SSR Question

[cantrell00]

Having some issues & troubleshooting some things...

If you measure continuity of the output side of the SSR (pin 1 & 2) while the PID is turning the SSR on & if the contact is closed - it should read as a short, right?

 

[FriendOfBrewers]

Your SSR is probably and A/C SSR and they usually require a load (on the output side) to turn on. If this is the case, then I don't think testing with a typical DC continuity tester will work.

 

[cantrell00]

Your SSR is probably and A/C SSR and they usually require a load (on the output side) to turn on. If this is the case, then I don't think testing with a typical DC continuity tester will work.

Auber 25 amp. DC from the PID into the SSR (12 volts), A/C on the output side...

I have not connected it to a element yet. I have been trying to test it prior to applying a load.

 

[augiedoggy]

Auber 25 amp. DC from the PID into the SSR (12 volts), A/C on the output side...

I have not connected it to a element yet. I have been trying to test it prior to applying a load.

well it wont hurt the element in anyway to do a live test...it will either work or not... some test with a light bulb as well....

 

[Brumateur]

+1
You can test it with any wattage 120v incandescent lamp.

 

[Wacki]

If I recall correctly, you need some type of special equipment to test an ssr and can't do it with just a regular voltage meter...

Edit:
This link may help

http://smokedprojects.blogspot.com/2013/09/solid-state-relay-module.html?m=1

 

[cantrell00]

THANKS EVERYONE!

 

[augiedoggy]

If I recall correctly, you need some type of special equipment to test an ssr and can't do it with just a regular voltage meter...

Edit:
This link may help

http://smokedprojects.blogspot.com/2013/09/solid-state-relay-module.html?m=1

as mentioned twice above... a light bulb works fine, no special tools needed...

 

[Wacki]

as mentioned twice above... a light bulb works fine, no special tools needed...

Good post, Doggie!! The poster asked how to test with continuity... Which is what I was answering (and your post(s) failed to address). But like I also iterated through the link, light bulbs work to test too...

 

[augiedoggy]

Good post, Doggie!! The poster asked how to test with continuity... Which is what I was answering (and your post(s) failed to address). But like I also iterated through the link, light bulbs work to test too...

If you have continuity the light bulb lights up, if not it doesn't! ..That would be the whole point of the test.. and it is an effective way to troubleshoot.. I'm not really sure what the point of all this is... Its the continuity and flow of electricity successfully that allows the light bulb to illuminate. I really did not think this needed to be explained here but thank you.

Are you one of those guys with a garage full of impractical specialized tools for everything?

Why over complicate things? If the OP really wants to play with tools he can use a meter to test for voltage at the outgoing connector while a load such as the light bulb lights up and turns off though

 

[Wacki]

If you have continuity the light bulb lights up, if not it doesn't! ..That would be the whole point of the test.. and it is an effective way to troubleshoot.. I'm not really sure what the point of all this is... Its the continuity and flow of electricity successfully that allows the light bulb to illuminate. I really did not think this needed to be explained here but thank you.

Are you one of those guys with a garage full of impractical specialized tools for everything?

Why over complicate things? If the OP really wants to play with tools he can use a meter to test for voltage at the outgoing connector while a load such as the light bulb lights up and turns off though

LOL, I guess this is just over your head...

That's the point, you can't use a meter to test alone, you need a load hooked up in order to be able to measure with just a meter if it's dead or not...which the load (like a light) would tell you anyway. Otherwise you need special equipment to test by itself.

 

[augiedoggy]

LOL, I guess this is just over your head...

That's the point, you can't use a meter to test alone, you need a load hooked up in order to be able to measure with just a meter if it's dead or not...which the load (like a light) would tell you anyway. Otherwise you need special equipment to test by itself.

I understand perfectly.... The question of how to troubleshoot was answered as well as the fact that you couldn't just do it with a meter alone...
All im saying your post ignored all that and went on about special tools needed... Theres no need for me or anyone else to bore the OP with long winded reasoning on why he cant test with just a meter as it wont help him get his control panel working any faster than just using a light bulb to test. Plus this could be confusing the the OP depending on his skillset and knowledge.... He could have interpreted your post as conflicting information.
You added the link after the the fact.

Its is really pretty silly that we are bickering over this. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill...

 

[Wacki]

I understand perfectly.... The question of how to troubleshoot was answered as well as the fact that you couldn't just do it with a meter alone...
All im saying your post ignored all that and went on about special tools needed... Theres no need for me or anyone else to bore the OP with long winded reasoning on why he cant test with just a meter as it wont help him get his control panel working any faster than just using a light bulb to test. Plus this could be confusing the the OP depending on his skillset and knowledge.... He could have interpreted your post as conflicting information.
You added the link after the the fact.

Its is really pretty silly that we are bickering over this. Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill...

Excellent point doggy, I'm not going to argue with you, thanks for the great input!!

