Quantcast

So when you guys say mill very fine...

HomeBrewTalk.com - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Community.

Help Support Homebrew Talk:

urg8rb8

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
1,205
Reaction score
120
How fine is very fine? Like flour fine????
 

Double_D

Supporting Member
HBT Supporter
Joined
Feb 17, 2011
Messages
1,954
Reaction score
210
Location
Las Vegas
My mill gap is set to .032. So, a little flour but generally a nice consistent crush with little pieces and intact husks.

Just saw you posted in BIAB...soo...I actually have no idea what's appropriate for the bags but regardless, that's what works for me.
 

Smellyglove

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 17, 2013
Messages
2,807
Reaction score
796
This is how mine ends up looking. There's about 45% Maris Otter in there which has smaler kernel than "normal" continental malt. If this grist would contain some of those other normal malts instead of the MO, it'd be more "opened/split into two" husks than seen. You can mill very fine, but you can't mill to fast/let to much grain fall onto the rollers, or else those husks will be shredded and not as intact as in this pic. If you look closely you can spot the MO.

Edit: I just realized this is in the BIAB forum, so my answer isn't much good in here.

1.jpg
 

Weezy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
626
Location
Pittsburgh
I use a corona mill for biab grinds. I set it by cranking it tight to the point that it makes mostly flour, then back it off slightly, just to the point where the floor turns into tiny chunks.
 

BudBernerBrewer

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2016
Messages
49
Reaction score
13
Location
fort collins
I mill as tight as my mm3 will go. Then double crush. 1/2 " drive, angle drill works perfect so I don't have to bend over and hold drill straight.
 

tgolanos

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 25, 2015
Messages
371
Reaction score
140
Location
Sydney, NSW, AUS
I have a generic malt mill and I always double-crush. I end up with about 50% flour, 50% very fine crush (chunks) with some husk
 
OP
U

urg8rb8

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
1,205
Reaction score
120
I should have added more detail... I mash the grains in a grain bag, which is why I posted in BIAB.

I also use a Corona style mill.
 

TexasWine

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
2,409
Reaction score
672
Location
Houston
On my system, a recirculating eBIAB, I usually go for mostly in tact husks with conditioned mill and a gap of 0.035.

However, over Christmas I did a simple BIAB brew day with the bro in law. Used my Blendtec and turned it in to flour. Literally, I had a bag of flour. Everything went off without a hitch.
 

wilserbrewer

BIAB Expert Tailor
Joined
May 25, 2007
Messages
11,234
Reaction score
2,779
Location
New Jersey
Coarse corn meal consistency. All kernels well broken with NO whole kernels remaining. Largest piece remaining would be about 1/3 to 1/2 kernel max....fully obliterated. Does that help lol

Fwiw I crush the same when batch sparging with a braid.
 
OP
U

urg8rb8

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
1,205
Reaction score
120
On my system, a recirculating eBIAB, I usually go for mostly in tact husks with conditioned mill and a gap of 0.035.

However, over Christmas I did a simple BIAB brew day with the bro in law. Used my Blendtec and turned it in to flour. Literally, I had a bag of flour. Everything went off without a hitch.
Did you get better efficiency?
 
OP
U

urg8rb8

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
1,205
Reaction score
120
Coarse corn meal consistency. All kernels well broken with NO whole kernels remaining. Largest piece remaining would be about 1/3 to 1/2 kernel max....fully obliterated. Does that help lol

Fwiw I crush the same when batch sparging with a braid.
Yes that helps, thanks!
 

jtratcliff

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Feb 7, 2013
Messages
1,766
Reaction score
625
Location
Pasadena
For the Corona mill with BIAB, tighten it until you're scared, then tighten it a little more :)

On my corona, the grinding plates clatter together quite loudly until I have grain going thru it. I had to add washers in order to be able to crank it down that tight.

I get a rather large proportion of coarse flour, some shredded husks, and *no* intact kernels.

