Steeping grains = Better extract beer?

[mgr_stl]

I've brewed three extract kits and all had steeping grains. I like the whole beer brewing process, and would feel like I was cutting corners if I didn't have grains in the recipe.

So, my question is the following. Are there any particular types of beer that don't benefit from steeping grains?

 

[Yooper]

I can't think of any, but maybe a hefeweizen doesn't benefit as much as some other beer styles from steeping grains.

Steeping grains provide flavor, color, and head retention while the extract is the "base".

Think of grains like "spices" for the extract. Just like you start with tomato sauce to make spaghetti sauce, you need onions and garlic and oregano for the great spaghetti sauce flavor.

The same is true with beer. While you get malt flavor from extract, the grains provide the flavor and color and other qualities that make the malt extract into a beer that isn't just plain malt flavor and hops. Since much of the flavor a a hefeweizen is derived from the yeast, that's why I said a hefeweizen may not benefit from the steeping grains as much. But there is no way you can make a beer like a stout without grains like roasted barley.

 

[unionrdr]

You can make good AE beers without steeping grains. The grains just freshen them up a little & can add color & some different flavor complexities. Check out midwests' crystal & specialty grains for what they say the particular grains contribute. It'll def give you some ideas. I took a dark lager recipe from a member & added German WL029 yeast,& german hops to the Czech ones he uses. I also added some German rauchmalt,so the two steeping grains he used had to be mashed with the rauchmalt. So far,it adds a grilled roastiness to the wort. It's one of those things where reading what a grain can contribute that make the little differences we love.
That's why I recommended reading up on the steeping grains flavor & color profiles to get more familiar with what they contribute.
I make some of my recipes with all extract & hops that are good. You just have to combine not only different extracts,but ones from different countries as well. Beer/ales from around the world mean different things to different nationalities. Darker,lighter maltier,hoppier,drier,sweeter. Caramelly,bready,toasty,roasty. Some of the newer extracts coming out can give you some really different characters if you use your imagination & study a little. I've been doing that from the beginning,& they just come to me.

 

[glenn514]

Both of the above replies are examples of MUCH more brewing experience than I've had, but I believe that extract brewing with "specialty grains" is between all-extract and all-grain. "Partial mash" is in there, too, but more grain seems to be used. I have enjoyed all my "specialty grain" brews just as much as my "all grain" batches. It's just another way to enhance the final product.

glenn514

 

[unionrdr]

That's about it,yeah. Extract with steeping grains can use a little bit like 13oz or as much as a couple pounds. It depends on what color & flavor complexities you're looking for in a given style.
And partial mash is def easy now that I've done it a few times. Makes me wonder why I waited 2 years. But AE does & always has held a certain facination for me. So many different extracts,& from different countries where different flavors are popular. Then combine that with the right yeast for more complexity depending on the style & country of origin. Dito on the hops. See where this is going? That's how my mind worked from the beiginning of this great adventure.
Working with grains has just widened my perspective of what various styles can be filtered through an American mindset.

 

[fishfoolz]

I agree with everyone so far. This is the most interesting hobby I have ever gotten into. So many possibilities. I have tried AE and it was ok, but if you add grains it makes an entirely different taste, look, and feel to the brew. I like adding grains and think that you have to steep grains to get a truly great beer. That's just my opinion, but I feel strongly about it.

 

[brewguyver]

Piling on, steeping grains are already carmalized, gelatinized, or otherwise converted so you can get the characteristics folks have described without mashing. Partial mash is the next step, where you use some base grain (e.g. 2-row) in place of the extract. Either way you can get a greater depth of character and a little more control then you might get from AE.

 

[unionrdr]

You can def alter the basic malt flavor profiles with PM. So many flavors from different grains is the cool part. I'm trying to think of 2 beers I can do next month to expand on some more grain based flavors.

 

[Calder]

So, my question is the following. Are there any particular types of beer that don't benefit from steeping grains?

Belgian trippels, (and BGS), Berliner Weisse, and Lambics are a few that immediately come to mind.

 

[brewguyver]

Belgian trippels, (and BGS), Berliner Weisse, and Lambics are a few that immediately come to mind.

I can see Lambics, and definitely the BW, but can you elaborate on the triple?

 

[logan3825]

Depends on your end goal. I made some excellent American wheats with just extract and hops. Grains may have added some depth but I was just looking for a hop delivery vehicle. If you don't want the beer very dark or sweet you can go without grains.

