The San Diego area thread

[pugsandsuds]

YES.


No

If all goes well, I'm smoking salmon tomorrow, consider this an invite for like 7pm-ish. Got too much beer in the fridge that needs consumption as we're going out of town this weekend. Ooooh might need a kitten sitter if you'll be around . I'll throw nicer beer in the fridge for tomorrow now.

 

[Tyrsis]

If all goes well, I'm smoking salmon tomorrow, consider this an invite for like 7pm-ish. Got too much beer in the fridge that needs consumption as we're going out of town this weekend. Ooooh might need a kitten sitter if you'll be around . I'll throw nicer beer in the fridge for tomorrow now.

Should be around, lemme know. Going to E3 tomorrow, zero clue when I'll be back.

 

[arren]

If all goes well, I'm smoking salmon tomorrow, consider this an invite for like 7pm-ish. Got too much beer in the fridge that needs consumption as we're going out of town this weekend. Ooooh might need a kitten sitter if you'll be around . I'll throw nicer beer in the fridge for tomorrow now.

If Tyrsis isn't around, lmk; we'll be around this weekend, and we're walking distance away

 

[rcubed1]

Little Miss Brewing's new tasting room is pretty fun. Beers are relatively cheap ($5) and a fun vibe. Ari's ready to get a little silly here on the weekend, gotta dig up the 'ole vagina monologue tanks

Nice, might have to walk over there this weekend.

 

[BigFrank]

If all goes well, I'm smoking salmon tomorrow, consider this an invite for like 7pm-ish. Got too much beer in the fridge that needs consumption as we're going out of town this weekend. Ooooh might need a kitten sitter if you'll be around . I'll throw nicer beer in the fridge for tomorrow now.

Have you smoked salmon before? How tricky is it? at what temp? What kind of set up do you use?

 

[pugsandsuds]

Have you smoked salmon before? How tricky is it? at what temp? What kind of set up do you use?

Only once before, here's the recipe I followed:
http://chocolateandmarrow.com/2014/09/30/sweet-and-savory-smoked-salmon/

I'm using a Traeger, so it was pretty easy. The smoke setting makes it pretty simple to keep it between 160-170. I think it took two hours or so for the salmon to hit 150 internally, but using a remote probe makes that easy to track. Traeger's are fancy ovens in my mind, smoking for dumb people. I'm sure it would be a little trickier with a real smoker, but if you are able to keep a lower temperature, the other prep is pretty straight forward.

 

[amk1]

I know we've moved on from this, but finally got around to trying the latest batch of GF Nelson and it was surprisingly good. It has a touch of bitterness in the finish but apparently I wasn't too bothered by it since I ended up having 2 pints. Still miss the OG but I wouldn't hesitate ordering this batch if I see it on tap somewhere again.

 

[Phischy1]

Have you smoked salmon before? How tricky is it? at what temp? What kind of set up do you use?

Sprouts sells Alder Boards.
Soak 1 board for an hour.
Coat 1 side with a thin layer of olive oil.
Lay fish skin side down, season fish.
Grill on about 400F.
Put board and fish over heat. The board will burn and this smokes the fish. Cook about 20 mins or until it flakes with a fork.
Best to remove fish from board while on grill. It's cheap, easy and delicious.

 

[nanobrew1]

To me, any beer that is fermented with just sach and lacto is a "kettle sour". Gotta have pedio/brett to make it a true "wild sour" IMO.

Yeah the whole thing is blurry, and I honestly think the breweries that aren't making "real sour" like it that way. To me the word Kettle Sour isn't a bad word. I get why it can be for some, I have had some really bad kettle sours. I have also had some really fantastic kettle sours.

As Xul said, you seem to be confusing what Kettle Sour means. It is a process rather than ingredients, and that is a pretty set term. I wouldn't say it is a "bad word", but it is associated with a product that has a higher probability of not being as good (obviously subjective) as other methods. Same with using extracts instead of "real" ingredients.

There are plenty of traditional berliners (and gose, and other sours) that are just sach and lacto but are not kettle sours.

There are a bunch of terms that are up for debate "sour" beer groups, and a lot of breweries that do not hold to these at all (breweries calling kettle sours "wild", the use of the term spontaneous when cultures are pitched, etc). Though, kettle sour is not one of those terms. It would be like arguing the term "mash" or "sparge".

