Time to Start Kegging

[IslandLizard]

Wha?!?! how so? The OP asked about pin and ball locks...

No, not for you. I put up the OT alert for what I was going to say...

 

[oakbarn]

To me, that's just less than honorable. Sure, it might seem "OK" if you're a skinflint, but why not just get a cheap aluminum tank from the start if you're getting an used one? Even one that's out of date would be better. Since those CAN be tested and put back into circulation.

I bought my 20# tank back in 2011 with a good date stamp on it. Got it filled and been using it ever since. Yes, I'm still on that initial filling of the tank. When it finally shows empty, I'll take it for a swap. BUT, I bought it with a good date on it initially. It's no one's fault that it's lasted this long. I COULD get it tested and then filled, but I'll probably not want to wait for that. So I'll just swap it for a currently filled tank and probably go another 10+ years before needing to do it again.

Less than honorable? That what exchanges do. You might buy a very nice shiny tank, and exchange for a grungy old steel tank. Depends on what they have. Refilling is different. You can keep your tank. Exchanges are built around the idea that you do not have to check the Cert Date, just bring in an exchange for what they have (and they may give you one that is only good for a month). I prefer the Al tanks because of the weight, but have had to take steel as that is all they had.

Same with propane exchanges. I had a Barn fire (unrelated to brewing) and had several propane tanks that were outside the barn cook off. I found that Americagas will recycle the old burnt tanks. I called the corporate office, and they told me to just recycle (exchange) them at any of their location, even if they were in a fire and "toast" (literally).

 

[IslandLizard]

Re: Propane tanks

I found that Americagas will recycle the old burnt tanks.

That's what Amerigas (Blue Rhino, and similar ilk) are only good for, exchange of old, outdated, worn out or burnt out tanks.
They shorten fills to 80% of nominal... so you only get 16# instead of 20#. The expansion reserve is already built in a tank, doh!

I always get my propane filled at a local concrete plant/rental outfit. I get a true 20# fill. They've never really checked the date (it's 10 years for propane tanks), the tanks look splendid and are heavy!
Many U-Haul places also fill them (convenient), as does BJ's (best pricing!)

 

[oakbarn]

I use Tractor Supply to get fills but they do check the date. I am very familiar with how the dates work. If we have one get out of date, we exchange it. Unfortunately, you may get an exchange that only has a little time left as you have no choice. We have found that the fill method is also about half the cost and you do get a full tank (they use a scale for the fill).

There is also a limited amount of tanks they will fill if you have an enclosed transport (3, I think.)

There is a place that used to fill tanks, but charged a set fee similar to exchange so you lose the benefit of lower cost. I have not been back there and do not know if the fill tanks anymore.

 

[Romex2121]

(It only makes sense to buy a brand new CO2 tank if you can get it filled for a decent price, and preferably while you wait)

Before I bought my new kegging set up I did call the welding supply store prior to verify they would fill the NEW 5 gallon tank and they said yes , what they didn’t tell me was it would be at their leisure meaning it could be a week or more before they filled it .
It was almost like they were punishing me for not giving up the shiny new tank and doing the swap thing, I eventually gave in and started swapping tanks just because it was such a hassle not to …
Buy a used tank and swap that sucker !!

 

[superiorsat]

Can't go wrong with taprite, ball lock, and big CO2 tanks. There is a reason people build hoists for getting beer in and out of keezers just saying.
Then there is this.

I bought my 20# tank back in 2011 with a good date stamp on it. Got it filled and been using it ever since. Yes, I'm still on that initial filling of the tank. When it finally shows empty, I'll take it for a swap. BUT, I bought it with a good date on it initially. It's no one's fault that it's lasted this long. I COULD get it tested and then filled, but I'll probably not want to wait for that. So I'll just swap it for a currently filled tank and probably go another 10+ years before needing to do it again.

I wish I could find a magic tank like this! I've got 4 20# ( all steel), and 2 5#( both aluminum) tanks that all are on a regular fill or swap rotation. 4 on kegerators and 2 for stand by or mobile processes.

 

[RolandD]

Interesting comparison!

Betamax was far superior to VHS, quality wise. We can't say the same about pin locks, they're equal in quality to ball locks which were introduced later. Ball locks are now much more common.

If you want to connect your pin lock kegs to a ball lock jockey box, make sure to bring adapters or your own pin lock QDs and lines. We get pin lock kegs at homebrew events, occasionally.

I'm going even further off topic with it.

Not only is it an interesting comparison, but apt as well.

Sony introduced Betamax as a proprietary format with expensive licencing to use. JVC introduced VHS as an open format available to be used by anyone. This caused VHS to become the dominant format.

Coca-cola introduced pin-lock as a proprietary QD. Pepsi introduced ball-lock and allowed others to use it without licensing. This caused ball-locks to become the dominant QD.

I buy used pin-lock kegs and convert them to ball-lock. Initially, this was so they would fit in my mini-fridge. Now it's just for convenience.

+1 On EVA Barrier tubing, Duotight fittings, and Oetiker clamps. For the collar, look into PVC lumber. I used 5/4" x 6" PVC for my collar. Easy to work with and none of the drawbacks of having a wooden collar.

