Speakers and stereo equipment

[HausBrauerei_Harvey]

Theres probably a thousand speakers you can get for under a $100. I got these for my zone 2 kitchen based on the endless reviews.They Sound pretty good. Theres a youtube video review on them. Somewhere and I cant remember where,Maybe the audiofile thread I mentioned, someone posted a link for a wholesale speaker company, seemed to have deep discounts..might be worth looking for..https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00E7H8GG2/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

these do look nice, thanks for the recommendation!

 

[arturo7]

It was all VERY "scientifical".

Sencore RTA, Sencore DAG, array of multiplexed microphones set equidistance from the speaker fronts, white noise, pink noise, individual frequencies, and an acoustically dead room. Passed the signal through a Yamaha RX-Z9. And compared results of individual tests on each type of speaker.

The DAG has the ability to specify individual frequencies. And the RTA would display if any additional frequencies were being produced by the loudspeaker thus giving a graphical display of harmonic distortion. Granted, some of the displayed distortion is caused by the receiver itself.

Great. Now we've all got test gear envy.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

I'm no expert, but the new smaller Bluetooth speakers, (even Bose has one for around $100 on sale) are great for the digital age. I'm old enough to have had a rack system or two, but the big speaker cabinets do not alwAys equal better sound.

 

[wiggybrewer]

Still love my 28 yr.old Klipsch Chorus.

 

[applescrap]

I'm no expert, but the new smaller Bluetooth speakers, (even Bose has one for around $100 on sale) are great for the digital age. I'm old enough to have had a rack system or two, but the big speaker cabinets do not alwAys equal better sound.

Are you talking about traveling out and about? I like the little beats pill. Small and I could get a block party started when camping.

 

[passedpawn]

I've got equipment, but sadly maple floors, high ceilings, and lots of windows means the acoustics of my rooms suck bad. I've tried and tried with reference sources and equalizers and there is no solution except putting a good set of cans on my head.

 

[OH-]

@OH- yes, I have worked with Freeman AV numerous times, though they have all been national multi million dollar shows.
I'm not sure what sort of karaoke system you are thinking of, but I personally haven't seen a Freeman delivery smaller than an 18 wheeler. That being said they may do small in town rentals near their main base of operations, Orlando, Dallas, I think they have a DC and a Vegas warehouse as well.

Thank you Tony, I will discuss this info with them. Thank you for your support.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Great. Now we've all got test gear envy.

Don't. Equipment was bought for commercial use. I was also a rep for RPG Acoustics. Not enough money in my area to make a good run out of HT acoustics.

By time I gave up trying the equipment was outdated and I couldn't sell it for much.

Rattle testing was always fun tho'.

I've got equipment, but sadly maple floors, high ceilings, and lots of windows means the acoustics of my rooms suck bad. I've tried and tried with reference sources and equalizers and there is no solution except putting a good set of cans on my head.

Drapes, bookshelves in corners, big fluffy sofas, and thick pile rugs can do wonders.

 

[applescrap]

^^good tips, what about placement also? I have a big sliding glass door in my family room and I am starting to wonder if the speaker's sound best halfway in the room. Right now I have them moved pretty far out. I hear you passedPawn, sounds like you have a real difficult acoustic situation there.

 

[applescrap]

Just lost out on Matrix 805s yesterday. I think these are my next purchase or maybe the 804. Seems I keep getting deals that are too good to pass up. So if that happens I'm okay with an in-between

 

[passedpawn]

^^good tips, what about placement also? I have a big sliding glass door in my family room and I am starting to wonder if the speaker's sound best halfway in the room. Right now I have them moved pretty far out. I hear you passedPawn, sounds like you have a real difficult acoustic situation there.

Impossible actually. 4 glass french doors, larged arched windows, granite bar... I've even got a large fish tank in that room. Impossible!

When I go into the listening rooms at the high end audio places I'm so enraptured. My kids are all out of the house, and I'd love to make one of those rooms (3 spare bedrooms!) a listening room or home theater, but of course my wife needs to maintain the museums. Ugh.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

^^good tips, what about placement also? I have a big sliding glass door in my family room and I am starting to wonder if the speaker's sound best halfway in the room. Right now I have them moved pretty far out. I hear you passedPawn, sounds like you have a real difficult acoustic situation there.

