Spunding valve: pressure relief valve not accurate? Slow leak too

[Dustin_J]

Well, I was nowhere near 90 degrees - something seems amiss. I'll check with water in a few days. FWIW, mine were pre-assembled just like fun4stuff's - I think something is a bit fishy.

Just a thought, I wonder if the tubing used is slightly too small/narrow? I don't know much about the different sizes available, but if whoever assembled them used something that wasn't sized right, that might explain both of our issues.

I've been strongly considering converting my two serving systems/kegerators to the DuoTight fittings/hoses due to the potential benefits regarding oxygen permeability - maybe now is the time (with the correct tubing). That'd provide some spare/slack tubing to check these out.

 

[Robert65]

That's how I got started! I had heard lots of recommendations of the Blow Tie, and was frustrated with the leaky conventional valves I'd built, but hadn't acted. Then I redid my keezer (gas and beer) with all EVA barrier and Duotight for low oxygen purposes, which meant buying 39' of tubing. Now I had most of that left. So build a spunding valve, I figure. Then all my gear for pulling samples and transferring to kegs (jumpers, spare CO2 bottle, etc.,) and eventually a couple more spunding valves... kinda went crazy finding things to do with all the tubing. But I'm so happy I did. There's nothing that can top this stuff.

 

[Robert65]

the one i got was also put together with really short Eva tubing- like connections.

This could be the problem. One of the retailers sells 1 1/4 inch pieces as connectors. But cutting my own, I've found you need a good 1 1/2 or, better, 1 3/4 inch piece or it won't push all the way into each fitting before you pull back to lock it in. This could result in the tubing not being fully retained inside the o-rings. Perhaps just getting some EVA barrier tubing and cutting your own connectors could be the answer. If you don't want 39 feet, I believe Bobby at Brew Hardware is now buying rolls and selling 5 or 6 foot lengths.

 

[Yesfan]

This could be the problem. One of the retailers sells 1 1/4 inch pieces as connectors. But cutting my own, I've found you need a good 1 1/2 or, better, 1 3/4 inch piece or it won't push all the way into each fitting before you pull back to lock it in. This could result in the tubing not being fully retained inside the o-rings. Perhaps just getting some EVA barrier tubing and cutting your own connectors could be the answer. If you don't want 39 feet, I believe Bobby at Brew Hardware is now buying rolls and selling 5 or 6 foot lengths.

I feel the same way about my gas/beer lines. Switching over has been a real eye opener for me. I love not having to clear the lines of oxidized beer like I did before when pulling a pint.

I think Bobby sells the line in 5.5ft increments.

 

[fun4stuff]

This could be the problem. One of the retailers sells 1 1/4 inch pieces as connectors. But cutting my own, I've found you need a good 1 1/2 or, better, 1 3/4 inch piece or it won't push all the way into each fitting before you pull back to lock it in. This could result in the tubing not being fully retained inside the o-rings. Perhaps just getting some EVA barrier tubing and cutting your own connectors could be the answer. If you don't want 39 feet, I believe Bobby at Brew Hardware is now buying rolls and selling 5 or 6 foot lengths.

I had an autocorrect error from above. I meant to say that i replaced the Eva tubing in the spunding valve with longer lengths from what i had left over from doing my lines, but it still leaked. I made sure to push them all the way in- the lengths that were used on mine were way too short. I definitely should have just made my own!

i used the 3/16” tubing though. Is this the correct diameter? I know they also make 5/16”. Maybe that’s the problem?

As a side note- i do really like the tubing. I never knew there was tubing that would prevent the beer in the lines from going bad. Next up i have to replace my gas lines with it.

 

[Robert65]

They give the measurements in mm, but the OD is what matters. It should be 8mm OD, which is just about 5/16. Inside diameter varies, there are at least 4mm (~5/32) and 5mm (~3/16) sizes with the 8mm OD. Confused yet? They also have some sizes with 9mm outside diameter. I think I got all that right.

