Recommendations for semi-electric brewing setup.

[Rylando]

Hey guys. I'd like some recommendations on moving forward with an electric HERMS based recirculation project. This is my current setup.

And the inside of the SS kettle.

The water in the kettle is warmed to mash temp and the mash water is pumped through the coil, back into the MLT. It works really well as far as recirculation goes. The issue is, the propane is awful for "set it and forget it" temperatures. I constantly have to monitor it and adjust. So, what I'm looking to do is to introduce a semi electric setup. I plan to build a PID for the element(s) in this kettle only and the single pump, if that is a feasible option. Another issue I'm facing is that I only have two inches of clearance below the bottom of the coil. I'm also only able to run 110v as I don't have anything nearby for 220v.

Other considerations. I've just purchased an SSBT 10 mash tun that will replace the cooler and I will be moving the bulkhead over to accommodate the recirculation.

I'm still going to boil with gas.

I really want to make this work. I don't want to move to RIMS. Whether it was the right decision or not, I drilled two big holes in the $200 kettle for this coil to work and it's just gonna have to stay put.

Looking for some advice, whether it's "Use this (these) elements" or "No, you can't do that. I appreciate any assistance.

 

[mredge73]

Use propane to get it quickly to mash temp.
Then install a 120vac 1500w "hot rod" element (or something similar) with a simple thermostat controller or PID.
https://www.brewhardware.com/product_p/hotrodrtu1500gfci.htm
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BDB4UG/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

You could also use an induction cooktop, may work better.

There are also some options for automating gas using a pilot light and servo valve.

This can be an expensive upgrade, you may want to consider an all electric solution or all gas solution for boiling and temperature maintenance.
In the end I don't think you will be happy with a hybrid solution.

 

[Rylando]

I think a heat stick is the way to go, so thank you for that. It would save from any more drilling or mounting. I am in no way familiar with what electric can do. If I were to get two of those bucket heaters (2000W total), would that at all allow me to heat this up to mash temp without gas in a reasonable time? With the coil submerged, it would be 8.5 gallons of water. If I need to heat with gas and maintain with heat stick(s), then so be it, but not my first choice.

Thanks again!

 

[plazola86]

If you only have 120v for the hot rod you would be better of as a hybrid. Make big heat changes with gas (reach mash temp, boil) and maintain temp with the hot rod. I'm NOT saying you cant make it work with a 120v system, just keep in mind it will take longer to heat everything.

 

[augiedoggy]

4000w of heating elements (2) 2000w elements, will heat up 9 gallons fairly quickly actually...

 

[chudsonvt]

I run my HERMS off of 120V with only a 1500W element. But I have it all installed in a 10 gallon cooler so the insulation definitely helps. It is still slow. So you may want to use some insulation. However the 2000W will also be an improvement.

To speed things up, I intentionally set the water to greater than what I need mash to be. I usually heat my strike water (4 to 5 gallons, depending on recipe) and then have another 7 or 8 gallons in the cooler. So then if I am getting ready for mashout, I will actually get my HLT water up to around 185. Then, once I start recirculating, the 1500W won't keep the temp up. So my goal is to get my mash up to say 165 or so and still have the MLT water at around 170 for sparging. As I recirculate, the HLT will actually cool down. the key is to figure out.

When I am doing step changes, I will usually keep my HLT a bit lower but still higher than my target. I just make sure that I keep my eye on the temp and stop circulating when I get to my target. Also, after every step change I flush out my coil with HLT water to push the wort back into the mash.

I actually do not use controllers with the setup at this point in time because everything is so slow it is easy to manually manage. However, if and when I move to 240V later, I will DEFINITELY use controllers for pretty much everything.

I hope this info helps.

 

[augiedoggy]

honestly from having owned and used both a herms and rims and seeing your current equipment I really think a rims makes more sense for your situation... It would work quicker and allow you to heat your sparge water while mashing... a straight 5500w element running at 120v would eliminat any scorching fears you might have and run at 1375 watts which is enough to maintain and even step mash with 9 gallons...

 

[Rylando]

Thank you all. I suppose my current process should have been explained in my first post for comparison.

I fill the coiled kettle with filtered hose water to the 8.5 mark. It is then heated to suggested temp (ex. 160F for 154F mash or whatever). I pump 1 gallon into the cooler, then refill that gallon in the kettle. Give that time to warm back up as the cooler adjusts, then pump my remaining strike water into the cooler. Dough in as I'm refilling the kettle. Once that reaches just over mash temp, I start recirculating wort through the coil and back into the MLT. All this works really well aside from the gas needing constant adjustment. I turn it down too low and the wind blows, it goes out. Of course I can't have it too high.

Once mash is complete, I raise the water in the kettle to sparge temp, swap a hose and flush it through the coil to clean that out and sparge, as the wort fills the boil kettle (that is not pictured).

One advantage of this coiled setup is that it also doubles as my chiller. During boil, I let the remaining water cool and fill it back up to 8.5 gallons with hose water. Once temps drop enough, I dump ice into the kettle to finish out. The remaining water, once I finish everything, is heated and used to clean the coil, hoses, pump, etc.

I really cannot afford to switch to a RIMS system with what I have already invested in this setup. Given that, it seems that major temp changes would probably be best through gas, then maintain with a heat stick. I don't suppose (please correct this) that a controller is necessary at this point and that's fine. The pump is on a remote in the outlet anyways, so I can turn it on/off whenever.

So, this may be easier than I thought. A heat stick and just keep an eye on it. I can actually put it on the same remote outlet and just turn it off if I need to.

These are not necessary and are in no way relevant to this conversation.
:rockin::fro:

 

[mredge73]

I think you will still need a controller at some point.
At 8.5 gallons a 1500w heater will raise the temp by 1 degree every 50 seconds. A 1000w element will do the same in 74 seconds.

 

[plazola86]

Save yourself the headache and go all electric. Two element 120 each or full 240.

 

[Rylando]

So I've learned a few things about electricity today. In looking into amps, volts and watts...I know that I have a 15A breaker to the outlets on my porch. That will only allow 1800W max. 2 1000W elements would potentially trip the breaker and I would be pushing it at 1800W. I have 20A in the kitchen but really don't want to run an extension cord, leaving a door or window cracked (since I only brew outside). That seems to leave me with 1500W and from what you all have relayed, that would pretty much take all day just to heat the water if I did not use gas for the initial heating. All this seems to defeat the purpose of what I'm trying to do but it is what it is and I'll have a go at that route for now.

I truly appreciate all the input you folks have given me. I may consider adding a 240V outlet and just going all electric, but that's a lot of planning so down the road it will be.