Trying a new yeast

[nomnomnom21]

So ive brewed about 3 batches of cider, all with EC-1118 yeast. Recently i added Xylitol to a batch to make it semi-sweet. Now im thinking about switching up to an ale yeast, such as Nottingham, in hopes to make a good Semi-sweet cider that everyone loves. Any advice on yeasts or advice on the differences in taste.
Also since the alcohol tolerance of an ale yeast is lower does that mean my cider could be naturally sweeter? Thanks for any info, im still learning!

 

[madscientist451]

I do a few yeast trials every fall when I make cider. In 2014, I tried Nottingham and got a sulfur smell and flavor in my cider. My G/F doesn't notice the sulfur as much as I do, and it doesn't bother her to drink it, but Nottingham is crossed off my list for cider. WL 002 makes a nice off dry cider, WL 007 London ale has a slight sulfur note that I don't like. I really like WLP 565 Saison yeast that I tested in 2015. Next year I'm going to try a French Saison strain from Wyeast, and some more ale yeasts.

 

[nomnomnom21]

Thats helpful because the sulfur smell definitely bothers me(and my girlfriend cant smell it either)

 

[meatcleaver]

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=83060
here ya go...

 

[laredo7mm]

...I tried Nottingham and got a sulfur smell and flavor in my cider...WL 002 makes a nice off dry cider...

I have a batch in the keg now that I used WLP 002 and it has a sulfur smell to it. I don't think it is the yeast, but how you treat it. I have gotten the same from Nottingham. Both times I was messing with the temperatures a lot and I think I stressed out the yeast too much.

Every batch of cider I have made (5 or 6 total so no expert) gets the rhino farts during peak fermentation but that usually goes away after a few days if I keep the temps nice. Lows 60's high 50's works best for me. I also don't use any yeast nutrients since I want to stop fermentation to retain some natural residual sweetness.

 

[laredo7mm]

...Also since the alcohol tolerance of an ale yeast is lower does that mean my cider could be naturally sweeter?...

It all depends on your starting specific gravity. If you add enough sugar to your cider that the yeast die in their own waste, then yes, you will have sweetness left over. I would call that a sweet wine as opposed to a sweet cider though. I think most ale yeasts can go to 10 or 12% alcohol before they die.

 

[madscientist451]

I have a batch in the keg now that I used WLP 002 and it has a sulfur smell to it. I don't think it is the yeast, but how you treat it.

My observations have been that the choice of yeast does make a difference in the taste of the finished cider. And yes, there are many other variables including fermentation temperature, the type of apples and if the apples came from a high nutrient orchard. All I can say for sure that in my cider/yeast trials I don't like Nottingham and WL 007, those yeasts may work fine for you though. A local professional cider maker has performed many yeast trials and he uses wine yeast, but won't reveal what strain.

 

[laredo7mm]

My observations have been that the choice of yeast does make a difference in the taste of the finished cider. And yes, there are many other variables including fermentation temperature, the type of apples and if the apples came from a high nutrient orchard. All I can say for sure that in my cider/yeast trials I don't like Nottingham and WL 007, those yeasts may work fine for you though. A local professional cider maker has performed many yeast trials and he uses wine yeast, but won't reveal what strain.

I agree. I just wanted to point out that Nottingham does not always leave a sulfur taste/smell when used in cider.

 

[bembel]

I get best results in terms of residual flavor and aroma from white wine yeasts like R2, DV10 or BA11 from Scott Labs. More Wine sells them. Also Vintners Harvest VR21 is fantastic. These all ferment well as low as 50f. There is a lot of misinformation out there. Any beer yeast, ale, lager, Hefeweizen, Brett, bread, toe jam, etc, will eat all the fermentable sugars in apple juice. There are no unfermentables unless you add them. so discussions about attenuation are misguided. Now flocculation is another thing. You can control residual sweetness with a flocculating strain through cold crashing and racking. You can also deplete your initial nutrient levels by clarifying the juice with pectic enzyme 24-48 before pitching and siphoning the clear juice off the sediment carefully. This will also slow your initial ferment allowing you to better control your cold crash and rack.

One important thing to consider. Wine yeasts are selected for their ability to retain fruit flavor and aroma from the fruit they ferment. Apple are fruit. Their main sugar is fructose. Apples also contain acids, both Malic and Tannic, and wines yeasts are selected to ferment in these environments and interact with theses compounds. , which unless you sparge too long, are not found in wort. Breweries rely on yeasts selected to best ferment maltose and other wort sugars. While they can ferment fructose just as well, there are countless other considerations that drive Brewers to use yeasts best suited for their beers. Wine yeasts, just the same, have been selected for over time to best suit the specific challenges of fruit fermentation.

Not saying you can't make cider with beer yeast or a beer from a wine yeast, but if you don't want to start from scratch & take the guess work out of it, rely on the accumulated knowledge of the past which we are lucky enough to be able to purchase today

 

[bembel]

Take a look at this, it's just the regular selection, not even their specialty line

http://www.scottlab.com/products-11.aspx

Blows your mind, right?

Why haven't I ever heard of these?

Why aren't they stocked in my Homebrew shop?

Why did my brewshop recommend a beer yeast for cider?

White Labs and Wyeast make yeast for brewing, with an occasional generic 'cider yeast' thrown in. That is their market. That is why from their entire line up there are so few choices for the wine or cider maker. If you want yeast for cider, learn what the cider makers use and buy it where they do, from a wine supply shop.

You will be amazed......

 

[bembel]

Ok, I'll let the secret out. Here are the top yeast strains for cider and fruit wine as recorded by Scott Labs

http://www.scottlab.com/products-115.aspx#cider

Happy fermenting