Belgian Golden Strong Ale Pink Elephant (Delirium Tremens clone)

[klamz]

Also does anyone think that lagering at 39F is much different then 32F????

 

[jkarp]

Naw, 39, 32, close enough.

The real DT has quite a bit of haze so that's in character. Mine REALLY cleared up after a couple months in the beer fridge however.

 

[klamz]

Jkarp, Thanks for this recipe!..... What kind of water did you use for this beer? Do you happen to have your water report? I'd like to compare it with mine.

 

[jkarp]

Jkarp, Thanks for this recipe!..... What kind of water did you use for this beer? Do you happen to have your water report? I'd like to compare it with mine.

pH 7.2
Sodium, Na 10
Potassium, K 2
Calcium, Ca 32
Magnesium, Mg 5
Total Hardness, CaCO3 101
Nitrate, NO3-N 2.2 (SAFE)
Sulfate, SO4-S 4
Chloride, Cl 7
Carbonate, CO3 <1
Bicarbonate, HCO3 109
Total Alkalinity, CaCO3 90

 

[snoopdoggydad]

Jkarp, Thanks for the recipe. I'm currently lagering (32o) my first attempt at a belgian after reading your post (and seeing how little the beer cleared in the primary). Hope this is not too much of a noob question, but is there any need to repitch yeast for bottling or is there enough remaining in the beer after the secondary? On this batch ... OG was ~1.08 (still a little warm when measured), gravity 1.010 when racking to secondary after 3 weeks in primary. Plan to bottle after 1-2 weeks in secondary.

 

[jkarp]

There'll be plenty of yeast left. No need to repitch.

 

[sd38]

So is there an additional conditioning period after the warm bottle conditioning?Or is it ready to rock after the 21 days in the bottle?

 

[jkarp]

Give one a go and see. Mine really clear up and hit optimal flavor after about 8 weeks in the bottle, but it's quite drinkable, if a little cloudy, right after carbonation.

 

[sd38]

Cool thanks i just took my hydrometer reading and tasted it,wow it was great smells like ace but tastes good.

 

[Hunlock]

LOOKS GREAT!!!!!

One question though, if I have corn or candi sugar on hand, can I substitute?

If so, how much do you think?


Thanks in advance!


Tim

 

[jkarp]

If corn sugar is good enough for Chimay, it's good enough for us.

Corn and cane both have 46 GUs so no recipe adjustment is needed.

 

[Hunlock]

If corn sugar is good enough for Chimay, it's good enough for us.

Corn and cane both have 46 GUs so no recipe adjustment is needed.

Thanks!

Now, what about beet compared to corn?

 

[sonetlumiere85]

No, this is my first Belgian. It's not the smell that frightens me it's the taste. Tastes so funky it almost seems like it could never recover from it even after waiting so long in the secondary. Then again I did take a sample from the bottom 1 inch from the trub! LOL. I'll see how it is in the next 2 weeks. it's chilling at 39F. When you pitched your yeasts did you use the whole 11.5grams of the S-04. Could I have over pitched? is that ever a bad thing?

From White Labs about WLP570:
"From East Flanders, versatile yeast that can produce light Belgian ales to high gravity Belgian beers (12% ABV). A combination of fruitiness and phenolic characteristics dominate the flavor profile. Some sulfur is produced during fermentation, which will dissipate following the end of fermentation."

You're getting the sulfur they're describing. Maybe it's a product of low fermentation temp? It should age out.

 

[jkarp]

I've got this beer going into the upcoming Biere de Rock competition. Should be interesting...

 

[Retroviridae]

Hi jkarp or anyone else who has brewed a recipe like this one,

I just brewed a version of your Pink Elephant recipe. This is the highest gravity beer I've made so far. I scaled it to 5 gal and substituted in some pilsener LME to make a partial mash version. Before my regular sparge, I did a small sparge with ~150F water into preheated dissolved LME. This way the LME gets "mashed" a little more to make it more fermentable - I think the Jamil Show postcast on Saisons suggests doing this to make the extract more fermentable.
I pitched 1/2 of a washed Wy1388 yeast cake from a low-gravity belgian ale and added a packet of S-04. It fermented explosively for a few days. A thermometer on the outside of the carboy was reading 85F. After a week and a half, it's now at 1.02 and going very slowly.