To me, I define things as such:

Kettle Sour: Quick lacto souring, followed by boil of wort and addition of sach
Sour beer/ale: A beer made with lab controlled cultures of lacto/bacteria/brett
Wild: A beer made with naturally captured lacto/bacteria/brett, whether through a starter placed in the open or cultivating off of something (fruit, bark, etc)
Spontaneous: A full batch placed in an open environment where no culture or yeast is added, only natural yeast/bacteria/brett in the air cause fermentation

The couple things I am not sure where to place are:

Brewing a beer from dregs/cultures of other beers. Obviously some of these are just stepping up lab made yeast. But what about stepping up things like Cantillon and 3F? Typically I file this under "Wild", unless I know the source is 100% lab made, the it would just be a sour.
Using only natural yeast/bacteria/brett off of ingredient without stepping up or cultivating these microbes at all, i.e. adding fresh stone fruit to a full batch of unfermented wort and letting nature take its course. I can see this being described as spontaneous or wild. I have called a beer I did like this spontaneous, but I think I have shifted to feeling this is more "wild", as there are other microbes in an environment that won't come through on the fruit.
Using only brett from a lab culture, so like Orval. While not a sour, it doesn't fit into the "wild" category. Maybe another category like "Funky"?


Obviously this is dissecting terms more than it needs to be. But I feel the first (kettle sour) and last (spontaneous) terms should be well defined terms. The first because a lot of times this is a simple and near "cheat" version of a "sour" and the customer should know that is what it is. I want to know if I am getting something like Fruitlands or Palace of Cracked Heads. Spontaneous is a significant term to me because it indicates a dedication and risk to delivering a specifically unique beer. Using the term spontaneous when there was nothing spontaneous about the process is trying to claim achievement and credit for something undeserved.

Most of this is just my meaningless and worthless opinion.



TLDR: I just felt like going on a little tangent.

 

[chemman141]

As Xul said, you seem to be confusing what Kettle Sour means. It is a process rather than ingredients, and that is a pretty set term. I wouldn't say it is a "bad word", but it is associated with a product that has a higher probability of not being as good (obviously subjective) as other methods. Same with using extracts instead of "real" ingredients.

There are plenty of traditional berliners (and gose, and other sours) that are just sach and lacto but are not kettle sours.

There are a bunch of terms that are up for debate "sour" beer groups, and a lot of breweries that do not hold to these at all (breweries calling kettle sours "wild", the use of the term spontaneous when cultures are pitched, etc). Though, kettle sour is not one of those terms. It would be like arguing the term "mash" or "sparge".

To me, I define things as such:

Kettle Sour: Quick lacto souring, followed by boil of wort and addition of sach
Sour beer/ale: A beer made with lab controlled cultures of lacto/bacteria/brett
Wild: A beer made with naturally captured lacto/bacteria/brett, whether through a starter placed in the open or cultivating off of something (fruit, bark, etc)
Spontaneous: A full batch placed in an open environment where no culture or yeast is added, only natural yeast/bacteria/brett in the air cause fermentation

The couple things I am not sure where to place are;

Brewing a beer from dregs/cultures of other beers. Obviously some of these are just stepping up lab made yeast. But what about stepping up things like Cantillon and 3F? Typically I file this under "Wild", unless I know the source is 100% lab made, the it would just be a sour.
Using only natural yeast/bacteria/brett off of ingredient without stepping up or cultivating these microbes at all, i.e. adding fresh stone fruit to a full batch of unfermented wort and letting nature take its course. I can see this being described as spontaneous or wild. I have called a beer I did like this spontaneous, but I think I have shifted to feeling this is more "wild", as there are other microbes in an environment that won't come through on the fruit.


Obviously this is dissecting terms more than it needs to be. But I feel the first (kettle sour) and last (spontaneous) terms should be well defined terms. The first because a lot of times this is a simple and near "cheat" version of a "sour" and the customer should know that is what it is. I want to know if I am getting something like Fruitlands or Palace of Cracked Heads. Spontaneous is a significant term to me because it indicates a dedication and risk to delivering a specifically unique beer. Using the term spontaneous when there was nothing spontaneous about the process is trying to claim achievement and credit for something undeserved.

Most of this is just my meaningless and worthless opinion.



