Tyranny of the "craft" beer

[shoreman]

The problem with most American IPAs is they have the shelf time of about 3-4 weeks. If you've had fresh IPAs or brewed them you can quickly identify the freshness.

With all the new brewers dumping IPA on the market without quality control it becomes problematic

If I want a hop forward beer, it's Sierra Nevada pale or seasonal. I know I can trust their QA.

I don't know maybe in a year there will be rotting double IPAs all over the shelves. I'll stick to a large producer like SN- that in lies some of the issues small producers will face coming up.


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[bob1852]

I just wish we move more quickly out of the IPA is then end all be all of beers phase the industry is in right now. Don't get me wrong, I love IPAs, Double IPAs, etc but people are bit too fixated on them right now.

Found some data (2012) that IPA accounted for 1% of beer sales.

If you think IPA's are the end all right now, I'd say you aren't looking hard enough.

 

[Upthewazzu]

Found some data (2012) that IPA accounted for 1% of beer sales.

If you think IPA's are the end all right now, I'd say you aren't looking hard enough.

Yeah, but what's the percentage of IPA sales when narrowing down to the craft brew industry. Probably pretty dang high.

Having said that, I love me a good IPA.

 

[Roughster]

Found some data (2012) that IPA accounted for 1% of beer sales.

If you think IPA's are the end all right now, I'd say you aren't looking hard enough.

Now if we can only get that same stat while removing all Budweiser, Miller, and Coors brewed products, I bet you would see that number skyrocket. I am not saying that it is all that is available, but it is definitely all the rage on the craft and micro brewery levels.

 

[bob1852]

Yeah, but what's the percentage of IPA sales when narrowing down to the craft brew industry. Probably pretty dang high.

Having said that, I love me a good IPA.

Looks like IPA ~12% of craft beer sales, albeit growing in leaps in bounds...

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/newswire/2014/ipas-are-creating-a-brewhaha-in-craft-beer-sales.html

 

[Roughster]

Looks like ~12% of craft beer...

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/newswire/2014/ipas-are-creating-a-brewhaha-in-craft-beer-sales.html

AZ, looks like we had the same thought at the same time! The article also mentions witbiers as more popular than IPAs which would lead me to believe they are considering Blue Moon and Shocktop to be "craft" beer. I think that is debatable and the 12% would go a lot higher if you removed those two products for sure. Not poo poo'ing either BM or ST, just saying they are probably closer to BMC than true craft beer. IMO of course.

 

[bob1852]

AZ, looks like we had the same thought at the same time!

The article also mentions witbiers as more popular than IPAs which would lead me to believe they are considering Blue Moon and Shocktop to be "craft" beer. I think that is debatable and the 12% would go a lot higher if you removed those two products for sure. Not poo poo'ing either BM or ST, just saying they are probably closer to BMC than true craft beer. IMO of course.

Yeah, that is a surprise, and has to include Blue Moon and Shocktop as craft...

 

[bluehende]

What "problems" are you talking about that professional brewers have? Most professional breweries can take advantage of scale, professional lab equipment and analysis, highly regulated temperature control and oxygenation levels, and many other advantages that most (but not all) homebrewers simply don't have. I'm not seeing what the big "problems" are that professional brewers have that make them so easy to surpass.

I think one of their big problems is distribution. My beers stay in my hands and are handled very well. Commercial brewers lose control over their beer once it hits the distributors and I believe it suffers from it. I am fairly new, but my last two batches have been preferred to the normal craft brews I drink in those styles. I have had a few of these beers right at the brewery and at that point I would guess I would prefer those to mine. They are all still good beers, and that makes me happy.

 

[Upthewazzu]

Looks like IPA ~12% of craft beer sales, albeit growing in leaps in bounds...

http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/newswire/2014/ipas-are-creating-a-brewhaha-in-craft-beer-sales.html

Lower than I expected, but like you and others have mentioned, what is being considered craft beer for the sake of that survey...

I will say that IPA's were pretty much still an outlier only a few years ago, especially east of the Mississippi River. I think it's the rapid growth in popularity/production that makes it seem like such a giant.

 

[Calichusetts]

I'd say 10% is about right. At least that is what I see at my local shops: about 10 out of every 100 beers are IPA/IIPAs. Even that is a little on the high side. I see these "everything is IPA" comments and it leads me to believe that the craft store I go to, or Massachusetts in general, is far better off than some places in the country.

