Welding is not so hard

[BrewBeemer]

Don't let some of these guys fool ya. If you go with a gas set up, you do not have to change your wire. Flux core lays down even nicer with gas. I have welded for the Navy for years on heavy equipment, thin car body, and steel structure. The best advice would be to talk to a salesman at a reputable welding supply shop. They often times have more knowledge with the different types of wire, filler rod, and welding electrodes then do many welders. Just remember that is their job. That said, they will open your mind to all kinds of other possibilities to maximize your welding experience for your buck. Use them as a resource and if they steer you wrong let them know and often times they will make it right if it is with in their power. Welding should be fun, so enjoy it.

A very old thread here but I must add to slnies reply. These days your local welding supply house salesmen come and go faster than a Chinese food delivery driver, know less than crap about hands on welding including repeating word for word a manufactured product printed list flaws included off the spec sheets. I'm talking 3 out of 5 welding supply places I used to deal with in my area for my company. They pay them crap, I rate them just below a new car salesman but they can tell you how many cup holders a vehicle has, BFD. Make a sale going in blind your on your own unless you have hands on with a tradesman welder not a DIY welder. Going in knowing what you want and expect in a welder will increase your enjoyment in this expensive tool investment.

 

[hoppingmad]

Well, there you go.. More fantastic information that I did not know. I have a MIG that I have been using for years, and i have been paying the rental on a tank of Argoshield that only gets used 2-3 times a year. I also own my C02 tank, but never knew I could use it as a shielding gas. I am off to turn in the Argoshield tank tomorrow, and pick up another C02 tank. I wanted a spare tank anyway, and now I can own it rather than renting it, weld and have a spare tank for the kegereator!

Thanks heaps guys!

 

[BrewBeemer]

For the price of refills get the largest bottle you can as it will pay for itself rather quickly. They charge a lot more per/cu/ft on those small bottles when a large one could of been filled. It also depends on how much you weld. I was refilling my Argon 280 cu/ft bottle 5 times a year one time before I slowed down in life and changed companies. That was 1,400 cu/ft of Argon a busy year after work and on weekends. The same with Mig but then your wanting to use the bottle also for your brewing so that blows the 280 cu/ft bottle size plus the C-25 gas mix vs straight Co2. C-25 has less splatter and pays for itself in cleanup time alone. It fits my Mig welder perfectly plus I still have a brand new twin bottle rack for the Miller. I now have four 20# Co2 bottles for brewing, gave one away to a friend in need. May trade off a spare 280 cu/ft helium plus oxygen bottle for a large Nitro for the Stouts. O/A I'll keep in the "Q" owner owned size, no need for a big oxygen bottle and cutting torch with a plasma cutter. Welding supply shops like those lease I call sucker bottles as months become years fast before you figure it out a lot of time and money has pasted by, money towards owning your own bottles lost. This helps keep the behind the counter people paid. A rather large turnover these days not like 30 years ago. Back then you were on first name walking thru the door with a free rod sample or a lens. This is why you can not beat a company like www.cyberweld.com these days on their prices.

 

[slnies]

A very old thread here but I must add to slnies reply. These days your local welding supply house salesmen come and go faster than a Chinese food delivery driver, know less than crap about hands on welding including repeating word for word a manufactured product printed list flaws included off the spec sheets. I'm talking 3 out of 5 welding supply places I used to deal with in my area for my company. They pay them crap, I rate them just below a new car salesman but they can tell you how many cup holders a vehicle has, BFD. Make a sale going in blind your on your own unless you have hands on with a tradesman welder not a DIY welder. Going in knowing what you want and expect in a welder will increase your enjoyment in this expensive tool investment.

BrewBeemer, you must have some poor welding shops around where you live. Most of the people at our locale welding supply shops have been there for years and provide a great resource. S.

 

[Brewers Hardware]

For the price of refills get the largest bottle you can as it will pay for itself rather quickly. They charge a lot more per/cu/ft on those small bottles when a large one could of been filled. It also depends on how much you weld. I was refilling my Argon 280 cu/ft bottle 5 times a year one time before I slowed down in life and changed companies. That was 1,400 cu/ft of Argon a busy year after work and on weekends. The same with Mig but then your wanting to use the bottle also for your brewing so that blows the 280 cu/ft bottle size plus the C-25 gas mix vs straight Co2. C-25 has less splatter and pays for itself in cleanup time alone. It fits my Mig welder perfectly plus I still have a brand new twin bottle rack for the Miller. I now have four 20# Co2 bottles for brewing, gave one away to a friend in need. May trade off a spare 280 cu/ft helium plus oxygen bottle for a large Nitro for the Stouts. O/A I'll keep in the "Q" owner owned size, no need for a big oxygen bottle and cutting torch with a plasma cutter. Welding supply shops like those lease I call sucker bottles as months become years fast before you figure it out a lot of time and money has pasted by, money towards owning your own bottles lost. This helps keep the behind the counter people paid. A rather large turnover these days lot like 30 years ago. Back then you were on first name walking thru the door with a free rod sample or a lens. This is why you can not beat a company like Cyberweld.com - Welding Supplies - Miller, Hobart & More these days on their prices.