TLDR: I just felt like going on a little tangent.

hahaha I totally agree that "kettle sour" is a specific process but to me the definition of the word has mutated to "quick sour" not necessarily something done in the kettle. With your 4 levels of sour beer, where would you put something that was transferred to a fermented and then pitched with just lacto and sach? I personally wouldn't consider that a "sour beer" as to me a "sour beer" needs to have wild yeast and bacteria (pedio, brett) with a funky flavor and aroma. Not something that has a clean lactic acid flavor.

 

[nanobrew1]

hahaha I totally agree that "kettle sour" is a specific process but to me the definition of the word has mutated to "quick sour" not necessarily something done in the kettle. With your 4 levels of sour beer, where would you put something that was transferred to a fermented and then pitched with just lacto and sach? I personally wouldn't consider that a "sour beer" as to me a "sour beer" needs to have wild yeast and bacteria (pedio, brett) with a funky flavor and aroma. Not something that has a clean lactic acid flavor.

That would be a sour beer. Not sure why it would fall under Kettle Sour when that specifically is the method of souring in a kettle. My Berliners have a little bit of brett in it... not sure how that makes it "sour", especially since brett doesn't really have a tartness to it (compared to lacto). I don't think the term has shifted to mean "quick sour", I think quick sours are typically kettle soured. I can turn my berliner out in about 6 weeks, that is quick for a sour. I would say it is a "quick sour", but it has brett and nothing to do with kettle souring.

Plus your term "wild yeast and bacteria" depends on what you mean by wild. Those can and a lot of time are lab cultured. So while they may not be "typical" in normal beer, they are not really wild. I believe the term wild for describing these microbes is because we typically only originally saw them in spontaneous/wild fermented beers.

 

[benbikes4beer]

Nice to see some #talkbeer on talkbeer. Refreshing change of pace.

#poncesmeetupthread
#talktraeger

Related note, if you wanna **** around with Oak, Beech, or Maple that's basically half of our trash at work. The angel's share of cabinet making...actually that might be more like the sawdust. Devil's cut? Anyways. #talkwood

 

[rcubed1]

Nice to see some #talkbeer on talkbeer. Refreshing change of pace.

#poncesmeetupthread
#talktraeger

Related note, if you wanna **** around with Oak, Beech, or Maple that's basically half of our trash at work. The angel's share of cabinet making...actually that might be more like the sawdust. Devil's cut? Anyways. #talkwood

You need to pelletize that stuff. #talktraeger #traegerclub

 

[benbikes4beer]

You need to pelletize that stuff. #talktraeger #traegerclub

<looks up pelletizer setups>

HAH ok lets fire up Kickstarter

 

[SanDiegoJoe2011]

#talkbeer
#talkfish

Best Eppig beer to pair with fresh caught Bluefin Tuna?
-sashimi
-Mango Habenero ceviche
-Seared Tuba Steaks
-Toro

Also, do they fill growlers? If so, what kind? If not, I'm content with just grabbing some crowlers.

 

[Sage1]

Also, so they fill growlers? If so, what kind? If not, I'm content with just grabbing some crowlers.

http://californiagrowlerfills.com

Special Lager for the sashimi/toro, Festbier for the ceviche, Zwickelbier for the seared tuna.

 

[SanDiegoJoe2011]

Awesome!

Thanks for the recommendations!

 

[chemman141]

http://californiagrowlerfills.com

Special Lager for the sashimi/toro, Festbier for the ceviche, Zwickelbier for the seared tuna.

I want the beer, you can have the fish lol.

 

[sdreaper]

National Bourbon Day being celebrated at Alesmith. This is your invite, you know where I'll be. ETA, 4ish.

I know for specials, at the very least Velvet Echo is being tapped again as well as '15 Olde Ale.

 

[DannyFullpint]

Nice to see some #talkbeer on talkbeer. Refreshing change of pace.

#poncesmeetupthread
#talktraeger

Related note, if you wanna **** around with Oak, Beech, or Maple that's basically half of our trash at work. The angel's share of cabinet making...actually that might be more like the sawdust. Devil's cut? Anyways. #talkwood

But did you watch SmackDown Live this week? #TalkJinderMahal

 

[DannyFullpint]

I'm know Trager makes great food but it's the kettle sour/extract home brew of bbq. #TalkShade

 

[pugsandsuds]

Sprouts sells Alder Boards.
Soak 1 board for an hour.
Coat 1 side with a thin layer of olive oil.
Lay fish skin side down, season fish.
Grill on about 400F.
Put board and fish over heat. The board will burn and this smokes the fish. Cook about 20 mins or until it flakes with a fork.
Best to remove fish from board while on grill. It's cheap, easy and delicious.