 

[bob1852]

I'd say 10% is about right. At least that is what I see at my local shops: about 10 out of every 100 beers are IPA/IIPAs. Even that is a little on the high side. I see these "everything is IPA" comments and it leads me to believe that the craft store I go to, or Massachusetts in general, is far better off than some places in the country.

My non-scientific travel experiences show me that further west = more IPAs as a % of everything else.

But there's still a helluva a lot of variety out there for beer in America right now. Moreso than ever before.

 

[Upthewazzu]

:smack:

But there's still a helluva a lot of variety out there for beer in America right now. Moreso than ever before.

Truth.

And you're right about the >IPA's west of the Mississippi River. I go back East quite a bit (family) and in some ways it feels like the 80's (craft beer-wise) over there! And don't even get me started on the insane blue laws that still dictate when and where I can get my booze :smack:

 

[wozzer]

How are you defining "better?" Do you win a lot of awards, or just enjoy your own homebrew?

Your telling me you can CONSISTENTLY brew better beer than several major breweries? If so, contact them, send them some of your beer, and see if they will higher you as a consultant so they can brew as good as you.

I define "better" as the beer I would choose, given a choice.

I say I consistently brew better beer than commercial beer, because I consistently prefer it over their offerings. Obviously that might change if I were to be exposed to even greater variety than what is available locally, but there's a good range of craft beer here.

I don't say this to make bold claims about my brewing ability as opposed to everyone else in the world. I say it only because I set out to make something I preferred to bought stuff. For 3 years I couldn't, now I can. That's all.

Commercial brewers have distinct disadvantages. They do not know what I like. I do.

They need to consider shelf life, handling damage, regulations, how onsellers will respond to their incentives, what the general market is currently favoring, how bar-staff will serve, and what their shareholders will allow and shut down. That's not an exhaustive list. But they're problems I don't have. All I have to do, is please myself. That gives me an enormous advantage.

I am not saying I could go commercial and wow the world. If I tried to sell my beer to the world, I would immediately have the same problems they have, and my advantage would be lost.

 

[rodwha]

I don't mind spending a bit on beer once in a while. If I could get Pliny I'd be willing to spend more as it's touted as one of the finest IPA's, and I cannot get it here in TX.

MoreBeer sells a kit to make it, but it's not the same thing, however close I may be able to get it. And I prefer to design my own recipes.

My beers are typically about on par with a typical commercial example. Some are stupendous and some have needed aging or got dumped. But I'd say a good 80% are very good, and it makes me happy.

 

[wozzer]

I think one of their big problems is distribution. My beers stay in my hands and are handled very well. Commercial brewers lose control over their beer once it hits the distributors and I believe it suffers from it. I am fairly new, but my last two batches have been preferred to the normal craft brews I drink in those styles. I have had a few of these beers right at the brewery and at that point I would guess I would prefer those to mine. They are all still good beers, and that makes me happy.

There was a small brewery in my home town. It monopolised the bar scene and the beer was quite awful. A friend of mine's father worked there, and one day he took us on a tour of the brewery, and finished it off with a tasting at the little bar they had on site. This beer was splendid. It was fresh out of their tanks, where presumably it was conditioned. The difference between it and the product bought through their network was unbelievable.

 

[grathan]

They said wheat prices are up sharply %18.

http://www.thenews.com.pk/Todays-News-1-253300-World-Bank-sounds-alarm-on-rising-global-food-prices

I gotta imagine wheat grows a lot like barley...

 

[Upthewazzu]

They said wheat prices are up sharply %18.

http://www.thenews.com.pk/Todays-News-1-253300-World-Bank-sounds-alarm-on-rising-global-food-prices

I gotta imagine wheat grows a lot like barley...

Wheat prices have been skyrocketing for 6-7 years (because Asia). A lot of happy farmers in my neck of the woods...

 

[fredthecat]

looking back, i still stand by my OP. i guess im not being too clear on this, but im saying something like if i want to make a porter, im not gonna spend a whole bunch of money to hopburst/dryhop it. it will end up being perfectly delicious but significantly cheaper than comparable beer i'd buy at the store

 

[ram5ey]

Are people that aren't beer geeks really going to shell out 20 for a bottle? I think not.

