S-4 Quitting at 51%?

[danok1]

My LHBS closed, so I decided to give a Morebeer kit a try. I ordered the AG Dry Irish Stout kit and a packet of S-04 yeast. I've used this in the past and had good results. In fact, I would worry that the yeast quit too soon, because the krausen would drop after 4 days! The beers were always fine though.

Well, the kit was as follows:

10# pale male
2# flaked barley
1# roasted barley
1oz Magnum (60 min)

Mashed at 153-154F. Boiled/cooled. Rehydrated yeast.

Took OG with a hydrometer: 1.061

Pitched the yeast and kept the fermenter at 63F-64F. Had active fermentation within 24 hours. After 5 days I let it rise to ambient temps (around 68-70F).

Checked gravity a couple of days ago, expecting to see something around 1.019. It was 1.030! Gently swirled the bucket and moved to a warmer area. Checked again today: 1.030.

The hydro sample didn't taste overly sweet.

I'm tempted to pitch another packet in the hope that will get the gravity down a bit more. Or is that not a good idea at this point? And what might have caused this? I think I might have mashed a bit too high.

Thanks,
Dan

 

[Gnomebrewer]

What did you use to check final gravity - refractometer or hydrometer?

 

[danok1]

What did you use to check final gravity - refractometer or hydrometer?

Hydrometer.

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Ok.
This is a bit strange for S-04. IME, it ferments fast and dry (drier than it's supposed to). Also, at 1.030, the beer should taste quite sweet (not in a nice way). Mashing high won't leave you with an FG that high - it could be the difference between a 1.10 to 1.020 difference, but not much more than that.
Pitching another packet of yeast won't hurt - just try to avoid too much oxygen getting in.

 

[k1ngl1ves]

How good is the thermometer you used when mashing?

04 is a beast. What was the date on the yeast packet, and was it stored properly?


I have huge faith in 04, almost to a fault. I always look to other issues before settling on that yeast being the problem. For me, 04 has never been at fault yet...

 

[danok1]

Ok.
This is a bit strange for S-04. IME, it ferments fast and dry (drier than it's supposed to). Also, at 1.030, the beer should taste quite sweet (not in a nice way). Mashing high won't leave you with an FG that high - it could be the difference between a 1.10 to 1.020 difference, but not much more than that.
Pitching another packet of yeast won't hurt - just try to avoid too much oxygen getting in.

Yeah, I've always had that experience with S-04. That's why I'm a bit baffled here. As I said in the OP, the sample wasn't that sweet; I would have downed the whole thing if I didn't have to get back to work.

 

[danok1]

How good is the thermometer you used when mashing?

04 is a beast. What was the date on the yeast packet, and was it stored properly?


I have huge faith in 04, almost to a fault. I always look to other issues before settling on that yeast being the problem. For me, 04 has never been at fault yet...

The thermometer is nothing special, but it's what I've always used.

As for the date on the yeast packet, I didn't check it, TBH. I went on the assumption that Morebeer.com turns over their inventory fairly quickly and that they know how to handle yeast.

I hear ya on having faith in S-04. Never had a problem before this...thus my befuddlement.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

I use 04 a lot and found it has a mind of its own. It usually gets "nearly" done in just a few days and the last few points take forever. I've make the same beer over and over and sometimes its the best beer Ive ever had and other times its good but not fantastic.
I just pulled a sample of my go to Irish red after 6 days and its 2 points to high. I'm giving it one more day before cold crash as I need it by next weekend.
1.030 seems odd after 6 days like you did something wrong while rehydrating and killed off some yeast???

 

[danok1]

I use 04 a lot and found it has a mind of its own. It usually gets "nearly" done in just a few days and the last few points take forever. I've make the same beer over and over and sometimes its the best beer Ive ever had and other times its good but not fantastic.
I just pulled a sample of my go to Irish red after 6 days and its 2 points to high. I'm giving it one more day before cold crash as I need it by next weekend.
1.030 seems odd after 6 days like you did something wrong while rehydrating and killed off some yeast???

It's actually been 14 days. I wasn't clear in my OP about that. As to your question, I suppose it's possible that something went wrong during the rehydration. In any event, I can get hold of another packet of S-04 tomorrow. I'll pitch it and see what happens.

-Dan

 

[k1ngl1ves]

It's actually been 14 days. I wasn't clear in my OP about that. As to your question, I suppose it's possible that something went wrong during the rehydration. In any event, I can get hold of another packet of S-04 tomorrow. I'll pitch it and see what happens.

-Dan

Any updates? Did the new packet of 04 take off?

 

[danok1]

Any updates? Did the new packet of 04 take off?

Well, no bubbling in the airlock (which means nothing, I know). I haven't opened the lid since I pitched Saturday; want to keep that to a minimum. So I don't know yet.

I'm going to check the gravity this afternoon...will update then.

-Dan

 

[IslandLizard]

Well, no bubbling in the airlock (which means nothing, I know). I haven't opened the lid since I pitched Saturday; want to keep that to a minimum. So I don't know yet.

I'm going to check the gravity this afternoon...will update then.

-Dan

You can suck/siphon your hydrometer/taste sample through the airlock hole. I use a 2' long skinny 1/4" or 5/16" OD hose and give it a hard suck. Just don't let it flow back. Some use a syringe with a piece of hose or a long diptube attached. It won't disturb your headspace as much as lifting the lid. If you have CO2 available, you can flush the headspace afterward if needed or wanted.

To rouse I've stuck a spare keg diptube down that airlock hole (remove grommet) all the way to the bottom and burped the beer with CO2.

That said, I had an Old Ale (1.090 OG) get stuck at 1.031 with 2 packs of rehydrated S-04. No budging after 2 weeks. I had chalked that up to inadequate oxygenation at pitching time, and/or an unexpected temp drop. Maybe it was the yeast itself?

 

[danok1]

Well, no bubbling in the airlock (which means nothing, I know). I haven't opened the lid since I pitched Saturday; want to keep that to a minimum. So I don't know yet.

I'm going to check the gravity this afternoon...will update then.

-Dan

Well, I checked the gravity: 1.030. I guess it's done.

Again, the hyrdo sample tasted ok. I had SWMBO take a taste; she said it was a bit "tart". I asked if she thought it was sweet; nope, just a bit tart.

Looks like I'm bottling this weekend. Thanks to you all for your input...it's appreciated!

-Dan

 

[TomVA]

I doubt it is the mash temperature - I have mashed as high as 160°F with over 20% crystal malts and still got FGs under 1.020 with S-04. Have you checked the calibration of your hydrometer in water?

TomVA

 

[danok1]

I doubt it is the mash temperature - I have mashed as high as 160°F with over 20% crystal malts and still got FGs under 1.020 with S-04. Have you checked the calibration of your hydrometer in water?

TomVA

Yes, that was the first thing I checked. Calibrated correctly. Also calibrated and checked with a 2nd hydrometer...same reading.

-Dan

 

[danok1]

Just a quick update: I bottled last weekend...will keep an eye on the carbonation level.

I found what I believe is the source of my troubles. I broke out the equipment this morning to get a batch of California Common going. I decided to check my thermometer and put it in a glass of crushed ice and water. Looked at the temperature after 5 minutes...24 degrees!! Eight degrees too low! So when I thought I mad a mash at 154, it was really at 162-163!

I corrected the calibration and rechecked it 3 times...32 each time. I don't anticipate having the same problem this batch. I do look forward to a completely new problem though!

Lesson: Check and re-check everything before starting.

-Dan