Storing beer in a cornie.

[EarthBound]

Wow. You contradicted other persons' viewpoints because of things you know to be factual, and no one told you to go self-procreate.

The shaker table allows the brewery to produce more finished beer with the same amount of serving kegs. Less time carb'ing means less volume required for the pipeline. No amount of planning can fix that, unless you mean financial planning for investment in more serving kegs.

LMAO! Regardless of the fact that you are nothing more than a source of amusement, I must ask... how much brewing experience do you actually have? Do you even brew beer?

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

HEY! No pissing contests in my thread!

Please and thank you.

 

[cwi]

"Self Procreation" is impossible. So go self copulate you igorant freak!

Apparently you are ignorant of female sharks and parthenogenesis, and if you open the door to things outside the animal kingdom.... Although no copulation is involved, which was my point, or should I say EarthBound's point. So yes, your verbiage is more specific. I promise to not make that mistake again.

 

[cwi]

LMAO! Regardless of the fact that you are nothing more than a source of amusement, I must ask... how much brewing experience do you actually have? Do you even brew beer?

I could say the same. So far the only discourse I have had with you involved you being so enraged by a position I took (in a discussion that you did not even materially contribute to), that you made a remark (directed at me) requiring deletion by the mods and closing of the thread. And just when I had another live one on the line, too.

I say we abide by the OP's request.

 

[EarthBound]

I could say the same. So far the only discourse I have had with you involved you being so enraged by a position I took (in a discussion that you did not even materially contribute to), that you made a remark requiring deletion by the mods and closing of the thread. And just when I had another live one on the line, too.

I say we abide by the OP's request.

I agree on respecting the OP's request, but I must clarify something with you: I was joking with you in that other thread. You're nothing more than a source of entertainment for me, so don't take me so seriously.

I have never been angered in any way by anyone on HBT. In fact, I consider all of you to be my (imaginary) friends. Cheers!

 

[cwi]

I've seen a set up (on this site somewhere) where a guy got a regulator and hooked the primary side up to a gas barb and had the secondary side hooked up to nothing.. He then hooked up a gas out from his gas manifold to a beer out barb...

IOW, he hooked up his keg backwards... He set the outgoing regulator to the pressure he desired the beer to be carbed at, and then would send in blasts of CO2... basically doing the same thing I just said, only without turning the keg upside down... The principle is still the same, sending agitating gas up through the beer to release excess suspended carbonation..

Just so nobody tries that method of using a regulator-
That may have worked for him, if that is indeed how he did it, but it is a fluke if it does, and isn't reliable. Pressure reducing regulators don't function properly in reverse. The brewing term for a device that would do this is called a spunding valve. There are several threads with the part numbers from Grainger used to build one. Usually they are used for limiting pressure when fermenting under pressure, which is another topic altogether.

 

[Lost]

Just so nobody tries that method of using a regulator-
That may have worked for him, if that is indeed how he did it, but it is a fluke if it does, and isn't reliable. Pressure reducing regulators don't function properly in reverse. The brewing term for a device that would do this is called a spunding valve. There are several threads with the part numbers from Grainger used to build one. Usually they are used for limiting pressure when fermenting under pressure, which is another topic altogether.

I think you misunderstood what he is saying, maybe..

You send gas in through the beer dip tube to carbonate. The co2 bubbles up through the beer and dissolves a bit faster than it would just sitting in the headspace. I've done this and think it does help.

But it is risky because the beer can backflow up the gas line and into the regulator. Of course this could also happen with the gas hooked to the gas post if you are rolling the keg (a typical method of quick carbing)

Be careful to never reduce the pressure from the regulator while the gas is hooked to the beer side. A check valve on the gas line is also a very wise safety precaution.

 

[cwi]

I think you misunderstood what he is saying, maybe..

The original description was confusing to say the least, and was a bit off topic since it started off talking about de-carbing. However, I think I correctly interpreted the part about the additional regulator itself being hooked up in reverse, which won't work as described to turn it into a spunding valve.

In the post, there were two end goals, carbing and de-carbing, and (at least?) three methods describing how to do them. One was scrubbing excess CO2 using more CO2 to agitate the beer causing a release of dissolved CO2. The equivalent of shaking a soda bottle example, and releasing the gas, only gently and continuously. Another described someone else's fancy technique of using a spunding valve to automatically release the excess pressure while agitating. Contrary to what was stated, the beer can be decarbed below the pressure in the head space, just like what happens to a soda bottle when you shake it. Yet another was a force carbing technique using the same basic gas flow as scrubbing, only to add CO2 into solution. This is like your method of putting gas in through the out door. This was then followed by de-carbing, presumably because he overcarbed(?).