Some of these prices people are posting are just silly. It appears people are just going to the wrong vendor...
I remember seeing negra modelo for 13 a six in a trendy Manhattan neighborhood but I then walked a few blocks and got it for 9 at my local bodega...

So glad I've moved away and moved on...

 

[JohnSand]

looking back, i still stand by my OP. i guess im not being too clear on this, but im saying something like if i want to make a porter, im not gonna spend a whole bunch of money to hopburst/dryhop it. it will end up being perfectly delicious but significantly cheaper than comparable beer i'd buy at the store

Well, you struck a note, because we're eight pages into a lively thread. Ironically, there is a concurrent thread suggesting that craft beer is under-priced.

 

[Qhrumphf]

Are people that aren't beer geeks really going to shell out 20 for a bottle? I think not.

Some of these prices people are posting are just silly. It appears people are just going to the wrong vendor...
I remember seeing negra modelo for 13 a six in a trendy Manhattan neighborhood but I then walked a few blocks and got it for 9 at my local bodega...

So glad I've moved away and moved on...

Certainly depends on where you shop. Depending on what I want, I'll get it from the local supermarket where the prices tend to be the best, or I'll have to go to a place with a stupidly ridiculous markup because what I'm looking for is only available at places with a stupidly huge markup.

I know that in many parts of the city, DC beer prices exceed NYC prices. Cheaper on my side of the river, or across the river in some parts of the Maryland burbs. But sometimes I'll venture into DC since its more or less "legal to sell grey market beer at your bar" laws allow you to get stuff you can't get anywhere else (albeit sometimes pissing off the brewer in the process). I shelled out way too much to taste Pliny the Elder, Supplication, and a handful of other Russian River beers. However, much like shelling out $85 for a sixer of Westvleteren 12, when you factor in travel, or even just shipping for a trade, the cost seems a little more reasonable for something like that.

 

[troy2000]

There was a small brewery in my home town. It monopolised the bar scene and the beer was quite awful. A friend of mine's father worked there, and one day he took us on a tour of the brewery, and finished it off with a tasting at the little bar they had on site. This beer was splendid. It was fresh out of their tanks, where presumably it was conditioned. The difference between it and the product bought through their network was unbelievable.

Way back in the 70's I took a tour of Olympic Brewery - only because I was hitchhiking and the driver insisted. I'd always considered Olympic beer to be horse-p*** in a can. But as you say about your local brewery, the beer on tap at the end of the tour was delicious.

So when I got home, I bought a sixer of it. And you know what? It was horse-p*** in a can...

 

[JohnSand]

In the same vein, an old German (born there) I knew used to drink Miller Genuine. His explanation was that "The schidt sold here as German beer, we would pour on the floor in Bavaria!" My Dad used to point out that beer doesn't travel well.
A slightly different take: I don't like Corona. But it does taste better in Mexico. Maybe it hasn't been skunked up by light yet. Or, maybe anything tastes better sitting on a sun drenched beach in February, watching a parade of fabulous butts go by.

 

[Qhrumphf]

In the same vein, an old German (born there) I knew used to drink Miller Genuine. His explanation was that "The schidt sold here as German beer, we would pour on the floor in Bavaria!" My Dad used to point out that beer doesn't travel well.
A slightly different take: I don't like Corona. But it does taste better in Mexico. Maybe it hasn't been skunked up by light yet. Or, maybe anything tastes better sitting on a sun drenched beach in February, watching a parade of fabulous butts go by.

I remember visiting my grandfather in Tuscon before he died, and sitting outside in the nice comfortable January sun, and Corona being just fantastic even if skunked.

Never been to Mexico, but something about southwest desert makes Corona something special.

 

[pgraham5870]

Depending on where you are, $8 a six will get you quality. In Charleston, the great local IPA's command $12 a six, but the larger breweries that put out great stuff can be sought out in megastores like Total Wine. I am personally convinced that after finding Lagunitas' APA "New Dogtown" (which I think is delicious) at $6.99 a pop, I started cleaning them out twice a week..one day, it was $8.99..lots of good stuff doesn't sell well, just seek it out, see if the ratings jive on BA or RateBeer, and you should have some luck.