Too juicy - Help

[KramE]

Hey all,

I'm having trouble figuring out where I am going wrong.

The last 4 beers (3 different recipes) that I've made have come out the same. Way too juicy smelling and have a hint of overripe fruit. I had success with a batch prior to this bad streak so I know one recipe is proven.

That being said, here's what I've gathered.

All four dry hop. Three of the four are double dry hopped. All hops are pellets. Two have used a hop sock, the other two had the hops go straight in. All have been secondarily fermented to move the beer off the trub before second hopping.

The first two had no fermentation temp control, the last two did.

All have been in the same two kegs which still have a lingering smell of sprite or some other soda (despite several cleanings). However, one of the batches had the smell before going into the keg, while the other only had it after.

Recipes -

2.5 gallons

3lbs 2 row
3lbs wheat malt
60 min 0.5oz warrior
5 min 0.5 Oz of galaxy
5 min 0.5oz of Nelson
Day 7/14 - 0.75 Oz each of Galaxy and Nelson dry hop

The other 2 have been a Citra and summit SMaSH with similar hop schedule and amount.

I have a fort point clone fermenting away that calls for a double dry hopping. I plan on bottling one beer prior to each dry hop to try and narrow down when the beer goes wrong.

Any ideas or suggestions?

Thanks,

Mark

 

[d3track]

Juicy is an interesting description - measured OG and FG and yeast?

Is it more sweet or a fruit juice flavor?

 

[m00ps]

yeah im guessing ti was a high FG that is making it sweet tasting and then the hops make it veer towards juice

 

[KramE]

Both of them sit around 1.065 OG and neither one got much below 1.030-1.025

WPL - 1056 for all of them.

Juicy is my wife's description, and she's got a talent for blind tasting beers.

I would say that it's an intense fruit smell, which we like, but the dank fruit bowl smell/taste isn't awesome.

How do I convince my yeasties to ferment completely?

The last two batches, I did not have have a refractomer, but I did oxygenate and have temp control.

 

[m00ps]

yeah thats VERY high for an FG. It is deifnitely the source of the sweetness. Few possible causes:

Are you making starters? you may have stressed the yeast from a large underpitch

Are you fermenting at reasonable temperatures? mid 60s for US-05 too cold and itll go dormant

What did you mash at (I think this is probably one of the biggies). Anything over 154 is pushing it for anythign other than a stout or porter

how long did you ferment it? you mightve not given it enough time to finish

 

[nettekdl]

I see you mentioned a refractometer, is that what you are using to measure your fg? Because if so, your measurement will be wrong as they are not accurate once alcohol is present. Also as already mentioned make sure you are pitching the proper amount if yeast.

 

[KramE]

I mash at 154 and mash out at 170 for ten minutes.

I did not make a yeast starter for any of the beers, including the beer that turned out well.

I just made my first starter for my most recent batch.

I ferment at 72 degrees now that I have control, but that seems to be high for the wyeast 1056.

I let each batch ferment for 2 weeks. Although I did not see any progression after 3-4 days (although, I was using a refractomer).

I thought refractomers were fine the whole process through. How inaccurate do they get with alcohol?

I hate hydrometers. I break them as often as the Cleveland Browns loose.

Using the brewer's friend yeast starter Calc, I was under pitching by 13 million (or billion, whatever the scale is). Which was about %10.

 

[nettekdl]

Well putting the numbers you gave above into the Brewers friend calculator puts it at 1.011 after correcting for alcohol, so substantially. As far as 1056 temp, I always keep it from 64-66

 

[Yooper]

I ferment at 72 degrees now that I have control, but that seems to be high for the wyeast 1056...........................................


I thought refractomers were fine the whole process through. How inaccurate do they get with alcohol?

Yes, that's too warm for almost all yeast strains. Well, some do ok but Wyeast 1056 gets 'fruity' above about 70, but not wildly so. I ferment it at 65 degrees if I use that strain.


Refractometers are great. However, they measure the refraction of light in a sucrose solution- and alcohol skews it terribly. Some calculators are fairly close (Sean Terrell's is probably the best), but they have never actually been accurate for me.

If you go through the calculator, you can see that your FG is more like 1.011 or 1.012 or so. A hydrometer really is the only truly accurate way to get your FG, but a refractometer can be 'close enough' in most cases if you don't really care about an exact reading and just want to ensure it's done.

 

[kh54s10]

I would say the problem is the combination of problems, among them, underpitching, mashing on the high side, and fermenting too warm. I would mash that recipe at about 150.

 

[KramE]

Thank you all for your help. It's greatly appreciated!

 

[KramE]

So, interesting note. I just received my brand spanking new kegs and I racked my two beers over into them.

One beer tastes and smells completely different, and the other doesn't have such an overpowering dank smell.

I really think the kegs had some sort of contribution to the problem.

 

[pigroaster]

Install new rubber gaskets all way around and PBW your keg! Star san rinse and smells will be gone. Shortcuts do not provide good beer taste profiles. Yeast working temperatures are important as well.

 

[mrdail87]

It sounds like a mix of esters as Yooper suggested, and a but to do with your recipes. Based on the hop schedule, I'd expect some juiciness from hops like galaxy, summit, and citra. Each of those hops can be intensely citrusy. Especially with the amount of dry hops listed above. I made a citra/mosaic IPA that tasted like Hi-C got the first couple days. It calmed down, but still pretty juicy.

Edit: didn't see the second page to this thread. Glad the problem seems to have cleared up.

 

[KramE]

Thanks for the input. I suspect the kegs had a major role.

Having said that, I can now pick up on some of the faults of high temp fermentation and perhaps underpitching.

Now I'm excited to try a batch with better control over those facets.