Also, spend the extra on forward sealing, stainless steel taps, and tap springs if you have a cat.

 

[eric19312]

Another vote for EVA barrier tubing for beer and gas. Get the duo tight fittings and the system goes together like legos.
Also another vote for Ball lock kegs. They have that useful PRV and don't require a special socket wrench to tear down. Usually more will fit in a freezer or keezer.
I did add a sanke tap to my kegerator so I can run a commercial "guest" keg.

 

[IslandLizard]

I did add a sanke tap to my kegerator so I can run a commercial "guest" keg.

You could put ball lock adapters on a Sanke tap, so you can easily hook up Sanke kegs to your ball lock system whenever you want/need to. Gotta watch for the added height though...

 

[IslandLizard]

Also another vote for Ball lock kegs. They have that useful PRV and don't require a special socket wrench to tear down. Usually more will fit in a freezer or keezer.

3 pluses for using (real) ball lock kegs instead of (converted) pin locks. Due to their slightly narrower profile, I can fit 5 ball locks in my upright keezer, but only 4 pin locks, if I had those.

I did acquire a few (used) ball lock kegs that came with pin lock lids, PRVs unaccessible under a dome. They've become spares now, although it's also fairly easy to pop a QD on the gas post to vent a keg when needed, but a bit harder to control exactly.

 

[superiorsat]

This works good to combat height challenges.

You could put ball lock adapters on a Sanke tap, so you can easily hook up Sanke kegs to your ball lock system whenever you want/need to. Gotta watch for the added height though...

 

[eric19312]

You could put ball lock adapters on a Sanke tap, so you can easily hook up Sanke kegs to your ball lock system whenever you want/need to. Gotta watch for the added height though...

I put duo tights on my sanke tap. Those things swap out as easy as ball lock connectors.
this one on the liquid out
https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/pushshank.htm
This fitting to replace the barbed tailpiece on the gas in
https://www.brewhardware.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=tailpieceMFL14
This on the MFL on the tailpiece
https://www.brewhardware.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=pushFFL
So easy enought to swap the sanke coupler out for either ball locks or pin locks for that matter.

You are right about the height issue. If it was tight or I was using that very stiff bevlex Barrier tubing I'd want some sort of 90 degree elbow on there but I've got enough clearance and use the more flexible EVA barrier tubing.

 

[T Murph]

You could put ball lock adapters on a Sanke tap, so you can easily hook up Sanke kegs to your ball lock system whenever you want/need to. Gotta watch for the added height though...

Kudos for mentioning the sanke ball lock conversions. I have a couple of set ups for using ball lock quick connects on sanke kegs. Additionally I have one kegerator that is too short to use a regular American Sanke tap with ball lock QDs. So I bought the Taprite Low profile tap added the ball lock quick connects and bingo, works perfectly.

 

[A1sportsdad]

Started Looking at chest freezers. Can’t find anything used so been looking at reasonably priced new. I was looking at 7.0 cf for $229 but saw the same manufacturer has 8.7 cf for $329. It’s the Hisense 8.7 cf model LC87D6EWD. Found it at Lowes.
Internal dimentions along the bottom section (not including hump) were:
L x D x H
25 5/8 x 17 1/4 x 25 1/2

Measurements for the hump are
L x D x H
8 7/8 x 17 1/4 x 17 3/4

I should be able to get a 5th 5 gallon Corny in here plus have room to put a 3 gallon Corny on the hump and leave room for mounting a fan for circulation.

I will still mount a collar. Give me some more height, room for taps and other pass throughs.

What do you think?

Thanks

 

[VirginiaHops1]

Ball lock kegs usually work better for keezers(taller and skinnier). When I was putting my kegs in my refrigerator with cobra taps pin lock dimensions were better though.

Really good advice already in this thread. Get the biggest CO2 tank you can accommodate. Putting it on the outside will allow a 20 pounder. Will save tons of money in the long run.

EVABarrier and Duotight stuff works great, and not just for beer/gas lines. I use them for my jumpers now too.

One thing I had an issue with in my keezer was temperature differential between top and bottom of the keezer, which was causing foaming on the first pour. Even with 2 fans I was having issues. I think it was because when I had 4 kegs in there they were literally packed together as tight as possible, allowing virtually no airflow in the bottom half of the keezer. I ended up adding more fans and put one of the kegs on a can to raise it up and allow a bit more airflow at the bottom, alleviating the issue. Something to keep in mind if you ever have foaming issues, which is a common problem(although can be caused by many different things)

 

[A1sportsdad]

Ball lock kegs usually work better for keezers(taller and skinnier). When I was putting my kegs in my refrigerator with cobra taps pin lock dimensions were better though.

Really good advice already in this thread. Get the biggest CO2 tank you can accommodate. Putting it on the outside will allow a 20 pounder. Will save tons of money in the long run.

EVABarrier and Duotight stuff works great, and not just for beer/gas lines. I use them for my jumpers now too.

Yes, was planning on going Ball Lock and getting a 20 lb and a 5 lb CO2 tank. I’ll use the 5 lb for transfers and what not.