 

[fun4stuff]

They give the measurements in mm, but the OD is what matters. It should be 8mm OD, which is just about 5/16. Inside diameter varies, there are at least 4mm (~5/32) and 5mm (~3/16) sizes with the 8mm OD. Confused yet? They also have some sizes with 9mm outside diameter. I think I got all that right.

so should use this one for the spunding valve?
https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/evabarriertubing4mm55.htm

 

[Robert65]

That's the one, 4mm ID x 8mm OD. But isn't that what you already have? I mean, same OD? The ID doesn't affect how it fits in the fittings.

 

[fun4stuff]

That's the one, 4mm ID x 8mm OD. But isn't that what you already have? I mean, same OD? The ID doesn't affect how it fits in the fittings.

Yes, that’s the same one. It still leaked. So must have been another part that was causing the leak.

 

[fun4stuff]

I got my second spunding valve from lion brewing. It was again put together backwards with tubing that was too short (despite mentioning in my initial message to the seller about these issues). I also asked them to check and make sure it didn’t leak; they obviously didn’t check given it was put together backwards and QD was not tightened.

Well, this one leaks too. Must be a bad batch and that’s why they are so cheap. I’ll be returning it and doing what i should have done in the first place- make my own.

 

[Robert65]

I bought something from that Lion Brewing on Ebay. Once. Nuff said?

 

[Yesfan]

I got mine from More Beer. It was $10 more than Lion's. Here's a pic for reference. SHould the arrow point away from the tee assembly?



I connected mine to a spare gas line via a disconnect jumper. With the valve set at 10 and my co2 regulator set at 10, I could hear a faint hiss. Turning up the valve a couple of psi seemed to stop the leak and it would hold pressure at 10psi. I'm going to do the water test mentioned too and maybe even try my other DIY valves

 

[fun4stuff]

I got mine from More Beer. It was $10 more than Lion's. Here's a pic for reference. SHould the arrow point away from the tee assembly?

View attachment 667871

I connected mine to a spare gas line via a disconnect jumper. With the valve set at 10 and my co2 regulator set at 10, I could hear a faint hiss. Turning up the valve a couple of psi seemed to stop the leak and it would hold pressure at 10psi. I'm going to do the water test mentioned too and maybe even try my other DIY valves

The arrow should point away (the direction gas should flow, out the valve).

What happens if you pressurize the valve then disconnect it from the gas? Does the gauge move? My gauge slowly decreases... like when from 12 to 9 over night.

 

[Yesfan]

The arrow should point away (the direction gas should flow, out the valve).

What happens if you pressurize the valve then disconnect it from the gas? Does the gauge move? My gauge slowly decreases... like when from 12 to 9 over night.

Looks look mine is correct then.


It dropped about a lb when I went to disconnecting it. I think the leaking's more due to trying to disconnect it from the jumper. The jumper I used is mainly for the black disconnects, so the gray ones fit a bit tighter.

I tried one of my DIY ones too for comparison. It's been about 20 minutes, but the Kegland model hasn't had any changes. The DIY, on the other hand, I can see the needle on the gauge slowly make its way to zero.

I'm going to get a couple of those 1/4" Duofit adapters Robert65 linked and hopefully fix that problem.

 

[fun4stuff]

So i owe an apology to lion brewing. After discussing with them my process of testing the spunding valve, i found out i was in the wrong.

——


So i had been testing my spunding valves by hooking them up to a pressurized keg to pressurize them and then disconnecting them to see how long they’d hold that pressure.

Apparently the QDs are not made to hold pressure in going backwards. I did test this by leaving the spunding valve on a lightly pressurized keg for a couple days. Sure enough it help pressure.

so FYI to anyone else comes across this post!

 

[Bobby_M]

I don't know what you mean by the QD not holding pressure. Of course they are made to hold pressure when not attached to a keg.

 

[Vale71]

Apparently the QDs are not made to hold pressure in going backwards.

Of course they are made to hold pressure going backwards. That's the whole idea of a self-sealing disconnect. If this weren't the case then you'd need a shutoff valve in front of every disconnect in order to be able to disconnect them without wasting CO2. The guys you talked to were obviously trying to blame the issue on somebody else's product which is quite dishonest of them IMHO.

