question on the instructions

[mlail]

If there is anybody on the Internet today I have a procedural question. My beer making kit came with a book and part of the instructions in a nut shell states that I need to cook the wort and then cool it. The cooling could take some time without a inter cooler or other device. After it reaches about 85 degrees, I am to move it to the fermenter where I can add the remaining water and then yeast.

So my question is: Why not use the cool water that I pour into the fermenter to aid the cooling process? Would this cause an affect to the wort or later yeast? It just seems that the cool water would greatly reduce the cooling time in the process.

Happy Thanksgiving!

 

[ghosthef]

You can add the cool water to cool you wort but one thing to keep in mind is that water should also be boiled to sanitize it. When I first started brewing I didn't have a pot large enough for my entire boil volume so I had a second pot where I boiled extra water.

I hope this helps.

 

[unionrdr]

You do a one hour boil with the wort for hop additions. For a partial boil,I do 2.5-3.75 gallons of water in a 5 gallon kettle. About 2lbs of plain DMe or LME to make the wort. Bittering addition in @ start of boil. flavor additions from 20 minutes left down to about 10 minutes left.
I chill the wort in an ice bath in the sink to around 75F. Then strain into fermenter to aerate it & get gink out. top off to recipe volume with very cold spring water that's been in the fridge for a day or two. Stir roughly to mix & aerate some more. Take OG hydrometer sample,pitch yeast & seal'er up.

 

[Yooper]

The issue with adding cool water is that it doesn't cool the wort quite enough, and then you have 5 gallons of too-warm wort which takes even longer to cool! I did it, and realized quickly that it wasn't going to work!

The easiest thing to do is to take your boiled wort and put it in a cold water bath (adding some ice if you can) in your kitchen sink. Stir the bath a little to avoid hot spots, and stir the wort gently with a sanitized spoon. Once it gets to 100 degrees or less, then it can be added to the fermenter with very cold top up water, and that should get you to about 60-70 degrees so that the yeast can be added.

 

[HistoryBrewing]

FWIW, I never boil my top-off water. Ever. Maybe I have fantastic water (or luck) but I find boiling the top-off water just a time waster. I usually cool the wort with an immersion chiller to about 85, pour into my primary, then top off with water straight from the tap and pitch. Haven't had an issue yet! (knocks on wood)

 

[unionrdr]

I use local spring water from some 6 local wells that White House Artisian Springs has. It's ozoned & other things to make sure it's pure. but a couple gallons in the fridge for a couple days works well as is for me. Since I chill the wort down to about 75F,the very cold top off water gets it down to between 64-65F most often as not. The yeasties & hops seem to like the mineral content of the spring water the way it is. Boiling for mashed wort,etc is equally good with it.

 

[ianw58]

FWIW not boiling your water is rather like speeding.

You can get away with driving 75 in a 55 zone for ages until one day when that motorcycle cop is sat in the shadows behind the billboard with his friggin' laser and...

Well bang goes the damn grain mill budget this month!

Not that it happened to me, of course. I NEVER speed!

And, mlail, that was 23 minutes from your post to this one. HBT - answers to question, even on Thanksgiving Day / the first day of Chanukah....

 

[BigFloyd]

a couple gallons in the fridge for a couple days works well as is for me. Since I chill the wort down to about 75F,the very cold top off water gets it down to between 64-65F most often as not.

+1. What you're doing is called a "partial boil". You'll want to do two things to get the final wort (in the bucket) to a good pitch temp in the low 60's.

1) Chill what's in the kettle to below 90*F using an ice bath in the sink. Use a sanitized spoon to stir the wort and a different spoon to move the ice water around the kettle. The stirring makes it go much faster.

2) Chill your top-off water. Using bottled spring water makes this easier. You can stick a few gallon bottles in the fridge 4-5 hours before you're going to need it. You want it cold.

One of the biggest favors you can do for your beer is to get the wort cooled to the right temp (low 60's) before pitching yeast and keep the ferment cool (mid-60's). Warm ferments (even in the 70's) can cause unpleasant flavors in your beer.

 

[Yooper]

FWIW not boiling your water is rather like speeding.

You can get away with driving 75 in a 55 zone for ages until one day when that motorcycle cop is sat in the shadows behind the billboard with his friggin' laser and...

Well bang goes the damn grain mill budget this month!

Not that it happened to me, of course. I NEVER speed!

And, mlail, that was 23 minutes from your post to this one. HBT - answers to question, even on Thanksgiving Day / the first day of Chanukah....

I have never boiled my top off water. I've been making wine 20+ years, and beer since about 2000.

Water is pretty darn sanitary out of the tap- people even have been known to drink it or give it to small children.

However, chlorinated water or water with chloramines (which don't boil off) is another story. Our water is very lightly chlorinated, and it dissipates in just a couple of minutes by splashing out of the faucet. Chlorinated water, via chloramines, shouldn't be untreated for brewing anyway, but boiling won't fix that. That is a whole 'nother story, though!

 

[Newsman]

What I have been doing is setting the temperature on my fermentation chamber (read: chest freezer ) to very low and put the pot in there to chill. 'Course I have an immersion chiller now, so I'm gonna try that next time (haven't brewed since I got it!)

 

[BigFloyd]

'Course I have an immersion chiller now, so I'm gonna try that next time (haven't brewed since I got it!)

You're going to enjoy having that. The key with the IC is to stir the wort (with a sanitized spoon) frequently.

 

[MindenMan]

I too have a new IC, except I made mine. I call it Frankenchiller as it is pretty ugly and looks pieced together from leftover parts. The parts were all new but you couldn't tell by looking I haven't used it yet either. C'mon, paycheck.

 

[Newsman]

You're going to enjoy having that. The key with the IC is to stir the wort (with a sanitized spoon) frequently.