 

[CrookedTail]

There are some styles where you can get away with not using steeping grains. Most are beers where the yeast defines the flavor profile. Hefe-weizens (as Yooper mentioned), and some Belgian styles.

You can even brew some good IPAs with light extract, and a good hop schedule.

Any malt-forward beer should have grains in the recipe.

 

[GrogNerd]

put it this way... brewing is like cooking, extract is your chicken and specialty grains are your BAM!

 

[unionrdr]

Malt forward beers can be easily well made without grains. It just matters which extracts yo mix together & in what quantities. Now that I've got the hang of mashing,it might be interesting to experiment with partial mash versions. But AE can be done quite well with a good process.

 

[ZombieBrew83]

+1 for the BGS and the triple. Both depend on the yeast, extract type, and fermentation conditions. The basic starting point for these recipes is 80% Extract and 20% sugar. The hops play a small roll but the yeast is really the star in both styles.

 

[thadius856]

I can't think of any, but maybe a hefeweizen doesn't benefit as much as some other beer styles from steeping grains.

All lawnmower beers don't jump out in my mind either as benefiting from specialty grains in my mind.

 

[flars]

I've brewed three extract kits and all had steeping grains. I like the whole beer brewing process, and would feel like I was cutting corners if I didn't have grains in the recipe.

So, my question is the following. Are there any particular types of beer that don't benefit from steeping grains?

A recipe is a recipe. If you would be baking an Irish Soda Bread would you add honey? If you added honey you would no longer have Irish Soda Bread. You brewed some beers which had steeping grains in the recipe and you liked the result. That does not mean recipes with steeping grains are the only recipes which can produce the ultimate tasty brew.

 

[beerluvva]

...Partial mash is the next step, where you use some base grain (e.g. 2-row) in place of the extract. Either way you can get a greater depth of character and a little more control then you might get from AE.

When you partial mash, are you using a bag for the grain, like you do with steeping? Is partial mash basically BIAB, but with less grain, and a majority of extract?

 

[thadius856]

I went from extract to AG without steps between, but...

From what I understand partial mash is where you mash half of the fermentables as grain separately and pour in LME/DME for the other half. That way, if you do the mash well, you can substantially add complexity. If you mess it up, the beer's still drinkable.

Lets you get your "mash legs", so to speak.

 

[beerluvva]

...From what I understand partial mash is where you mash half of the fermentables as grain separately and pour in LME/DME for the other half...
Lets you get your "mash legs", so to speak.

So, in terms of equipment and process, for partial mash you do the same as all grain, where in BIAB, you use the bag to mash in the brew pot. Which is convenient, but I guess there is no Lautering process?

 

[thadius856]

From what I understand, yes. Partial grain you just have half a grain bill and use LME/DME for the other half.

BIAB is a great way to get the feel for temps and make a mash on the cheap, but doesn't seem to scale to very large batch sizes well. Also, you have to be able to lift all that wet grain out and suspend it above the pot for a few minutes while it drains. Not fun, but doable with a 10# grain bill. Much less doable with a 40# grain bill without putting up a rafter hook in your garage.

 

[feinbera]

The difference between steeping grains and partial mash is that, with partial mash, you're actually trying to convert starch in your grains into sugar by holding them at certain temperatures for certain amounts of time, while with steeping, you're essentially just making "grain tea" -- extracting flavor and color by keeping it in warm water for a while, but not really caring about being too accurate, because you're not trying to extract fermentable sugars.

You can partial mash any way you choose, but doing it in a bag is certainly a little less messy.

I highly recommend it as a "gateway drug" to all-grain; allows you to get the hang of mashing with the "safety net" of extract to provide fermentables and still let you make beer even if you make a total mess of your mash.

 

[beerluvva]

Thanks guys, good advice... It helps to plot my path to all grain.. I'll end up there someday, but first I want to see how good I can make extract....

 

[Weezy]

+1 for the BGS and the triple. Both depend on the yeast, extract type, and fermentation conditions. The basic starting point for these recipes is 80% Extract and 20% sugar. The hops play a small roll but the yeast is really the star in both styles.

+1...heck yeah, pils extract and the super dark belgian candy sugar, then some saaz, finish with Belgian yeasties of your choosing..done and very tasty.