Google the inter-webs about mapping a rooms peaks and nulls by frequency. Or download a free/demo software that can do the same. Corners and mid-length of walls are prime locations for peaks of most any mid-range to low-end frequency. Same applies to floors and ceilings. You have to think of the room as a cube. If you need additional emphasis on low end frequencies, placing the speaker in or near the peak will further energize said peak but, too much and it becomes muddy. Placing a speaker in a rooms natural null can help to smooth out an overly live room.

Impossible actually.

Non-sense. Difficult, yes. Not impossible. Aesthetics are the biggest challenge.

One of my contracts was to mellow out a in-home dance studio. Oak floors, high cathedral ceiling, mirrored or glass walls. The room was very live. Lows were muddy, and high were piercing. The amount of reverberation in the room made it sound like an echo chamber.

I built soffit style bass traps at a measured peaks using lay-in ceiling tiles and perforated hardboard. Made some cloud panels using the same. the room was far from perfect after I was done, but it was a far cry from the muddled mush of tinny highs and overly reverberate lows. To the point you could clearly make out each note and every lyric.

That job earned me $12k.

 

[passedpawn]

Google the inter-webs about mapping a rooms peaks and nulls by frequency. Or download a free/demo software that can do the same. Corners and mid-length of walls are prime locations for peaks of most any mid-range to low-end frequency. Same applies to floors and ceilings. You have to think of the room as a cube. If you need additional emphasis on low end frequencies, placing the speaker in or near the peak will further energize said peak but, too much and it becomes muddy. Placing a speaker in a rooms natural null can help to smooth out an overly live room.



Non-sense. Difficult, yes. Not impossible. Aesthetics are the biggest challenge.

One of my contracts was to mellow out a in-home dance studio. Oak floors, high cathedral ceiling, mirrored or glass walls. The room was very live. Lows were muddy, and high were piercing. The amount of reverberation in the room made it sound like an echo chamber.

I built soffit style bass traps at a measured peaks using lay-in ceiling tiles and perforated hardboard. Made some cloud panels using the same. the room was far from perfect after I was done, but it was a far cry from the muddled mush of tinny highs and overly reverberate lows. To the point you could clearly make out each note and every lyric.

That job earned me $12k.

Well OK, maybe if I made big changes to the room. I've got much more urgent home upgrades before I do that one

I've got a 7-channel system in there. The receiver I use now came with a microphone that you place in your listening position and it automatically equalizes the audio, but I'm guessing it's just leveling the speaker volumes and not actually affecting the frequencies like a real equalizer, but not sure.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Well OK, maybe if I made big changes to the room. I've got much more urgent home upgrades before I do that one

Targeted changes do not have to be big changes. Unless the room is empty and responds like a tin can, or so full it is acoustically dead, chances are a few targeted changes can have a big impact on room response. For example, wooden slat blinds slightly angled in front of a french or sliding glass door system can make a big difference between a localized reflection of sound, or a moderately diffused series of reflections.

The cost of the job I mentioned before was more about the labor to analyse and map the room and custom build the traps and diffusers. The materials were basic.

I've got a 7-channel system in there. The receiver I use now came with a microphone that you place in your listening position and it automatically equalizes the audio, but I'm guessing it's just leveling the speaker volumes and not actually affecting the frequencies like a real equalizer, but not sure.

What brand receiver?

I have a Yamaha with the same feature. They call it YPAO (Yamaha Parametric Acoustic Optimiser).

It adjusts SPL, and delay as well as checks polarity and freq range of the channel. With the parametric eq feature of the receiver on, it will attempt to flatten out the response too.

 

[dstockwell]

Check out Audiogon for used equipment.

 

[passedpawn]

Targeted changes do not have to be big changes. Unless the room is empty and responds like a tin can, or so full it is acoustically dead, chances are a few targeted changes can have a big impact on room response. For example, wooden slat blinds slightly angled in front of a french or sliding glass door system can make a big difference between a localized reflection of sound, or a moderately diffused series of reflections.



What brand receiver?

I have a Yamaha with the same feature. They call it YPAO (Yamaha Parametric Acoustic Optimiser).

It adjusts SPL, and delay as well as checks polarity and freq range of the channel. With the parametric eq feature of the receiver on, it will attempt to flatten out the response too.