Thanks, BigFloyd. I look forward to my next brew day. With the weather so cool here in North Georgia, it should cool the wort down pretty quickly.

 

[ianw58]

Water is pretty darn sanitary out of the tap- people even have been known to drink it or give it to small children. !

Yoopers! Do you know what fish do in that stuff?

My Daughter-in-Law, who is a big cheese in the Water District of a very important local valley known for its alcoholic beverage industry, and who will be here shortly, goes to great lengths to make sure their water is completely safe.

I'm very fortunate to live where I do, now. The local agency uses very little chlorine and is very on top of the distribution system. Still, why take a chance when it's so easy to not have to worry?

BTW, although I made wine with my Dad as a kid, my first batch if homebrew was from a kit given to me in Christmas 1994. Not quite at 20 years, yet, Yoopers?

Happy Thanksgiving.

 

[krackin]

It must really be a major drag to live in a place where you have to boil your water to brew or make additions. Mine comes out of a naturally sand filtered aquifer via driven well point and I do not need to make mineral or chemical additions or worry about contamination. Do what you have to do.

 

[mlail]

I will start by saying thanks to everyone that posted here! (thanks). Here is how my process went.

I started the whole thing by cooking a partial batch. Per the instructions from the mix, I poured in 2 liters of water and brought that to a boil. Then I added the sugar and malt extract from the can. Stirring constantly or nearly so, brought the wort to a boil. Then I let it boil for 60 minutes. Initially I had to splash some cool water to prevent a boil-over. That and reducing the heat. I then turned off the burner at 55 minutes in. The wort continued to boil the next 5 minutes without additional heat. I put a lid on the pot and moved it over the the sink full of ice water. As suggested above, I stirred the water every few minutes and the finished wort. The temp dropped quickly. In 20 minutes the wort was down to 85 F.

So I added some water to the fermenter bucket and siphoned the wort into the bucket letting it splash in and help aireate the wort. Adding the rest of the now chilled water brought the mix to 5 gallons and 63 degrees. Added in the yeast and tested the gravity. If I got that right it is 1.042. This is a larger batch so it seemed OK.

With the lid on the bucket and the bubblier in the lid I placed it all in the box the kit came in. To keep it dark.

So according to instructions, I need to keep the lager cooler than the inside of my house. The house is around 67F and the temp swings with the sun. At times the temp rises to upper 70's and the night low is 65F.

I've thought that I can move the fermenter and box to the garage but first wrapping the fermenter bucket with a towel or something to help insulate it from temp variations. This will allow cooler Lager temps. There will still be a swing that I cannot avoid. The night temp is around 50F and the day can be in the 60's but the weather suggests maybe it will stay in the 50's.

What would you do, keep the fermenter in the house or put it in the garage?

Thanks again for your help and posts!

 

[Newsman]

(snip)

So according to instructions, I need to keep the lager cooler than the inside of my house. The house is around 67F and the temp swings with the sun. At times the temp rises to upper 70's and the night low is 65F.

I've thought that I can move the fermenter and box to the garage but first wrapping the fermenter bucket with a towel or something to help insulate it from temp variations. This will allow cooler Lager temps. There will still be a swing that I cannot avoid. The night temp is around 50F and the day can be in the 60's but the weather suggests maybe it will stay in the 50's.

What would you do, keep the fermenter in the house or put it in the garage?

Thanks again for your help and posts!

Don't suppose you have an extra refrigerator you can stick this in? If so, that would be ideal... just set it for as warm as it'll go and it should be good, if you're using a Lager yeast. Ideally, you'd have a temperature controlled outlet that will keep your "fermentation chamber" at the ideal temperature. Failing a spare fridge, I would say stick your fermenter in a big plastic tub of water and maybe throw a couple bottles of frozen water in the tub, morning and evening and use the swamp cooler to help keep the fermenter chilled.

 

[mlail]

Newsman,

Thanks for the post back but I cannot pull off either suggestion. We are in a small house and busting at the seams. No refrigerator or tub large enough to put the fermenter in.

The only other possible option is my shed that does have heat. Maybe I can move it there and set the temp at 60F.

 

[Newsman]

Newsman,

The only other possible option is my shed that does have heat. Maybe I can move it there and set the temp at 60F.

Could you pick up one of those big plastic tubs and put it in your shed? Also, if you have any way to hook a probe up to your shed thermostat and stick the probe to your fermenter, that would be ideal. The idea being that the water bath would help stabilize the temperature swings.

 

[mlail]

I like the way you think but unfortunately, I just do not have that kind of space. My shed stores everything that overflows from the garage and at times house and it holds my workbench which is full at the moment.

 

[Newsman]

I like the way you think but unfortunately, I just do not have that kind of space. My shed stores everything that overflows from the garage and at times house and it holds my workbench which is full at the moment.

Yeah... I hear you. Oh, well... it was just an idea. Good luck!

 

[HistoryBrewing]

You're going to enjoy having that. The key with the IC is to stir the wort (with a sanitized spoon) frequently.

Stirring the wort with the immersion chiller itself, I found, is a much more efficient way of cooling it quicker. If it's so big that it squeezes into the pot you won't get as an efficient heat transfer since less wort will be in contact with the IC. In that case, I would definitely suggest stirring with a sanitized stainless spoon. I just prefer to have as little equipment possible touch the wort, especially after it falls below 160 degrees.

As far as your question about the house or garage, mlail, if it were me in that situation I would just throw my fermenter in the darkest corner of the garage with something under it to insulate it from the ground. That will help in temp swings.

 

[mlail]

As a test, I have been checking the fermenter temp inside the box and it is constantly at 66F. Not optimum for a lager but not bad.

Thanks for the garage idea!