Edit:
And yes, the link was added maybe 30s after the post, another excellent point!!

 

[cantrell00]

Just a heads up. It works.

 

[Wacki]

Just a heads up. It works.

Glad to hear...what are the issues you are troubleshooting? Not getting a signal from the pid? No current to the element?

Or is everything all good now?

 

[cantrell00]

Glad to hear...what are the issues you are troubleshooting? Not getting a signal from the pid? No current to the element?

Or is everything all good now?

Everything is good now....

I never connected the element until I verified everything. Well, as I was taking measurements, I noticed that the continuity on the output of the SSR never changed when receiving a signal from the PID... Hmmm..

Then I measured the output of the receptacle & it was reading 240 volts even when the SSR wasn't powered on.

After reading that you can't troubleshoot a SSR like a typical mechanical switch & that it had to "see" a load on it's output, I decided - what the hell & hooked everything up & turned it on... Worked without a hitch...

I don't think I ever had an issue - just needed to apply a load to the SSR..

Electricity isn't my strong suit. Heh...

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

sometimes ssr's are only buggy when being on for a long time at full wattage, Ive had them work great until a long boil and weld them self shut so keep it cool as best you can and if one sticks at all replace it !. it will only get worse.

 

[doug293cz]

sometimes ssr's are only buggy when being on for a long time at full wattage, Ive had them work great until a long boil and weld them self shut so keep it cool as best you can and if one sticks at all replace it !. it will only get worse.

Good advice. SSR's are semiconductor devices, and for most semiconductors, the time to fail is cut in half for each 10ºC rise in junction temperature. Junction temperature is the temp inside the piece of silicon containing the triac. This is much hotter than the case or heatsink temps.

Brew on

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

when you buy an FX computer processor you get a stock heat sink and fan I use that mounted tight onto my ssr with arctic silver in-between, I use a 12 volt adapter to power the fan and it runs continuously when the power is on.

since Ive made this change during any usage even 2 hours the heat sink is ice cold, never even gotten warm

 

[Wacki]

Glad to hear it's working, I did the same thing and tried to verify everything before firing it up, that's where I found the bit about needing a special device to test ssr's (which I don't have, nor do I know exactly what it is), so then I also just decided just to fire it up!! Worked like a charm...

Are you using 40a or 25a ssr's? Just to piggy back on what the others are saying, the 40a ones generate less heat under the same load, and therefore would be less likely to fail...

 

[doug293cz]

when you buy an FX computer processor you get a stock heat sink and fan I use that mounted tight onto my ssr with arctic silver in-between, I use a 12 volt adapter to power the fan and it runs continuously when the power is on.

since Ive made this change during any usage even 2 hours the heat sink is ice cold, never even gotten warm

That style heatsink with the fan positioned as shown is an excellent design for efficient cooling. Much better than some of the heatsink orientations without fans that I have seen.

Brew on

 

[cantrell00]

Glad to hear it's working, I did the same thing and tried to verify everything before firing it up, that's where I found the bit about needing a special device to test ssr's (which I don't have, nor do I know exactly what it is), so then I also just decided just to fire it up!! Worked like a charm...

Are you using 40a or 25a ssr's? Just to piggy back on what the others are saying, the 40a ones generate less heat under the same load, and therefore would be less likely to fail...

25 but after reading this - going to swap it out for a 40.

My entire enclosure is aluminum so I think I have plenty of heat dissipation already.

 

[Wacki]

25 but after reading this - going to swap it out for a 40.



My entire enclosure is aluminum so I think I have plenty of heat dissipation already.

Yea, the difference in price was just a couple bucks I think... Not that I've had any fail, but worth it on my opinion. I got mine from ebrewsupply....

 

[augiedoggy]

Im using both a 40a and two 25a ones... I have no noticeable difference in heat as far as touching the heatsinks myself...
The jury is still out on whether the 40a version is really any different as all then the 25a since these are knockoffs and the components inside are not the same design as a real fotek ssr.... there is another recent thread about it.

 

[Brumateur]

Indeed 40A generate less heat on the same current that 25A version, but difference is not very significant.
According to datasheet maximum powwer dissipation at 22Amp (5500 watt element connected) for 40A version is around 22 Watt and for 25A version is around 25 Watt

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

also not all ssr's are created equal, I went through 6 or 7 till I found one that works correctly so use a good one from auberins before a cheap one from ebay

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=30

 

[Brumateur]

BTW.so called "Auber" SSR is just a relabeled Mager SSR (reputable Chinese brand) . And you can by the same SSR twice cheaper.
For example http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Solid-S...80V-25A-3-32VDC-D4825-NEW-DC-AC-/331064002285

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I'm not sure what brand this is and seems to be out of stock but looks similar, I ended up using this one

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008MPJVYQ/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

I had used the heat sinks on my large control panel but when I built this small one used this again and never failed