That's it. Yamaha RX-V675. I think the problem is the room is just too big for a listening room. Ceiling is high and sloped. And, one end of the room is open to a large kitchen.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

That's it. Yamaha RX-V675. I think the problem is the room is just too big for a listening room. Ceiling is high and sloped. And, one end of the room is open to a large kitchen.

It will adjust EQ. But, obviously, only for a single listening point.

Even a small bedroom can be a challenge. When any particular room surface length equals half that of a given wavelength it creates standing waves. Or if the surface length is equally divisible by the wavelength. When the soundwave bounces off the wall, it doubles back on itself to the point that the original sound combined with reflections become monolithic and garbled. and wreaks havoc on the brains ability to localize sounds.

For example at a 40hz frequency the resultant wavelength is about 28 feet long from peak to peak. If you've a bedroom wall that is 14 feet long by 14 feet wide by 14 feet tall, the resulting standing wave will put the peak at 12 feet, and nulls in the corners. In the middle point of the room the energy overlap will cause the sound to be uncomfortably loud (at reference levels) while at the corners of the room it'll be starkly dull and quiet in comparison. If you've never had the opportunity to hear the difference for yourself, it can be quite ear opening.

 

[passedpawn]

It will adjust EQ. But, obviously, only for a single listening point.

Even a small bedroom can be a challenge. When any particular room surface length equals half that of a given wavelength it creates standing waves. Or if the surface length is equally divisible by the wavelength. When the soundwave bounces off the wall, it doubles back on itself to the point that the original sound combined with reflections become monolithic and garbled. and wreaks havoc on the brains ability to localize sounds.

For example at a 40hz frequency the resultant wavelength is about 28 feet long from peak to peak. If you've a bedroom wall that is 14 feet long by 14 feet wide by 14 feet tall, the resulting standing wave will put the peak at 12 feet, and nulls in the corners. In the middle point of the room the energy overlap will cause the sound to be uncomfortably loud (at reference levels) while at the corners of the room it'll be starkly dull and quiet in comparison. If you've never had the opportunity to hear the difference for yourself, it can be quite ear opening.

Makes sense. Room is 30W x 20 deep. At one time, the real problem was ambient noise in there, mostly from the fish tank (reef). It has an overflow that went to a large sump under it where I had pumps and filtration stuff. I removed all of that and now have the flow piped through the house outside wall to a shed outside! Almost all that noise went away (confirmed with my SPL meter). That helped a lot.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

That's it. Yamaha RX-V675. I think the problem is the room is just too big for a listening room. Ceiling is high and sloped. And, one end of the room is open to a large kitchen.

Cathedral style ceiling, or just a slope? Reflective clouds can help attain some symmetry for upper to higher frequency ranges. these do not have to be panels. Hanging art could provide enough surface area to balance out some of the reflected sound.

If the room is otherwise enclosed on the remaining three sides, and the wall materials aren't drastically dissimilar, speaker placement can help a lot. Pulling speakers away from the walls can help with clarity too by reducing early reflection boundary interference off the walls nearest the speakers (even behind the speakers).

If the walls are drastically dissimilar, the first thing to do is develop some acoustic symmetry. Lots of glass on one side, drywall on the opposite side? Large framed art work placed to mimic the glass will help to balance the room out. Or, heavy drapes in front of the windows will zap a fair amount of energy out of the reflected sounds.

Small room acoustics is first about tricking the ear to hear symmetry so that reflected sounds aren't distracting and causing listener fatigue. Second about attenuating or diffusing the modal response of the room. And lastly about emphasizing the primary impulses at varied frequencies for a relatively "flat" response (aka equalization). The first two have more to do with the room itself, while the latter should be more about the performance of the equipment provided the first two are addressed respectfully.

 

[pointcity-homebrew]

I was big into home audio fresh out of college. I worked at a repair shop.

I installed Bose cut in ceiling speakers when we first bought our house, repaired a Harmon Kardon receiver that someone did not want repaired. Paired it all with a Polk audio active sub.

Is it top of the line, no, but will blow you out of the house, ask my wife.

 

[passedpawn]

I have all Polk (7.1). The rears are cut into the ceiling above/behind the common listening position. Probably not ideal, but works great for the room decor.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Sorry, I'll stop now.