I'm know Trager makes great food but it's the kettle sour/extract home brew of bbq. #TalkShade

Grilled plank fish really is the kettle sour equivalent of smoking. Aka just not the same product, even if you've got recognizable flavors.

Traegers somewhere between Pizza Port's canning line (far technically superior than alternatives, producing great results if you make the capital investment) and AB-InBev (******* distribution channels by going through Costco road shows). Either way, my salmon turned out fantastic and a sixer of pick six was the perfect accoutrement for it.

 

[Abigigail]

Grilled plank fish really is the kettle sour equivalent of smoking. Aka just not the same product, even if you've got recognizable flavors.

Traegers somewhere between Pizza Port's canning line (far technically superior than alternatives, producing great results if you make the capital investment) and AB-InBev (******* distribution channels by going through Costco road shows). Either way, my salmon turned out fantastic and a sixer of pick six was the perfect accoutrement for it.

#talkkettlesalmon

 

[sdreaper]

Ended up at O'Brien's after Alesmith to have a little get together since Lauren's last day is tomorrow. I half expected to see Sage and benbikes4beer . I was disappointed. =(

 

[cquiroga]

blahblahblahblha

Using only natural yeast/bacteria/brett off of ingredient without stepping up or cultivating these microbes at all, i.e. adding fresh stone fruit to a full batch of unfermented wort and letting nature take its course. I can see this being described as spontaneous or wild. I have called a beer I did like this spontaneous, but I think I have shifted to feeling this is more "wild", as there are other microbes in an environment that won't come through on the fruit.

moreblahahalabalahblah

I don't care what you call that ****, just please brew some more of that "Spontaneous" Masumoto goodness. Kthx.

 

[Phischy1]

Grilled plank fish really is the kettle sour equivalent of smoking. Aka just not the same product, even if you've got recognizable flavors.

Traegers somewhere between Pizza Port's canning line (far technically superior than alternatives, producing great results if you make the capital investment) and AB-InBev (******* distribution channels by going through Costco road shows). Either way, my salmon turned out fantastic and a sixer of pick six was the perfect accoutrement for it.

Really?
A cheap Traeger starts at $400
An offset 20" dia stick smoker starts at $1,600
An alder plank is $1.50. For a 1lbs piece of wild salmon, it's the cheap, easy, quick way to add a little smoke without spending alot. And is a lot more approachable by many.

Or another cheap trick for fish (won't work on brisket) is get an old tuna can, take a drill and put some small holes in it for air flow. Then get a mix of smoking pellets, fill the can, use a torch to get the pellets smoking and place in the corner of your grill. A more complex smoke will flavor the fish without spending a fortune. If you want a fancy tray, buy this:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007ROPJ1M/?tag=talkbecom09-20

I have one of these as well, don't actually fill it full, I did while smoking 5 chickens and they were over smoked. In...an electric smoker! *GASP*

Anyway, there are many ways to add a touch of smoke without spending much.

 

[rcubed1]

Traeger is the beer equivalent of the Picobrew system. #TalkHomebrew

Nothing wrong with it if you get good results but you probably can do better. That being said, the best whole chicken I've had has been cooked on a Traeger with their chicken rub.

 

[Sage1]

Ended up at O'Brien's after Alesmith to have a little get together since Lauren's last day is tomorrow. I half expected to see Sage and benbikes4beer . I was disappointed. =(

Heh we were both there (from about 9:30 to 11:00). Lots of new and good stuff on tap at Obs at the moment.

 

[sdreaper]

Heh we were both there (from about 9:30 to 11:00). Lots of new and good stuff on tap at Obs at the moment.

Da fuq.....I left at like 10. That will teach me to not go inside and get another pint.

 

[Phischy1]

Traeger is the beer equivalent of the Picobrew system. #TalkHomebrew

Nothing wrong with it if you get good results but you probably can do better. That being said, the best whole chicken I've had has been cooked on a Traeger with their chicken rub.

Where does the Grainfather fall in the smoking spectrum?