Substitutions for Belgian Dubbel

[drunkinThailand]

I want to brew up a Belgian Dubbel, but am having to make a few substitutions as not all grains are available where I live (even through shipping). The recipe calls for

9# Rahr 2-row pale
30 oz aromatic malt
15 oz special B
15 oz Weyermann Munich Malt
10 oz Simpsons Crystal 50L
2 oz Simspons Crystal 155L

This is what have for everything but the Crystal 155L:
Pilsner 2-row (belgian)
Abbey (aromatic) malt (caslte malting) or Melanoiden Malt (weyermann)
Special B
Munich Malt Type 1
Crystal Malt 50L (castle malting)

But I can't find Crystal 155L. So I have 2 questions:

1) any other malts I can substitue for Crystal 155L?

2) Is Abbey (aromatic) malt the same as Aromatic Malt? Or should I use Melanoiden?

thanks for any help

 

[jmcquesten]

If you're not set on the color, you could use the highest (darkest) crystal malt you could find, maybe some crystal 120 L or something close (80 L, 90 L, etc). I don't think it would make bad beer, it just might not be as dark or carmely. Can you get the belgian Candi syrup? That can take place of some of the specialty malts.

Yes, use the aromatic if you have it. If not, you can use the melanoidin.

 

[dmtaylor]

Looks like you will be fine. You don't need the Crystal 155 at all, the recipe will give you a deep brown malty beer without it. In fact you already have maybe a little too much specialty malts. I would cut the Abbey (aromatic) malt in half and instead add an extra pound of the pilsner malt.

I think you will really love this beer. Cheers!

 

[Singletrack]

Castle Abbey is not Aromatic, nor is it similar. I cannot say whether Melanoidin is closer, but that's what I would use -- partly because it annoys me that the seller(s) of Abbey put "(aromatic)" next to it for no reason except that it was once misnamed, and now they don't want to confuse any old-timers who knew it as Aromatic.

 

[Aristotelian]

If you really want to be true to the recipe, you could try getting some 120L and toasting it a bit darker.

 

[jmcquesten]

I missed the part where it's not actually aromatic malt. I have no experience with Abbey(aromatic), and my first comment was based on actual aromatic malt.

 

[drunkinThailand]

thanks for the advice, I think I will just leave out the Crystal 155L for now. I am pretty new to brewing so will wait to try and roast my own grains to a darker color. And thanks for the clarification about the Abbey not being the same as Aromatic.

I have been looking at the recipe further and am a bit unclear as to the hop additions. It is not clear if it means

Williamette (0.6 oz) 90 min
Williamette (0.7 oz) 60 min
Sterling (0.6 oz) 30 min

or

Williamette (0.6 oz) 90 min
Sterling (0.6 oz) 30 min

Any one have any ideas/advice as to which is correct/better?

thanks again

 

[dmtaylor]

thanks for the advice, I think I will just leave out the Crystal 155L for now. I am pretty new to brewing so will wait to try and roast my own grains to a darker color. And thanks for the clarification about the Abbey not being the same as Aromatic.

I have been looking at the recipe further and am a bit unclear as to the hop additions. It is not clear if it means

Williamette (0.6 oz) 90 min
Williamette (0.7 oz) 60 min
Sterling (0.6 oz) 30 min

or

Williamette (0.6 oz) 90 min
Sterling (0.6 oz) 30 min

Any one have any ideas/advice as to which is correct/better?

thanks again

I'm honestly not familiar with Abbey malt. Sounds like a worthwhile experiment anyway though!

As for the hopping, you'll definitely want to go with the first schedule with the total of 1.9 oz hops, assuming you are brewing about 5 gallons (20 liters).

 

[drunkinThailand]

Cool, thanks again

 

[Singletrack]

Are you trying to get ingredients in Thailand? Not sure why I would think that.

 

[z-bob]

That's a *lot* of specialty malt you got there. Either leave out the 155 crystal or substitute Special B for it.

I think most Trappist dubbels are rather simple recipes with just pilnser malt and dark sugar syrup. Dark sugar is expensive, so Americans use dark malts instead.

What yeast are you using?

 

[drunkinThailand]

Yes SingleTrack, I do get my ingredients here in Thailand. Luckily home brewing is actually pretty popular here so I can get a lot of stuff, but there is also a lot of stuff I can't get.

And about there being a lot of specialty malt Z-Bob, I got the recipe from a book about clones of great craft brews, and that's how they had the recipe. So I'll give it a try and see how it goes.

And as for yeast the only suitable yeast I can get here is Mangrove Jacks Belgian Ale.