Water Question

[LJvermonster]

Hi All,
I am trying to use EZ Water Calculation Spreadsheet 3.0 (mentioned from the 3rd water articles lately), and I have some questions. Here are my stats:

Town Water:
Calcium = 18.89 ppm
Magnesium = 4 ppm
Sodium = 50 ppm
Chloride = 56 ppm
Sulfate = 13 ppm
Alkalinity = 72 ppm

Mash = 5.0 gallons
Sparge = 5.5 gallons

Base 2 row = 12 lbs
Base Wheat = 1 lb
Base Crystal = 1 lb - Crystal 40

Without any treatment is says my mash pH will be 5.73.

I am making an IPA and was wondering if these are acceptable additions:
Gypsum: Mash = 3 g; Sparge = 3.3 g
Calc Chloride: Mash = 1 g; Sparge = 1.1 g
Epsom Salt: Mash = 2 g; Sparge = 2.2 g
Lactic Acid 88% = 3 ml total

This would put my mash pH at 5.5 with the following profile
Calcium = 69 ppm
Magnesium = 14 ppm
Sodium = 50 ppm
Chloride = 81 ppm
Sulfate = 143 ppm

Does this seem right? And the Lactic Acid, when do you add that? Half to mash and half to sparge? How does that work?

Thanks in advance!

 

[jdauria]

Hello to a fellow Mass brewer! Have friends who live on South Pine in Franklin...anyway to the point..

Your sulfate to chloride ratio is 1.77 to 1 , I would bump it up a little to 2:1 or 2.5:1 to accent bitterness. The higher end will will also make the beer drier if you like that.

Tasty McDole, creator of the award winning Janet's Brown Ale uses this profile for hoppy beers and I have used myself several times to good results:

Ca-110ppm, Mg-18ppm, Na-17ppm, SO4-350ppm, Cl-50ppm

Note that that is a 6:1 Sulfate to Chloride ratio. This will make a real dry beer and could give you too high of mineral flavors though, kind of like real Burton beers or German Dortmunders. That's why I recommend a 2:1 or 3:1 ratio instead.

Lactic acid should be added to sparge water to get your town water pH down to around 5.4. You would add to the mash if the salts alone will not get the pH down to the proper range.

 

[LJvermonster]

Hello to a fellow Mass brewer! Have friends who live on South Pine in Franklin...anyway to the point..

Your sulfate to chloride ratio is 1.77 to 1 , I would bump it up a little to 2:1 or 2.5:1 to accent bitterness. The higher end will will also make the beer drier if you like that.

Tasty McDole, creator of the award winning Janet's Brown Ale uses this profile for hoppy beers and I have used myself several times to good results:

Ca-110ppm, Mg-18ppm, Na-17ppm, SO4-350ppm, Cl-50ppm

Note that that is a 6:1 Sulfate to Chloride ratio. This will make a real dry beer and could give you too high of mineral flavors though, kind of like real Burton beers or German Dortmunders. That's why I recommend a 2:1 or 3:1 ratio instead.

Lactic acid should be added to sparge water to get your town water pH down to around 5.4. You would add to the mash if the salts alone will not get the pH down to the proper range.

Thanks for the response! And I happen to live in Franklin! This was a huge help. I will target the 2:1 ration first; I don't necessarily want THAT dry of a beer.

The last part with the Lactic Acid and Salts: Did I read that as:

add the Epsom Salt to the mash (all of it?)

and if that doesn't get down to the proper level then add Lactic Acid to the Sparge (all of it?)

And is 5.4 pH a more ideal level for IPAs? Or just all beers in general?

Thanks again!

 

[jdauria]

LOL! I know I saw your profile said Franklin, that's why I mentioned my friends!

I would add epsom to both. Take a sparge pH reading and add lactic if needed to get down to 5.4. Add lactic to mash only if pH too high.

Yes, lighter beers should have a mash pH between 5.3 and 5.4.

I used the EZ Water calculator when I first started adjusting water, but now use Bru'N Water which is much more detailed. It was created by Martin Brungard who is well known water expert in this Brewing Science sub-forum.

 

[TennBrewer]

I have a situation with my water treatment and mash pH. I use bru'n water spreadsheet to calculate the water additions and get an expected mash pH, usually around 5.3 to 5.4 but every time it comes out at 5.8. I would like to know what to expect and if I am doing something wrong. I am using the BIAB method for 5.5 Gallon batches which requires about 8 gallons of water for mashing. I use filtered tap water and I have a water test report to give me my starting water profile, water pH is 7.9. My water conditioning treatment usually include Gypsum, CaLcium Chloride, and Epsom Salt. The amounts vary depending on the beer style I am brewing. I mill the grains twice, mashed at varying temperatures and yet when I check the pH it is always 5.8, I would like it to be lower around the 5.3 mark, but hey! Any change would be good. Do I need to add acid to the mash water or use acidulated malt? If I put that into the spreadsheet the estimated pH goes way out of range. If I do add acid, most likely lactic acid, is it going to be a trial and error method on the acid dosage? The beers I brew taste ok for the most part but there is always room for improvement and I would like to see what the changes are with different pH levels. I have a pH meter that is calibrated at 68 degrees and I cool the mash sample to that temperature.

 

[ajdelange]

Your sulfate to chloride ratio is 1.77 to 1 , I would bump it up a little to 2:1 or 2.5:1 to accent bitterness. The higher end will will also make the beer drier if you like that.

Ca-110ppm, Mg-18ppm, Na-17ppm, SO4-350ppm, Cl-50ppm

Note that that is a 6:1 Sulfate to Chloride ratio. This will make a real dry beer and could give you too high of mineral flavors though, kind of like real Burton beers or German Dortmunders. That's why I recommend a 2:1 or 3:1 ratio instead.

If you made the ratio 12:1 or 3:1 or took out the chloride altogether (∞:1) it would still be a dry minerally tasting beer because of the high sulfate level.

Lactic acid should be added to sparge water to get your town water pH down to around 5.4.

With the given level of alkalinity you most likely don't have to do this but you can. You can, in fact, treat the whole volume of brewing water to the desired mash pH which effectively zeroes the modest alkalinity. You then only have to add additional acid as required to neutralize the net alkalinity of the malts.

You would add to the mash if the salts alone will not get the pH down to the proper range.

And most probably they won't as in the first place the effect of calcium in this regard is pretty small (it takes 3.5 mEq of calcium to kick off 1 mEq of hydrogen ions) and a typical base malt will have a proton deficit to pH 5.4 of about 14 mEq/kg. To pH 5.5 is is appreciably less at about 9.