 

[fun4stuff]

I had two different types of spunding valves with multiple QDs with the same type of slow leak.so this has to be something I’m doing.

They don’t lose pressure when left attached to the keg.

So what’s going on? Why is there a slow leak when not attached?

if you think about it, the center pin for the ball lock gas QD never has to hold pressure. I may not be using the correct terminology. But I’m talk about the pin/washer/spring apparatus inside the QD. When that’s connected to a keg, it’s depressed so not needed to stop the flow of gas or hold pressure in. This is the point of weakness for holding pressure when disconnecting the spunding valve.

 

[Vale71]

It's called quick disconnect for a reason, namely that it can be simply pulled off without the need to shut off the CO2 supply every time.
The reason it appears not to leak when connected to a keg is that a keg holds 1000X more gas than just the QD/spunding valve assembly. If it takes hours for the detached apparatus to lose pressure it'll take days for the keg to vent all its CO2, possibly weeks if you account for the beer degassing until it becomes completely flat.

 

[fun4stuff]

It's called quick disconnect for a reason, namely that it can be simply pulled off without the need to shut off the CO2 supply every time.
The reason it appears not to leak when connected to a keg is that a keg holds 1000X more gas than just the QD/spunding valve assembly. If it takes hours for the detached apparatus to lose pressure it'll take days for the keg to vent all its CO2, possibly weeks if you account for the beer degassing until it becomes completely flat.

very good point. It’s why i only presurized keg to 2-3 psi and then 12psi to test but i guess still could be a very slow leak. I still suspect is the QD is where the leak is. I have heard of people having issues with the swivel but kind (vs the ones with barb built on), which is the kind i have. Regardless, if it’s holding pressure steady for a few days, then that’s good enough for me as I’m not going to be spunding very long.

 

[Dustin_J]

FWIW, both of the two I got from Lion Brewing had small leaks when testing by pressurizing/removing (both came with CMB disconnects, BTW). I just got a roll of EVA barrier tubing, so I took Robert's suggesting and re-fitted them with longer pieces of line connecting everything. One held pressure completely/perfectly over night at ~15psi. The other seems to be leaking 4-5 PSI/day. I have it in some water now covering everything but the face/body of the pressure gauge, but the leak seems to be too slow to throw noticeable bubbles.

 

[fun4stuff]

FWIW, both of the two I got from Lion Brewing had small leaks when testing by pressurizing/removing (both came with CMB disconnects, BTW). I just got a roll of EVA barrier tubing, so I took Robert's suggesting and re-fitted them with longer pieces of line connecting everything. One held pressure completely/perfectly over night at ~15psi. The other seems to be leaking 4-5 PSI/day. I have it in some water now covering everything but the face/body of the pressure gauge, but the leak seems to be too slow to throw noticeable bubbles.

so one of them holds pressure when not connected to a keg? I replaced the tubing on mine with longer segments as well. I think i have a QD allaying around somewhere that has a barb fitting (not swivel nut). I’ll try attaching that.

 

[Dustin_J]

so one of them holds pressure when not connected to a keg? I replaced the tubing on mine with longer segments as well. I think i have a QD allaying around somewhere that has a barb fitting (not swivel nut). I’ll try attaching that.

Yep, one seems to hold just fine when not connected. The other one is still sitting in water and has lost ~2-3 psi since this morning. I think I'm getting small bubbles/leaks on 2 sides of the tee fitting - it's really hard to tell for sure.

 

[fun4stuff]

Yep, one seems to hold just fine when not connected. The other one is still sitting in water and has lost ~2-3 psi since this morning. I think I'm getting small bubbles/leaks on 2 sides of the tee fitting - it's really hard to tell for sure.

Yeah inevitably you get some air clinging to everything when you submerge it.

one thing I’ve been meaning to do is try and clean out the diaphragm/valve in the red part. The valve unscrews and comes apart for cleaning. Maybe some dust or other manufacturer crap on it?

 

[AntDoctor]

Quick question: CAN I submerge a EVA duotight + blowtie + pressure gauge spunding valve underwater? It would obviously pinpoint MY leak, but I worry it will harm the pressure gauge or the blowtie...