+1 on this.

I recently got a TIG welder and bought a 20cuft bottle. First, that's useless because it's like 90-120 minutes of gas is all, but it cost me like $17 to fill it with Argon. I bought a 94cuft bottle right away and it only cost like $25 to fill.

 

[Homercidal]

I bought a Lincoln A/C MIG wilder for working on my Mustang, and love it. I've had to replace the heat range switches though, so be careful about abusing the duty cycle on those. They are meant for home and hobby, not for continuous welding.

I've never used gas WITH the flux, but might try it. Also, my welder requires that I swap the leads on the inside if I go from flux to MIG, and also flip the feed roller to accomodate the thicker wire (I use the thinnest wire I can for the sheet metal on the car body)

Welding is so much fun. I spent many hours trying different heats and feed rates for each different metal thickness. I even got my 12 yo daughter on it and she thought it was cool too. She gave it a few tries and then welded her name on the face of a piece of cast off sheet metal. I'd like to get her good enough to help out with the car, just to say that she helped weld it. I'm sure we'll get there!

 

[Homercidal]

Also, if you want to practice, look for a scrap metal recycling place nearby. They will have great prices on scrap that you can use for home projects or for just playing with.

As soon as I get my new compressor, I'm going to start building that new brewing rig!

 

[BrewBeemer]

BrewBeemer, you must have some poor welding shops around where you live. Most of the people at our locale welding supply shops have been there for years and provide a great resource. S.

When Airgas purchased all the smaller local welding supply stores everything changed in my area. Gone the good sales people that knew their equipment for 20-30 years. Example extended tapered tips for the Miller 251, "sorry sir not availabe". Ended up with a different manufacture of tips, mounted in a collet on the lathe and made tapered tips for the smaller nozzle I run for tight header exhaust X crossovers. Over $3,428 for one Miller Mig without sales tax, 28 miles away same welder $2,506 after tax out the door. Support your local welding supply my azz. I can see why Cyberwelds came alone. Local supply personnel they are come and go people as before the takeover the sales people knew what would adapt or fit even with a little machining on my end and they knew ya by first name. One place I got many supplies and welders from gave me out of their old $50 off trade in box 3 Victor Tig / Mig flow gauges ball type and a 100 series set of regulators complete with gauges. Just needed rebuild kits. I did a little electrical work for their welding test bench area adding plugs and breakers a win win thing. Those were the good old days not now.
I already got a bad bottle of Argon from Airgas, welded like crap until I borrowed a friends bottle thinking it was me on a "off day". Took that 280 back for another owner exchange. Not light weight these 280's plus my travel time and gasoline.
Done ranting.

 

[BrewVegas]

Over a year ago I bought one of these cheap-o all in one devices:

Link to eBay: Click Here

The plasma cutting feature worked very well for cutting off the tops of my kegs. The stick was too complicated for me to use to build by stand, so I got a $99 mig welder that did the trick.

I've experimented for hours with the TIG feature but can't get the AMPs setting right. Besides the knob on the machine, I don't see a way to control the amount/force of the arc while tigging. There is no foot pedal attachment. It seems like I either have it turned up too much and blow a hole thru the SS or I have it turned down and barely get it glowing and the filler rod just clumps on top of the SS.

I should have put up some real money to get a name brand device, but it wasn't in the budget (and still isn't).

Does anyone have a similar device that has used the TIG feature to attach SS couplings to a keg?

Thanks...

