Soldering Stainless steel

[Dgonza9]

I redid the joints. Filled the keg with water and left it overnight. Appears to be leak free.

Thanks for the advice. Judicious use of flux, even when solder was flowing seemed to help.

Gonna make a nice dark lager this weekend.

 

[Brew Runner]

The viscosity of water changes a bit more than 600% between boiling and freezing, so I can see why it would weep during use and not at room temperature. At operating temperature, all the system components have also expanded, so possible "pinhole" leaks can open enough to be seen.

 

[Dgonza9]

I guess I used a slightly too short close nipple on my sight glass assembly. I noticed a leak in the threads and the fitting was just about snug with the silver soldered locknut. I just wanted to see if I could crank it down a touch more.

Well, after applying a good amount of force with a wrench, the locknut popped off!

I guess the silver solder doesn't hold up as well to torsional stress. I had quite a lot of leverage as I was turning a fitting with a sizable wrench. But still, me no likey.

Wound up making that one weldless. I just have the locknuts for the heating elements silver soldered now.

Any comments on this?

 

[StainlessBrewing]

What size hole did you drill? Maybe you can remove the lock nuts and add a half or full coupling?

 

[Dgonza9]

What size hole did you drill? Maybe you can remove the lock nuts and add a half or full coupling?

I don't think it's really an issue, although I do have to tighten down the elements, they have a gasket so they're not getting the kind of torque I gave the sight glass locknut.

But it doesn't make me happy.

How would a coupling be any different, really?

 

[wilserbrewer]

Well, after applying a good amount of force with a wrench, the locknut popped off!

I guess the silver solder doesn't hold up as well to torsional stress. I had quite a lot of leverage as I was turning a fitting with a sizable wrench. But still, me no likey.

Any comments on this?

While not as strong as a weld, if a fitting is used w/ a decent shoulder so the solder has ample surface area to bond...a properly soldered coupling should be very strong IMO.

My guess is that your fitting was not seated w/ amlpe bonding area, or the solder did not bond properly for some reason? Fly in ointment somewhere in the process.

Was the close nipple somehow bottoming out, and therefore pushing the lock nut off the vessel. I really like the look of the spuds Bobby M sells with a large surface area available to solder...that ain't commin off!

If you post some good photos of the failed joint, I am sure someone here can do some forensics.

 

[StainlessBrewing]

I don't think it's really an issue, although I do have to tighten down the elements, they have a gasket so they're not getting the kind of torque I gave the sight glass locknut.

But it doesn't make me happy.

How would a coupling be any different, really?

The only difference is that most lock nuts are straight thread and the coupling would be tapered. If you're not getting any leaks even though the fitting is bottoming out I guess there really is no difference.

 

[Huaco]

I torqued off one of my sight glass couplers just the other night. Ticked me off. I soldered it just like in the youtube video. Step-by-Step. I was turning it with a LARGE adjustable wrench. I just did not remember I was torquing against a soldered joint. I had 1" automotive/structural bolt in mind. After I took it out, cleaned it up and re-soldered it, I counter-torqued the fitting inside the keggle with some channel locks. No problem... got it nice and tight this time and did not break the joint again! haha!

 

[Dgonza9]

I torqued off one of my sight glass couplers just the other night. Ticked me off. I soldered it just like in the youtube video. Step-by-Step. I was turning it with a LARGE adjustable wrench. I just did not remember I was torquing against a soldered joint. I had 1" automotive/structural bolt in mind. After I took it out, cleaned it up and re-soldered it, I counter-torqued the fitting inside the keggle with some channel locks. No problem... got it nice and tight this time and did not break the joint again! haha!

I'm glad to hear that it wasn't just me. I don't have any leaks, but torquing that joint apart made me concerned. Sounds like it happens if you don't take precautions when torquing a soldered joint.

Well, no leaks right now. Gonna brew later this week.

 

[brewhokie]

Would this solder work as long as you use the proper harris liquid flux?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062725

 

[stlbeer]

Would this solder work as long as you use the proper harris liquid flux?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062725

I would say no because this is a very small diameter solder. Maybe you could give it a try for $6.

 

[brewhokie]

One other question I've seen people mention using lead free plumbing solder, is that safe for food contact applications like this? Is there any benefit to the more expensive silver solder?

 

[stlbeer]

Lead free solder is ok for food contact - it's used for plumbing, however, that type doesn't work well with stainless steel. Silver solder - that's the one you need.

 

[P-J]

Would this solder work as long as you use the proper harris liquid flux?

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062725

Do NOT use this solder at all. Just look at the data sheet for it.

1 x Spool, 1.0oz., Diameter 0.015", Rosin Core Silver-Bearing (62%-tin, 36%-lead, 2%-silver) Solder

That is some bad stuff.

Go to HomeDepot and buy this kit. It's the real thing.
Stay-Brite Kit with Flux

 

[brewhokie]

Thanks PJ, your always looking out for everyone. Does anyone have experience with this solder, looks like it might be a better substitute:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25e...=10053&langId=-1&keyword=solder&storeId=10051

I'm trying to find someplace local I can buy the right silver solder, because I already have a 4 oz bottle of Harris stay clean liquid flux.

 

[wyzazz]

Lead free solder is ok for food contact - it's used for plumbing, however, that type doesn't work well with stainless steel. Silver solder - that's the one you need.

I'd like to chime in on this, I used regular lead-free plumbing solder on my fittings and it worked just fine with the Stay Clean Flux. I pulled my couplers through and roughed everything up with sandpaper really well and made sure the solder wicked through the joints.

