Questions about fermation

[kingoslo]

Hello my friends

My brew is fermenting nicely in my primary

I've heard people talk about skimming of the top of the brew with the back of a wooden spoon. How do i do this? I do not really understand:

1. How much i need to remove,
2. what to remove?
3. Why the back of a wooden tool an not a different tool.

4. I am making a belgian strong ale (SG of 80.) I've got a question about secondary. Some people have suggested me to let the yeast sink for 5 days before adding finings, others have said to keep the beer is secondary for 3 weeks.

Any answers would be great!!


Cheers!

 

[reim0027]

I haven't heard of this (not too surprising). What is the goal of skimming the top of the brew? Especially with a wooden spoon. It sounds like a great way to introduce infection. If that is the case, then there better be a good reason to do it.

 

[ifishsum]

I wouldn't do it, IMO there's a greater risk of infection for dubious benefit. There used to be a school of thought that removing the krausen led to a better tasting beer, but anymore the general consensus I've seen is to just let it fall back into the beer and let it settle out in the trub.

I'd leave your 1.080 beer in the primary fermenter for at least 2 weeks before moving to secondary (and you should be at FG before racking). You can add finings to the secondary if you want, I've never done that so someone else can advise you there. I just leave them in the secondary for 2 weeks or more and they usually clear sufficiently.

 

[defenestrate]

dont do it. only reason to it is harvest yeast. there might be some trub in that foam but don't touch it...it will fall out of the beer once the fermentation is done. let that beer ferment all alone.

 

[GAbrewer]

Go here and read under "astringent".

How to Brew - By John Palmer - Common Off-Flavors

Personally I've never bothered with trying to skim anything. I certainly wouldn't do it with a wooden spoon if I did.

 

[Revvy]

That's one of those oldschool ideas that has pretty much gone out of style....it's like the old belief that you should be blowing krausen off vigorously through a blowoff tube.

But like Flyguy says here...

And as far as blow-offs go, they should always be avoided when possible because large blow-offs tend to eject the compounds that aid in head retention, which you really want to keep in your beer.

You don't really want to remove anything...just let the krauzen fall normally, it will scrub out your beer on the way down, and leave the beer alone for 3-4 weeks an allow the yeast to clean up after themselves....They do a great job if you just leave your beer alone.

 

[FlyGuy]

That's one of those oldschool ideas that has pretty much gone out of style....

You don't really want to remove anything...just let the krauzen fall normally, it will scrub out your beer on the way down, and leave the beer alone for 3-4 weeks an allow the yeast to clean up after themselves....They do a great job if you just leave your beer alone.

Nicely put Revvy. I wonder if the practice of removing krausen is somehow related to the other outdated practice of getting your beer off the yeast immediately following primary fermentation (i.e. racking to secondary within days of pitching). Maybe the practice of skimming the krausen was popular because people WEREN'T leaving their beer on yeast long enough for it to get cleaned up naturally.

 

[kingoslo]

I got this from British book called Big book of Brewing by Dave Line. He urges the brewer ti do it on page 165:

"we must only remove contaminated portios [of Krausen], so as to ensure that a protecting barrier is still maintained [krausen].

All that is needed is to pat of the oxidised scum with the back of a wooden spoon"

I thought it sounded crazy.

Cheers.oz

 

[Revvy]

I thought it sounded crazy.

Cheers.oz

Well it's not "crazy" it's just reflects the beliefs of that time...Brewing is an evolving art/craft/science, and ideas evolve over time, just like in the rest of society...

Ideas change with science....Here's a good example John Palmer basically admits that what he wrote about IBU's in How to brew, was esentially "wrong" or at least outdated in light of new science...

March 20, 2008 - What Is an IBU . . . Really?
John Palmer, author of How to Brew, shares information from a conference that challenged his concept of what defines an International Bitterness Unit (IBU).

http://media.libsyn.com/media/basicbrewing/bbr03-20-08ibu.mp3

I cite that podcast as an example of how the knowlegebase shifts so fast in this hobby because of places like this or podcasts...A book is a snapshot of the author's body of knowledge and the "common wisdom" at the time the author wrote the book, which may mean 3 years before it was even published. Papazian's book is 30+ years old. The basic knowlege is good, but brewing science and experience has progressed to where some things an author believes or says at that time may no-longer be valid...even to the author.

In that Podcast, Palmer basically contradicts in some was what he wrote in HTB...and I bet it will be reflected in his subsequent writings, but if he doesn't go back and revise HTB, and people don't read or listen to anything by him after, than they won't realize that the knowlegebase has already shifted...

So that's the thing to realize...It wasn't "bad" advice, it's just that it's not the prevailing philosophy any more...it may never be again...but it worked for them...but for whatever reason there has been a shift in philosophy, like flyangler said, away from the idea that yeast touching beer is bad, to yeast touching beer for awhile is good...

Which I think actually harkens back to pre BMC brewing...before corporate brewing where everything has to be controlled so that the same beer brewed in a brewery in Japan and St louis taste exactly the same (like MacDonalds)...It tastes the same...but is that taste the best it can be??? I actually wonder if leaving the yeast in contact with the beer is the older style of brewing...

 

[kingoslo]

Thank you for these great replies!

Marius