 

[BrewBeemer]

Yes but you would not like even the price I paid for my Tig back 1991 for a fully loaded every option available Miller 350 Synchrowave Tig welder. When done with including custom made stick stinger leads, cooler lines and cooling pump I built, HD foot control, wet Tig torch I was at $4,237 back in 91. Company side job welding on weekends paid for the welder within 7 months plus a 3 year tax write off on top. A positive money making machine by thousands of dollars after the 3 year writeoff. It never left my shop. The replacement model called Synchrowave 350LX does not have the extra features my older welder has plus without adding the stinger leads and other custom options I added and Miller's list price has you at $7,832 before taxes. Go to; www.cyberweld.com for the best prices but you should try many different machines and models besides manufactures then decide what fits your needs, wants and wallet. This is a tough one these days as the prices have gone crazy. Hope this heped. Another seperate story I again got lucky on with a brand new Miller 251 Mig machine.
REMEMBER YOU ASKED.

 

[whitescout]

Quote "I've experimented for hours with the TIG feature but can't get the AMPs setting right. Besides the knob on the machine, I don't see a way to control the amount/force of the arc while tigging. There is no foot pedal attachment. It seems like I either have it turned up too much and blow a hole thru the SS or I have it turned down and barely get it glowing and the filler rod just clumps on top of the SS."


I hat to ask, but are you sharpening the tungsten to a point? Also, what size tungsten are you using? If you are not sharpening your tungsten, you will never be able to control the arc. You should be able to pin point the arc. Usually when the tungsten gets contaminated, or the tip gets burnt, you can no longer control the arc.

Try reading on this site for a little bit. Miller - Resources - TIG Handbook

 

[BrewBeemer]

Dang it double reply again, skip it.

 

[BrewBeemer]

I bought a Lincoln A/C MIG wilder for working on my Mustang, and love it. I've had to replace the heat range switches though, so be careful about abusing the duty cycle on those. They are meant for home and hobby, not for continuous welding.

That must be a Lincoln DC Mig machine. Sorry boss but heat range switches suck plain and simple in welders. Too hot, too cold a control knobs is a lot better machine to dial in especially on light gauge materials. Never switch under load you'll arc weld the contacts internally in the welders switch. Duty cycle also comes into play on these little home units rated at 20% not the industrial standard of 60%. I will not run flux core in my Mig machine or use it on the job site, now early retired no worries. One time my electrictrical contractor mentioned it would bring flux core on the job site for me., I got into it and brought in my own 280 bottle. The shop paid for the refills with their machine plus the solid wire I ordered. I can truly say i've owned Miller's Hobart's and Lincoln welding machines in Mig and Tig. I now only own Tig and Mig machines "powered by blue", Millers. There is a reason, some call it a chebbie / Ford thing. Certain Lincolns work better than a Miller, certian Millers better than a Hobart in a given amperage. I can weld, never said i'm a welder and it wasn't easy and fast to learn as memtioned on this forum, they must be "gifted welders", hats off to you. You beat my 43 years of welding all to hell, I turn 56 in two days. Remember always buy more than you think you'll ever need in a welder if your young as you will grow into it vs out of a lesser unit, this will cost more purchasing twice second vs once with the right machine. Practice then practice more and do not be afraid to add more heat no bird crap stuck together joints. Done ranting, not bad for being called a "visitor" on this forum with 628 replies/posts.

 

[BrewBeemer]

Quote "I've experimented for hours with the TIG feature but can't get the AMPs setting right. Besides the knob on the machine, I don't see a way to control the amount/force of the arc while tigging. There is no foot pedal attachment. It seems like I either have it turned up too much and blow a hole thru the SS or I have it turned down and barely get it glowing and the filler rod just clumps on top of the SS."


I hat to ask, but are you sharpening the tungsten to a point? Also, what size tungsten are you using? If you are not sharpening your tungsten, you will never be able to control the arc. You should be able to pin point the arc. Usually when the tungsten gets contaminated, or the tip gets burnt, you can no longer control the arc.

Try reading on this site for a little bit. Miller - Resources - TIG Handbook

Tig without a slider, rotating switch on the torch or a foot control is about useless far as a Tig machine goes. On my 350 Tig I can control the arc start amps then it comes down as the arc puddle begins besides the foot control, pulser and background amps. Yup I can still dip the tungsten into the puddle, snap it off and regrind a new tip. I run the long cap with both ends, .020", 1/16", 3/32", 1/8" tapered pointed ground length wise. Depends on the amperage your tungsten size. Not all welding requires a point, balled end for welding aluminum.

 

[pen25]

Over a year ago I bought one of these cheap-o all in one devices:

Link to eBay: Click Here

The plasma cutting feature worked very well for cutting off the tops of my kegs. The stick was too complicated for me to use to build by stand, so I got a $99 mig welder that did the trick.

