Using Black Malt to clear beer

[Calder]

Trying to find out if anyone has tried it.

I have been making crystal clear beer. Put it in the fridge for a couple of hours and it is perfect; cool and clear. Leave it in the fridge overnight and it develops a chill haze which doesn't dissapear until the temperature gets up in the 50s.

It seems chill haze seems to develop when the beer gets into the low 30s and doesn't dissipate until it warms up into the 50s.

This was driving me crazy. I can't cold crash, so don't have the ability to fine at cold temperatures.

I've tried lots of things, but the latest has been adding about 0.25 ozs of black malt at the end of the mash. I've been doing it for about 10 batches so far. Only 5 of them have made it to the bottle, the others are still in process. It seems to be making a huge difference; no chill haze from bottles left in the fridge for days.

Anyone else tried this. Any comments?

 

[BrianP]

I've never heard of using black malt for that. Fortunately I've never had chill haze issues.

 

[wcarter1227]

Just leave your beers in the fridge to cold condition for 2 weeks. that should take care of the chill haze.

 

[sh00t]

wcarter1227

Just leave your beers in the fridge to cold condition for 2 weeks. that should take care of the chill haze.

So you're saying that after 2 weeks even with chill haze it will drop out of suspension and not be a problem?

 

[Gregscsu]

Symptom: The (finished) beer is hazy/cloudy.
Cause 1: Chill haze This is the number one cause of cloudy homebrew. It is caused by an insufficient cold break during cooling after the boil.
Cure: Use a wort chiller.

Cause 2: Starch If you made an all-grain beer and had incomplete conversion, or added/steeped a malt that needed to be mashed to an extract batch, then you can have residual starches in the beer that will cause cloudiness.
Cure: Watch the mash temperature and mash longer next time.

Cause 3: Yeast Yeast strains that have low flocculation, such as German Hefeweizen, will cause the beer to be cloudy.
Cure: Use a different yeast strain if you want a clearer beer.

In all cases, cloudiness can be combated by adding fining agents (e.g. isinglass, gelatin, Polyclar, bentonite) after fermentation. When all-grain brewing, the clarity can be enhanced by adding Irish Moss towards the end of the boil.

How are you chilling you wort?

 

[remilard]

Trying to find out if anyone has tried it.

I have been making crystal clear beer. Put it in the fridge for a couple of hours and it is perfect; cool and clear. Leave it in the fridge overnight and it develops a chill haze which doesn't dissapear until the temperature gets up in the 50s.

It seems chill haze seems to develop when the beer gets into the low 30s and doesn't dissipate until it warms up into the 50s.

This was driving me crazy. I can't cold crash, so don't have the ability to fine at cold temperatures.

I've tried lots of things, but the latest has been adding about 0.25 ozs of black malt at the end of the mash. I've been doing it for about 10 batches so far. Only 5 of them have made it to the bottle, the others are still in process. It seems to be making a huge difference; no chill haze from bottles left in the fridge for days.

Anyone else tried this. Any comments?

Well, that is chill haze. You can make beer that doesn't have it, and that is the ideal, but that is another thread.

How many beers have you done the black malt on? I can only imagine it is somehow functioning as a kettle fining. Do you normally use kettle finings?

 

[CoalCracker]

I've read this as well and wanted to try it. In small amounts, it adds no flavor. Read it in the Complete homebrewers guide by papazian.

 

[starrfish]

I've read this as well and wanted to try it. In small amounts, it adds no flavor. Read it in the Complete homebrewers guide by papazian.

I have tried it. seems to work. Quantity so low it doesn't darken or flavor beer in any noticeable way. For a long time the lightest beer I made was a Honey Coriander lager made some with some without, with seemed clearer... Tried it in a cream ale over the summer and that came out clear, other cream ale I did where it was not used had a slight haze a few batches later.

Not a "Scientific Test" but, seems to work

 

[Ichthy]

Does anyone care to explain how black malt works as a fining agent? And how much you are adding to a 5gal batch?

 

[Calder]

Too many questions to provide the quotes:

I partial mash (5 lbs of grain). Generally get over 80% efficiency so I don't think there is a problem with conversion.

I use Irish Moss every time. rehydrated in warm wort and added to the kettle at 10 mins to go.

I cool with an imersion cooler.

This occurs with different yeast strains, so it's not the yeast.

I've had about 5 beers through that this seems to be working on. I have several others that have not made the bottle yet.

Chill haze doesn't disapear after 2 weeks in the fridge. It takes a lot longer.

The only thing I can think of that might be contributing to the haze is that I partial mash by using a bag and therefore get some of the finer pieces of the husk in the boil, rather than doing a traditional sparge where you get clear wort running into the kettle.

 

[starrfish]

I'd need to check the Papazian book when I get home, for details. It's not something I do every batch. Just on really light stuff.

 

[BenS]

The only thing I can think of that might be contributing to the haze is that I partial mash by using a bag and therefore get some of the finer pieces of the husk in the boil, rather than doing a traditional sparge where you get clear wort running into the kettle.

I agree with you. I vorlouf out of my mash tun and fly sparge and rarely get chill haze. Once the yeast drops out of suspension (I keg), I get crystal clear beer. I haven't used whirlfloc or any clarifying agents in the last 10 batches.

 

[EBloom97]

So what's the science behind this? How does black malt help with clarity?

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

My only guess is that the black malt adds negatively-charged particles to the beer which bind with the positively-charged, haze-inducing proteins and drop them out. Which is the same thing irish moss does.

At the risk of stepping in it even further; maybe the black malt becomes negatively charged by donating H+ ions to the wort (roasted malts are acidic which means they donate H+ ions).

 

[DrawTap88]

My only guess is that the black malt adds negatively-charged particles to the beer which bind with the positively-charged, haze-inducing proteins and drop them out. Which is the same thing irish moss does.

At the risk of stepping in it even further; maybe the black malt becomes negatively charged by donating H+ ions to the wort (roasted malts are acidic which means they donate H+ ions).

At the risk of stepping in it too, that's what I was thinking. Now where's that stick.