To add some additional variations- You can carb even faster by combining the two, and continuously bubbling CO2 through the beer by using a spunding valve (or cracking the relief valve frequently) to allow a release of excess pressure. This creates a continous flow of CO2 to increase surface transfer. It wastes CO2, but would carb fast. The same overcarbing danger exists if the input pressure is higher than your desired carb level.

A spunding valve can also be used to reduce the carb level slowly, like a set and forget; or rapidly by agitating with bubbled gas, (kind of) like the high pressure shake, rattle, and roll method. The same caveats apply- going with either quick and dirty method you can over-decarbonate just like you can overcarbonate.

You send gas in through the beer dip tube to carbonate. The co2 bubbles up through the beer and dissolves a bit faster than it would just sitting in the headspace. I've done this and think it does help.

Yes, but only a tiny, tiny bit. Even with a stone, something like 90% of the CO2 is dissolved where the plume breaks the surface, unless your release rate is so low the plume doesn't break the surface, but that would make for an extremely slow carb'ing method. With the size of the bubbles coming from the dip tube, the plume effect is insignificant. In this case, the surface of the beer in the head space is where virtually all of the dissolving is taking place. With the set and forget method, one trick is to lay the keg on it side to increase the surface area.

But it is risky because the beer can backflow up the gas line and into the regulator. Of course this could also happen with the gas hooked to the gas post if you are rolling the keg (a typical method of quick carbing)

Be careful to never reduce the pressure from the regulator while the gas is hooked to the beer side. A check valve on the gas line is also a very wise safety precaution.

Yes, check valves are your friends. I don't know why they are so expensive ($8) for what they are.

 

[cheezydemon3]

Apparently you are ignorant of female sharks and parthenogenesis, and if you open the door to things outside the animal kingdom.... Although no copulation is involved, which was my point, or should I say EarthBound's point. So yes, your verbiage is more specific. I promise to not make that mistake again.

 

[audger]

I've never even heard of someone proposing any evidence that shaking results with a "slightly harsher feel to the beer."

burst carbonating causes a temporary pH spike in the liquid of 0.2 to 0.4 points. it was discussed in some edition of brew your own.

i can taste the difference between a keg thats been given 3 weeks to carb on its own, vs a keg that was put on gas yesterday and shaken. even if they have the same level of dissolved CO2.

 

[Lost]

burst carbonating causes a temporary pH spike in the liquid of 0.2 to 0.4 points. it was discussed in some edition of brew your own.

i can taste the difference between a keg thats been given 3 weeks to carb on its own, vs a keg that was put on gas yesterday and shaken. even if they have the same level of dissolved CO2.

I personally can't taste the difference. It would also reduce ph, I think, not raise it since the gas creates carbonic acid. I won't deny the chemistry since I'm not a chemist, but I will say that I think what you're noticing is a placebo effect. I'll wager that with a 10 gal batch split into 2 cornies you couldn't tell the difference in a side by side comparison.

Perhaps with a very light lager or cream ale.. maybe.. maybe.. but almost certainly not with anything that has a more assertive flavor profile (ipa, stout, porter, apa, etc.).

In my early days I had some beers get a seltzer-water taste from quick carbing but I am 100% certain this was from over carbing the beer while trying to force carb quickly. Once I adhered to the rule to never set the pressure higher than serving pressure that problem went away.

I shake the beers and they turn out just fine. I just do it at serving pressure, doing it at elevated pressures is a recipe for over carbed beers.


And I agree that feeding the gas in through the dip tube probably doesn't help much but it does make it easy to tell when the gas has stopped going in while shaking (the gurgling is very audible). I also do it usually when the corny is 99% full since there is practically no head space in that situation.

 

[r8rphan]

Just so nobody tries that method of using a regulator-
That may have worked for him, if that is indeed how he did it, but it is a fluke if it does, and isn't reliable. Pressure reducing regulators don't function properly in reverse. The brewing term for a device that would do this is called a spunding valve. There are several threads with the part numbers from Grainger used to build one. Usually they are used for limiting pressure when fermenting under pressure, which is another topic altogether.

FTR.. I never tried the regulator method... I used the upside down with the party tap method and it worked great..

The other method was detailed in another thread elsewhere (with pictures) and is where I got the idea to use the party tap with the keg upside down...

But I probably described the process in the other thread wrong....

He likely used the regulator to input gas to the dip tube, and then released on the gas inlet side of the corny... It's been a while... Surely someone knows the thread I speak of... It was a handy technique for when you need to de-carb a beer fast... (for me I needed to carb fast, and to do so, I purposely overcarbed, with the intent to de-carb afterwards)..