will just lead to a weaker beer than you'd like, you'd end up leaving good sugars in the grain. Generally if you are making beer that isn't at either extreme you should be fine. Just something to keep in mind.
I'm sure you have your equipment dialed in so you aren't going to overfill a kettle or anything.
Didn't mean to be confusing.
Using a mash/sparge water [Edit] calculator you can add enough acid to your sparge water to prevent leaching tannins. As long as you keep the mash pH under 5.8 you are pretty free with your temps. I prefer to mash out (denaturalize alpha and especially beta amylase) to lock in my sugar profile when brewing beers for which I want to limit attenuation. In that scenario, when sparging, it is very important to raise the grain bed to that mashout temp (170F) as soon as possible. 190-195F sparge water maybe needed to get to that!
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"Limiting my attenuation" is/was not my problem. My beer didn't attenuate ENOUGH. Secondly, this is BIAB - thus there is no "grain bed", right? Are you saying I should use sparge water of 190 degrees to get the pre-boil volume up to 170 BEFORE eventually raising to boil temps? Everyone else said I can rinse with pretty much any temp water I want as long as it was BELOW 170.
In my experience the mash PH for darker beers is more important than the sparge temp. I am a 170 guy for sparge temps, but see efficiency problems when making a dark beer due to not controlling mash PH. Beer is super clear but wildly inefficient and poorly attenuating.
thunderwagn
Well-Known Member
Are you sure the issue is your sparge technique? Are you sure your mash temps are correct?
I agree that sparge technique/temp has nothing to do with OP's attenuation issues. Those could be recipe related, mash temp related, or yeast/fermentation related (underpitch, lack of viability, insufficient aeration at pitch, etc.)
Sparge temp has nothing to do with the low efficiency of batch no. 3. Sparge technique may have played a role, but it could also be due to mash temp being off, mash time too short, and/or crush too coarse.
Brew on
TheBrewBrotha
Hoppy Beer, Hoppy Life #WeBeBrewin
Aim for sparge temp of 170f or lower. I know buddies who sparge with room temp water with no ill effect. I only Squeeze my brew bag but use to sparge before the whole "tannin extraction" myth was debunked practically. As for the stabilizer? Ditch it! It's crap. Only stabilizes at 5.2 if your mash pH is already at 5.2 to begin with... in most cases it's not. Brew with RO or distilled water and add salts/minerals to (in some cases added acid malt) to get into the 5.2-5.6 pH range. A good, calibrated pH meter will help a lot.
nh_homebrew
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So my hot water is 110 Fahrenheit. This should do right?
Yes, but you may need to acidify it if it has significant alkalinity.
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homebrewer_99
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LOL! I Batch Sparge. I use 190-200F water. I've never had a tannin issue when batch sparging. It's your MASH that shouldn't go above 170F, not the water.
The only time I did have tannins issues was with fly sparging...
The only time I did have tannins issues was with fly sparging...
Tannins come from pH being too high and/or over sparging (final run-off SG less than about 0.010.) If taking the mash over 170 caused tannins, in the absence of high pH, then all decocted brews would be full of tannins (portions of the mash are raised to ~212°F by boiling.)
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homebrewer_99
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Tannins come from pH being too high and/or over sparging (final run-off SG less than about 0.010.) If taking the mash over 170 caused tannins, in the absence of high pH, then all decocted brews would be full of tannins (portions of the mash are raised to ~212°F by boiling.)
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Yes, I know the decoction process boils wort and grain and produce no tannins.
Yes, I know tannins come from oversparging. I got them every time I Fly Sparged even though my sparge water was never above 168F. I went back to Batch Sparging and never had another tannin issues.
My reply had to do with posters saying sparge water temp was an issue. I simply stated I sparge with 200F water with no issues.
As for pH...I never measure it.
Why would you squeeze the bag before you pour the sparge liquor over the COMPACTED grains? Pull the bag and start sparging immediately.
Because the less sugar in the bag when you start sparging, the better your lauter efficiency will be. This is easily proven mathematically. However, either method still can make good beer, and efficiency isn't the most important thing in brewing. Use whichever process you find most convenient for you, and gives you good results. Just don't delude yourself about performance metrics.
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I'd like to see the math.....The technical bulletin from the MBAA on high gravity brewing uses the sparge from the first mash for the strike liquor for the second mash,so I think your full of S@#$. Also I believe stuck sparges are caused by compacted grain beds ,so a squeezed bag is super compacted.and the sparge liquor most likely just goes on the outside not the center of the bag.
One thing to consider her is if you don't raise the actual mash to 168 before the sparge your 170 sparge water isn't changing the grain instantly to 170, it’s around 155 to 160 really so unless you do a true mash out nothing will go wrong