Room acoustics was/is a passion of mine. I always loved the challenge of "thinking outside of the box" on how to address a room for maximum affect with minimal impact. Physics with an acoustics discipline was my major/minor but I did not graduate. HT enthusiasts often can't/won't justify the expense for the room study. Civic centers aren't exactly a hot commodity in a specified area, and cinemas are cookie cutter designs with more emphasis on number of seats per screen rather than room acoustics. Not too many new recording studios being built these days either. Lest you are a staff engineer for LifeChurch.TV construction division.

That leaves the auto/airline industry. The focus there is more about noise cancellation and vibration decoupling. Fascinating to read about but not really my bag. Lastly would be product industry. Designing/testing baffles/diffusers for the retail market. I opted to pass on that too.

 

[passedpawn]

Sorry, I'll stop now.

Don't stop

[edit] unless you were gonna start touting oxygen-free copper wire

 

[betarhoalphadelta]

Anyone here have opinions on Magnepan? http://www.magnepan.com/

My roommate after college bought a pair of their entry-level MMG speakers and I was pretty well blown away. Granted, they were the entry-level speakers which don't do bass well, but apparently they have a "super MMG" now that has improved that. They also didn't do the "overly hot" pop recordings well, but that's because they were accurately representing recordings that were mastered up with too much loudness.

But I found that when playing something like a live recording, or acoustic music, it was like being in the room with the artist. Some of the best sound I've ever heard out of a speaker.

It makes me wonder whether at some point I'd want to order the super MMG...

(And yes, I realize this might just be confirmation bias after reading their marketing materials lol...)

 

[DoctorMemory]

I scored an old pair of JBL 4311's for free in college. I have done some minor repairs and re-screened them and they sound pretty awesome to me!

I paid $400 for my Altec Lansing Santiagos in college. Good thing I had an apartment, because they were too big to fit in a dorm room. Unfortunately, they're really too big to fit in my current house, too, so they have to live in the basement. Nowadays I rock a much more modestly-sized pair of Celestion 300s.

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

Anyone here have opinions on Magnepan? http://www.magnepan.com/

My roommate after college bought a pair of their entry-level MMG speakers and I was pretty well blown away. Granted, they were the entry-level speakers which don't do bass well, but apparently they have a "super MMG" now that has improved that. They also didn't do the "overly hot" pop recordings well, but that's because they were accurately representing recordings that were mastered up with too much loudness.

But I found that when playing something like a live recording, or acoustic music, it was like being in the room with the artist. Some of the best sound I've ever heard out of a speaker.

It makes me wonder whether at some point I'd want to order the super MMG...

(And yes, I realize this might just be confirmation bias after reading their marketing materials lol...)

Not familiar with Magnepan, but there was a time in my life I wanted a pair of Martin Longan electrostatic BAD!

 

[passedpawn]

I've always just looked for a flat frequency response graph across the audible spectrum. No idea if those are still published - been a long time since I bought speakers.

 

[applescrap]

Anyone here have opinions on Magnepan? http://www.magnepan.com/

My roommate after college bought a pair of their entry-level MMG speakers and I was pretty well blown away. Granted, they were the entry-level speakers which don't do bass well, but apparently they have a "super MMG" now that has improved that. They also didn't do the "overly hot" pop recordings well, but that's because they were accurately representing recordings that were mastered up with too much loudness.

But I found that when playing something like a live recording, or acoustic music, it was like being in the room with the artist. Some of the best sound I've ever heard out of a speaker.

It makes me wonder whether at some point I'd want to order the super MMG...

(And yes, I realize this might just be confirmation bias after reading their marketing materials lol...)

I think steve guttenberg from cnet uses magnepan 2.1s in a 2.0 system. I have no knowledge or personal experience but i know people like them.

 

[Parabolic]

PMC - IB2s - with 6x Hypex Ncore 400´s - biamped/dsp crossovers / custom multichannel dac.

...last rig i´ll ever buy....

.... now I can focus on drinking

 

[applescrap]

Solid @parabolic. Right now i am running 5 rigs. Someday I hope to dial in like that on one good rig.
Upgraded my family room on the cheap. As people are dumping centers i picked up two to use as bookshelves. A little untraditional no doubt but nice speakers none the less.

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