So here's my question: The warm hydrometer sample tasted pretty bad with solvent-like alcohol and esters. How does this compare with your experience? Am I being impatient and just need to wait for it to condition longer, or do you think I might have over-pitched and fermented too fast/warm due to pitching 1/2 washed yeast cake in addition to the S-04?

 

[jkarp]

Let it ride. Green Belgians taste exactly like that. It really took a good 2 months of conditioning for my Pink Elephant to hit its peak.

 

[Retroviridae]

Well, you're right, after a month in primary the boozy alcohol flavor and solventy esters have dissipated. It tastes good , except...

... the fermentation has stalled at 1.018 and tastes clearly too sweet.

I've tried all the typical recommendations for restarting stuck fermentations (swirling to resuspend yeast, warming, etc. - believe me, I know, I had to coax my picky saison yeast to finish). But nothing seems to help.

I mashed low, even additionally "mashed" the extract I used for increased fermentability, and used a ton of sucrose, so I think its the yeast and not that the wort is less-fermentable.

I've seen other threads, and even Wyeast's or White Lab's website, say that it's good to add sugars gradually during the ferment instead of all at the beginning. Theoretically, the yeasts will adapt to simpler sugars and won't finish the more complex sugars of the mash, or something like that. Maybe I'll try that next time.

I can't stand sickly sweet high-gravity beers, to I'm going to try finishing it with champagne yeast.

I bought two 5g sachets of Lalvin EC-1118. Following the advice of another thread around here, I plan to make a starter and gradually add more of my unfinished beer to get the yeast accustomed to alcohol and the sugar profile of my unfinished beer. I hope this will shave 10 points off my FG. I hope.

 

[markhagan]

I love this beer! I have brewed this recipe twice now:

The first time, I forgot to add the dry yeast! It happens. The smell was 100% DT. It lacked the complexity of DT, but was still awesome.

The second one is still warm conditioning (another 10 days from today). I used my kegerator and lagered it in the keg. It is spring now, so finding 76-78 deg was tricky: The keg is sitting behind my server rack where it stays 77-79 throughout the day.

This was my first attempt to warm condition in a keg. Any reasons NOT to do this or am I all good?

 

[wgentzel]

Quick question, I am wondering why it's only a week in the primary and then lagering right after that? I noticed someone else on here left it in the primary for 5 weeks, how did that one turn out? I thought that leaving it in primary longer was good because it allows the yeast to clean up byproducts that might impart off flavors.

Also, for the lagering. Does lagering serve any purpose other than improving clarity? Would it be better for me to primary for about 3, then lager for about 2 weeks and then keg it?

 

[jamiecady]

When scaling up to a 5 gal batch, will the yeast be fine to keep the same? A 1L starter of the WhiteLabs and the dry yeast should be good, correct?

 

[jkarp]

Quick question, I am wondering why it's only a week in the primary and then lagering right after that? I noticed someone else on here left it in the primary for 5 weeks, how did that one turn out? I thought that leaving it in primary longer was good because it allows the yeast to clean up byproducts that might impart off flavors.

Also, for the lagering. Does lagering serve any purpose other than improving clarity? Would it be better for me to primary for about 3, then lager for about 2 weeks and then keg it?

Well, a double pitch, plus the fact that Belgian yeasts work quick means a week is usually plenty, but a gravity check is always prudent. The byproducts and "off" flavors of Belgian yeasts are actually desirable in these beers.

Clarity is indeed the primary reason for lagering. These yeasts are pretty low floc and DT is normally pretty clear in the bottle.

 

[jkarp]

When scaling up to a 5 gal batch, will the yeast be fine to keep the same? A 1L starter of the WhiteLabs and the dry yeast should be good, correct?

I'd think with the double pitch, there's still PLENTY of yeast for 5 gal.

 

[Hound_Dog]

I brewed this over Thanksgiving weekend, and just tried it last week. It is fantastic. Nice smooth drinking beer with a mild spicy flavor. It has been a big hit with the visitors this past weekend.

 

[HuRRiC4Ne]

I'm making this right now, but I went with a extract recipe instead and 5 gallons batch. I will share my recipe and update as follows.