I've experimented for hours with the TIG feature but can't get the AMPs setting right. Besides the knob on the machine, I don't see a way to control the amount/force of the arc while tigging. There is no foot pedal attachment. It seems like I either have it turned up too much and blow a hole thru the SS or I have it turned down and barely get it glowing and the filler rod just clumps on top of the SS.

I should have put up some real money to get a name brand device, but it wasn't in the budget (and still isn't).

Does anyone have a similar device that has used the TIG feature to attach SS couplings to a keg?

Thanks...

see if your local community college has classes for welding. those small cheap welders work fine. you dont need to spend a grand on a machine to do light stuff. tig welding is like gas welding with filler rod. mig welding is like arc welding with a continual rod. to build a brew stand that mig will work fine. and id hesitate to weld ss specially on a keggle as you have special techniques that need to be followed. you can read yuri's threads on welding stainless. you will need to back gas the inside and all.

and yes i have used high dollar welders and cheap welders and my old CH worked fine for most of what i would weld. and the northern industrial i just bought will work even better as it has better heat control and gas.

 

[whitescout]

BrewBeemer, I was trying to help BrewVegas with some issues on his machine. I understand you have the cadillac of machines, and probably do not need any help with tigging. I mentioned sharpening tungsten to him, as I believe that this is a bihg part of the issue he is having. I did not mention balling of the tungsten for welding aluminum, as the picture he posted is a DC machine.

BrewVegas, I would recommend starting on a piece of scrap, and set the machine on 40-45 amps. Hold the torch at a 15 degree angle, and start with a small circle, until you can see a puddle start to form. At this point, start movin in a straight line ( no swirl), away from the puddle, with the torch angled to the front. try this with no filler, and try different speeds until you get the desired results. make sure you keep the tungsten out of the puddle, and keep it the same distance from the workpiece. If the scrap metal is stainless, you should be striving for a gold or rainbow color on your weld. HTH

 

[Brewers Hardware]

Just FYI, on the Miller site, they recommend pointing the Tungsten with A/C aluminum now.

 

[Brewers Hardware]

BTW, I was fortunate enough to get a welder as my company was going out of business. I have a Miller 180SD TIG welder and I just welded up my own stand. I found learning to weld to be very easy. More in line with BrewBeemer's comments though; I found welding consistently and welding well to be extremely difficult. Now that I finished that stand, I'm ready to sell it, buy more SS and weld one 1/2 ass instead of 7/8 ass like this one. Thank God for 60 grit blending discs!

 

[nathan]

I've got pics of mine up and running in my gallery. The pumps are missing some couplers still, but I should be at full speed in a week or two.

Once I'm sure I like the height, I'll take off the wooden base and put on tube-stock legs with plates on bottom to bolt the casters to.

 

[slnies]

BTW, I was fortunate enough to get a welder as my company was going out of business. I have a Miller 180SD TIG welder and I just welded up my own stand. I found learning to weld to be very easy. More in line with BrewBeemer's comments though; I found welding consistently and welding well to be extremely difficult. Now that I finished that stand, I'm ready to sell it, buy more SS and weld one 1/2 ass instead of 7/8 ass like this one. Thank God for 60 grit blending discs!

Welding consistently is all about practice, practice, practice, and a wee tiny bit of talent, but mostly practice. Some are blessed with great fine motor control and can turn out perfect looking, and functional welds that are consistent in a short period of time. If you are not one of the lucky few, than you have to practice more. Notice that I did not say guys with talent need not practice. LOL. Anyway, enjoy the art and weld, soon you will be turning out pretty and functional welds that are a showcase unto them selves. S.


One more note: Women make excellent welders once they get over the awkwardness of it, and often times they end up being much better at it than men. GOD BLESSED most women with better fine motor control than men, I think the exchange on our part was strength, in a silver back sort of way. LOL.

 

[imsoweetadid]

Tig without a slider, rotating switch on the torch or a foot control is about useless far as a Tig machine goes. On my 350 Tig I can control the arc start amps then it comes down as the arc puddle begins besides the foot control, pulser and background amps. Yup I can still dip the tungsten into the puddle, snap it off and regrind a new tip. I run the long cap with both ends, .020", 1/16", 3/32", 1/8" tapered pointed ground length wise. Depends on the amperage your tungsten size. Not all welding requires a point, balled end for welding aluminum.

I will beg to differ. Im a pipe welder by trade, and we learned how to weld pipelines in school without a foot pedal, slider, or seperate amp control. Turn your heat to where your comfortable, and run with it. Yes its harder to do without a pedal, but once you mastered the hard way, you appreciate the foot pedal a little more.