Finer is better for BIAB, IMHO...
 

TexasWine

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
2,409
Reaction score
672
Location
Houston
I should add that I am not a proponent of going to the extremes of brewing with flour. Actually, due to reading some of the book Technology and Brewing, I am in the camp of folks who believe you should leave as much of the husks intact as is possible. Either that, or remove the husks entirely.
 

Weezy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
626
Location
Pittsburgh
I ran a handful of Munich through the mill this morning:




You can see the flour too, north of the whole grain.

(handy little, old, usb macro camera)
 
OP
U

urg8rb8

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
1,205
Reaction score
120
So I'm assuming that pulverizing the grain to flour does create tannins in the mash?
 

Weezy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
626
Location
Pittsburgh
So I'm assuming that pulverizing the grain to flour does create tannins in the mash?
Tannins are a byproduct of a brew process that's out of whack. pH too high, oversparging (too low gravity) extracting tannins from the husk. Grain size is immaterial.
 

TexasWine

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Apr 11, 2013
Messages
2,409
Reaction score
672
Location
Houston
So I'm assuming that pulverizing the grain to flour does create tannins in the mash?
Not necessarily. But here's something I read recently in the Kunze book...

"Furthermore, as well as cellulose, the husks also contain polyphenols and other components which create an unpleasant bitter taste and have a negative​ effect on the colloidal stability of the beer."

And he goes on the say this about keeping the husks and acrospire as intact as possible...

"thus increasing the elasticity of the husk. As a result, no damage to the acrospire occurs during comminution, and thus there is no, or at least considerably reduced, release of lipids."

So my goal when milling for my own beer (not my bro in law's) is to leave as much of the husks intact as I can. That's why I condition before milling.
 

Weezy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
626
Location
Pittsburgh
Not necessarily. But here's something I read recently in the Kunze book...

"Furthermore, as well as cellulose, the husks also contain polyphenols and other components which create an unpleasant bitter taste and have a negative​ effect on the colloidal stability of the beer."

And he goes on the say this about keeping the husks and acrospire as intact as possible...

"thus increasing the elasticity of the husk. As a result, no damage to the acrospire occurs during comminution, and thus there is no, or at least considerably reduced, release of lipids."

So my goal when milling for my own beer (not my bro in law's) is to leave as much of the husks intact as I can. That's why I condition before milling.[/QUOTE[

That post isn't helping the newer brewer, bub, without clarification.

Tannins are a polyphenol. The primary source of tannins/detrimental polyphenols is the husk.

Milling, of any sort, is going to mame the husk and leave them in the mash.

In an utopian universe, the husk could be separated from the grain during milling (which is possible with commercial equipment), but we don't live there. Keeping your mash in an appropriate pH range (<5.8) and at a reasonable SG range (say >1.03) will minimize the possibility of tannin extraction from husks.

And I'm ignoring the fact that Kunze is erroneous on many points. CV people need to stop quoting the thing as gospel.
 

FruityHops

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2016
Messages
81
Reaction score
19
Location
Hartford County
Aren't the enzymes needed for conversion of starch to sugar located in the husk? I guess you could mash without husks and use pure enzyme additive instead, but...
 

Smellyglove

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 17, 2013
Messages
2,807
Reaction score
796
Aren't the enzymes needed for conversion of starch to sugar located in the husk? I guess you could mash without husks and use pure enzyme additive instead, but...
After malting you will find the enzymes in the endosperm.
 

Weezy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Messages
2,677
Reaction score
626
Location
Pittsburgh
Aren't the enzymes needed for conversion of starch to sugar located in the husk? I guess you could mash without husks and use pure enzyme additive instead, but...
The choicest commercial grain mills add some moisture to the grain, which improves the quality of the milling by reducing dust/floor plan and better separates the grain from the husk, then the husk is separated. Husks are the leading cause of tannin production.
 
Top