1 liter yeast starter (24hours time, with 1 cup of boiled DME and 4 cups of water for a OG of 1040)
Yeast starter notes: don't use normal sugar, use the DME (Dry Malt Extract) so the yeast can train it's self to break down more advance sugars instead of simple sugars.
Yeast: WLP570 & S-04
Original Gravity: 1.073
Final Gravity: 1.012
Boiling Time (Minutes): 60
Primary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 7 (see notes)
Secondary Fermentation (# of Days & Temp): 14 @ 32 deg

Ingredients
-----------
6.6 lbs LME light Pilsen (two cans)
1 lbs of DME light pilsen
1.75lbs of beet surgar

Styrian Golding 2.0 oz, Pellet, 60 minutes
Saaz 1.0 oz, Pellet, 15 minutes
Coriander Seed 10 grams, Spice, 15 min
Ginger 4.0 grams, Spice, 15 min
Paradise 4.0 grams, Spice, 15 min
1tsb irish mosh 15min
yeast energizer 15min
yeast nutrient 15min

10 drops of anti foam agent
heavy aerate in fermenter

Instructions, bring to a fullboil, then start 60min timer then hold temp at around 200f to 215f for 60mins.

I'm currently at day 4 with this, so i will keep everyone updated. It OG'ed right at 1.072... I'm really hoping i can get this thing to get down to 1.006 in 7 days... I took the preparations for it to achieve that, for one. I had a massive yeast starter, gave it yeast energizer and nutrient then gave it a nice aerate on the wort before pitching. And all i have to say is WOW! this thing was fermenting like crazy for day 1, 2 and 3... It just started to die down, now i need to achieve the 1.006 FG to get 8.66%abv. We'll see what happens... But I think hitting that FG is crucial in 7 days then put it in lager mode for the 14 days followed by bottling/warm conditioning then kegging.

Notes:
Day1 to 3 no gravity rating, but this thing is GETTING SOME!
Day4: Gravity of 1.017@68f
Day5: Gravity of 1.016@68f
Day6: Gravity of 1.012@80f (I got a space heater and made a small boxed off area and heated the area around 80f til the beer got around 80f to 82f to hit the start preping for last FG points)
Day7: 1.012@70
Day8: 1.012@60f (I'm having trouble getting any lower... I'm going to wait a few more days, it's fermenting very slow right now)
Day9: I went and racked it in the carboy today then off to the fridge for lagering, It was pretty much done at 1.012. Ohh well, still good. It should be around 8%abv.
Day10: Clearing up in the fridge, you can almost see two separate layers now.
Day20: Racked into Corney keg and put on Co2
Day23: Starting to taste like a belgian trippel...
Day31: Drank this last night, amazing! And i'm sure it will only get better with time... funny thing is, I don't think it will last long!

Planned brewing schedule:
Day 1 to 7; hitting gravity of 1.006, using heat to around 82f during the last two days to get the FG.
Day7 to 21; Rerack into carboy, Cold condition lagering @32f to 40f in kegerator
Day22 to 36 Rerack into new carboy and let sit for one to two weeks of aging or bottle...
Then Keg for a few days and drink!!!

Day27ish pic

 

[jkarp]

Nice HuRRiC4Ne. Keep it warm to get those last gravity points you're looking for.

 

[HuRRiC4Ne]

Nice HuRRiC4Ne. Keep it warm to get those last gravity points you're looking for.

Thanks for the reminder, I will put it by a heating duct when I get home tonight

 

[HuRRiC4Ne]

I'm pretty much stuck at 1.012... It' won't go any lower, I think it may be from the extract recipe? Maybe the only way to attenuate that low is to follow the all grain time schedule?

I'm going to give it a few more days. I gave it some nutrient and energizer the other day, so i'm hoping its slowly fermenting out... We'll see...

 

[jkarp]

How's it taste? 1.012 is pretty damn good for extract...

 

[HuRRiC4Ne]

I didn't taste it yet, I will try it out tonight when I get home... I'm going to start the lager cycle tonight when I get home if it appears to be done. It seemed like it was slowly going this morning.

 

[HuRRiC4Ne]

I'm thinking about adding .75lbs more of beet sugar, that should OG at 1.078 and give me my 8.66%... thoughts? Or should I just leave it? I love stronger beers, so i'm tempted to...

Update: I just called it a day and carboyed it and threw it in the fridge at day9 with a FG of 1.012