The advantage (as I see it) to the silver solder is that it's better at filling gaps, melts at higher temps than the standard stuff & it produces a joint that is a bit stronger. However, for the cost & marginal benefit I used one of the many spools of plumbing solder that I had on hand.

If someone disagrees or knows differently please chime in. Cheers!

 

[P-J]

Thanks PJ, your always looking out for everyone. Does anyone have experience with this solder, looks like it might be a better substitute:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25e...=10053&langId=-1&keyword=solder&storeId=10051

I'm trying to find someplace local I can buy the right silver solder, because I already have a 4 oz bottle of Harris stay clean liquid flux.

That solder is excellent for your use. It is very similar to the Harris StayBrite solder. I checked the MSDS sheet for it.

P-J

 

[Huaco]

I got 2 of these from Amazon and did all my joints with one of the spools of solder. I have not even opened the second package yet and I am wrapping 3 times around each joint.

 

[krazydave]

I just received all the parts for the keg\swage tool. I'm going to try soldering a washer on top of the large side of the reducer to further aid in keeping everything centered. I found a M14 metric washer at Home depot which almost fits the 5/8" bolt, similar to how the 5/8" bolt fits through the reducer, and the outside diameter of the washer is pretty close to what the reducer is.
I would've just gone with a 9/16" bolt, but no-one seemed to have a 4" length without a shoulder that'd be too long to use. So it looks like I get to do some grinding.

12 tools to make one tool. That's how we roll!

 

[krazydave]

okay, tool built... Now just need to start poking holes in some kegs!
I bought the Harris kit from airgas (though they brand it as Radnor). Price was $7.50

Soldered the washers to the back of the 1" fitting and drilled out the 1/2" washer with my step bit.

You can see a good penetration of the solder in this pic.

Soldered my M14 washer on the large end of the reducer.

Ground the outside of the washer down on my bench grinder.

Dremeled the living pi$$ out of the inside of the reducer and M14 washer to get my 5\8" bolt to fit through. Here you can see how the washer holds the reducer straight on the bolt.

And here's the whole thing put together.

I must say, if I made another one of these, I'd go with a 9/16" bolt instead, even if I had to order it from McMaster. Enlarging the inside of that reducer was a PITA and took me almost an hour and a half of Dremeling and filing.

Hope these pics help others out looking to build this thing!

 

[NewBrewB]

Is there anyone selling something like this already made? Looks to me like the real cost is time.

 

[krazydave]

I think if you use a 9/16" bolt, the only real modification you'll need to do is drill out the 1/2" washer with a step bit.

Soldering mine together (which isn't mandatory for the build) really only took me about 10-15min, including grinding the outside of the M14 washer. It was the grinding of the reducer to fit the 5/8" bolt that took me so long.

 

[rellot]

Okay, I've searched through this tread for at least 30 minutes and can't find it.

Can someone direct me to the parts list for making a dimple to solder a 1/2" coupler to a keg. Also one for a heating element.

Thanks!

 

[krazydave]

First try. I'd say it worked very well!

 

[rellot]

found this video on youtube. does a good job of walking through the process.

 

[nostalgia]

found this video on youtube. does a good job of walking through the process. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpMFQFi6Hh4

Dude - I *LOVE* that guy.

-Joe

 

[krazydave]

Okay, I've searched through this tread for at least 30 minutes and can't find it.

Can someone direct me to the parts list for making a dimple to solder a 1/2" coupler to a keg. Also one for a heating element.

Thanks!

Since no-one answered you on this... Here's the parts for the 1/2" coupler tool. Taken from the youtube video posted previously.
However, being that I just built this tool, I think I would try to use 9/16" bolt, nuts and washers instead of the 5/8". Grinding out that reducer to fit the 5/8" bolt wasn't much fun.

5/8"-11 x 4 1/2" bolt
5/8" washer
3/4" to 1/2" stainless steel butt-weld pipe fitting (McMaster-Carr p/n 45605K711)
1" stainless socket weld low pressure coupling (McMaster-Carr p/n 4335T64)
1/2" washer (drilled to 5/8" with the step bit)
5/8" washer
5/8"-11 nut


As for your heating element, I think I did see someone in this huge thread that made a larger tool, but I couldn't tell you where.

 

[rellot]

Thanks. That helps hearing it from someone that just built the tool and used it. Do you think maybe the 1" pressure coupling could be something other than stainless? That's pretty expensive if I could just use something else of the same size/strength.

For clarification, what size hole do you initially drill, and how much smaller should the final hole be compared to the OD of the coupler you are soldering to it? That would help me figure out what to get for the heating element.

 

[krazydave]

I'm sure you could use something else, but I gotta be honest in saying that the 1" fitting is pretty ideal for the way the reducer fits inside of it. I figured it was worth the extra money to get something that's been through it's tests.

for a 1/2" coupling, you should start with a 7/8" hole. I used a Greenlee 1/2" conduit punch to make the hole. I have a about 6 different sized couplings from different places, and none of the the ones from McMaster Carr that everyone says are the perfect size (they were too pricey on them IMHO). I tried marking the reducer to the size of the couplers but it never really worked out. I ended up just taking a good guess and if I made it too big, and few taps with a hammer and the coupler was in there snug enough to solder.

 

[krazydave]

Not sure if this helps any, but it's all I could find given my limited time and the insane size of this thread. But here's a post of someone using a larger reducer for an element.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/soldering-stainless-steel-155782/index59.html#post3140962