Sour time!

[Dadux]

Hey there!
So im somewhat new to beer brewing and i still have many many things i want to try so im not in a hurry but lately i tried a few sour beers that really hitted a spot, and as it usually happens now i want to know how to make smething similar. Making a stout or an IPA seems rather straightforward but sours seem to be a whole new world.

I have been mostly looking on kettle souring ecause i dont want to take more than a couple months in making this. The process does not look too complicated but i still have a bunch of questions.

- Is there a recommended strain for this? Even so im not a big fan of liquid yeast (expensive, low storage time...) but i dont mind running a culture from whatever, or even isolating some wild strains. I dont want anything that comes from yoghurt but i dont know if other things work decently. Obviously lacto is my first choice but i dunno if pedio works for this too. Buying liquid yeast is doable so if this is the best choice just say so

-How are you supposed to know when to pasteurize/pitch yeast? I was thinking to do a side-fermentation of 1-2 liters (final volume of the beer 14l) of wort and let the lactobacillus have its way. When the sugars run out, brew the rest of the wort and mix. I dont know if this would work or anyone has a clue...

-I've seen a lot of things about not adding IBUs at the start but are you supposed to do it after souring? or this does not yield good results? better to skip the whole hops things or dry hop later? I was thinking on fermenting with M15 yeast (its supposed to leave some maltiness and produce dark fruit esters) and leave it totally/relativly hop-less

-Recommended final ABV? i was thinking 4.5% and carbonation levels 2.5-2.8.

hope you guys can point me in the right direction! Thanks in advance

 

[microbusbrewery]

- Is there a recommended strain for this? Even so im not a big fan of liquid yeast (expensive, low storage time...) but i dont mind running a culture from whatever, or even isolating some wild strains. I dont want anything that comes from yoghurt but i dont know if other things work decently. Obviously lacto is my first choice but i dunno if pedio works for this too. Buying liquid yeast is doable so if this is the best choice just say so

First I'd recommend reading Michael Tonsmeire's book, American Sour Beers (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1...as2&tag=themadferm-20&linkId=7MFVKA4HRLQNC6WV). Milk the Funk is also a fantastic resource (http://www.milkthefunk.com/wiki/Main_Page). I'd recommend a homofermentative strain so that it's primarily producing lactic acid (rather than lactic acid + ethanol and sometimes acetic acid). Pedio is usually slower and can produce diacetyl, so it's not typically used for kettle sours. I use GoodBelly SuperShots (http://goodbelly.com/super-shot/) but this strain (lactobacillus plantarum) is capable of both homo and hetero fermentation.

-How are you supposed to know when to pasteurize/pitch yeast? I was thinking to do a side-fermentation of 1-2 liters (final volume of the beer 14l) of wort and let the lactobacillus have its way. When the sugars run out, brew the rest of the wort and mix. I dont know if this would work or anyone has a clue...

A pH meter is your best choice. I like to shoot for 3.4 or lower. Lacto will usually work until the pH reaches a certain level and then they'll stop souring, leaving a lot of residual sugars. If you use a hetero strain, it's possible it'll keep fermenting but I've read this results in a less complex beer than one fermented with LAB plus yeast.

-I've seen a lot of things about not adding IBUs at the start but are you supposed to do it after souring? or this does not yield good results? better to skip the whole hops things or dry hop later? I was thinking on fermenting with M15 yeast (its supposed to leave some maltiness and produce dark fruit esters) and leave it totally/relativly hop-less

Lactobacillus are very sensitive to hops. Even late addition hops like whirlpool hops that don't really add IBUs can cause problems for them. Skip hops alltogether pre-boil. You can add them after souring. I'd still keep the IBUs low as bitterness and sourness tend to clash. However, a big charge of citrusy dry hops can be really awesome in a sour beer.

-Recommended final ABV? i was thinking 4.5% and carbonation levels 2.5-2.8.

Most sours tend to be between 4-8%. Traditional souring post-boil can be challenging if the ABV gets too high, so that's one reason that you don't see many 12% sours. 4.5% is a good plan.

 

[cactusgarrett]

Also, set up shop in the Lambic & Wild subforum. You'll get more traffic and info in there.