 

[imsoweetadid]

I finally found a forum that is hell bent on welding, I love it. Here is my welding gear Im running at the house.

One of my first tig welds I ever did, in school.

My baby, Miller Trailblazer 302

My tig setup. Since this picture, I bought the new modular tig torch from arczone with removable heads, and got another 300cf tank. The 80cf tank in this pic is good for getting in tight places, without rolling around a big 300cf.

Stick welding gear with ground

I dont have any pictures of it yet, but I also have a spoolmate 185 w/ a sga 100C. Its a small mig setup, but does what I need it to, when I work on alluminum.

I only have this stock photo in my photobucket right now, but I have this as well. Its a Tungsten Grinder called a sharpie, made by arczone.com. This little grinder has paid for itself ten fold, and will grind your tungsten to a polished precision point, or a flat tip for alluminum tig welding.

Just got this new addition to my miller family. I traded a $2500.00 M4 rifle for this Spectrum 875 plasma cutter, and a sh$tload of extras.

 

[imsoweetadid]

Built a brutus for a local club member

Got Coupler! Just some coupler I tig welded for a buddy, on a sanke keg.

I made a keg to sabco specs. A buddy of mine wanted a Sabco keg, but couldnt afford one, so I built him a mirror image Sabco kettle to specs, for 1/4of the price.

Graduated Tulsa Welding School

Hope I didnt overload this thread with pics, but I got excited when I stumbled upon this thread!

 

[LooyvilleLarry]

DAMNNNNN That is some boucoup moolah in that rig! Nice welds. The TIGging I've found takes practice and having that nice miller can't be all bad.

 

[Homercidal]

Those are some sweet looking welds!

 

[imsoweetadid]

DAMNNNNN That is some boucoup moolah in that rig! Nice welds. The TIGging I've found takes practice and having that nice miller can't be all bad.

Thanks buddy, and yeah the miller helps out a little during the weld. The pictures I posted are of the equipment that I did take pictures of. I another couple tons of equipment, like saddle cutters for pipe, pipe benders, metal chop saws, homemade welding table(I will have to post a picture of this, you'll like it), etc... I do welding on the side as an actual taxable buisness, because the Navy shipyards here on base laid us off not too long ago, but they told me today, that they are getting a 6 month job coming up, so they said Im at the top of the list to be recalled, so that will be good. Anyways, what I have invested to date, according to what I had to claim on taxes as buisness expenses is $19,568.00, but dont get me wrong, I didnt buy all this stuff all at once, it was collected over the course of a year. Welding aint cheap, but what is nowadays, right.

 

[imsoweetadid]

Those are some sweet looking welds!

Thank you, it took allot of practice to get where I am today, but if your a multi-tasker, you can tig weld. With some practice, anyone can lay down a nice bead, unless you try to tig overhead or vertical, which does take allot of practice!

 

[Homercidal]

Thank you, it took allot of practice to get where I am today, but if your a multi-tasker, you can tig weld. With some practice, anyone can lay down a nice bead, unless you try to tig overhead or vertical, which does take allot of practice!

I've only TIG'ed a couple of inches at work. SS shelf for kegerator. I got a nice weld, but the conditions were excellent and the welds were basic.

You need to post your welding table as I am getting close to doing my own. I may be able to steal a good idea or two off your design!

 

[imsoweetadid]

You need to post your welding table as I am getting close to doing my own. I may be able to steal a good idea or two off your design!

Will do! All I did was take these $20 steel saw horses that lowes is selling right now, and welded 4, 1/4" stainless threaded studs in which I attached tweco connectors to. This way, I can connect, and disconnect my ground cable quick and fast. I did this to both saw horses, then I bolted a 3/4" alluminum table top which is 4' by 6'. I used alluminum for the top, so that it would keep the weight down, so that one man can lift it, and tote it around. I also cut slits in the top of the table, so that I can slip my screw clamp in, to clamp my work down.

 

[lehr]

Will do! All I did was take these $20 steel saw horses that lowes is selling right now, and welded 4, 1/4" stainless threaded studs in which I attached tweco connectors to. This way, I can connect, and disconnect my ground cable quick and fast. I did this to both saw horses, then I bolted a 3/4" alluminum table top which is 4' by 6'. I used alluminum for the top, so that it would keep the weight down, so that one man can lift it, and tote it around. I also cut slits in the top of the table, so that I can slip my screw clamp in, to clamp my work down.

Cruz....You suck !