Phenolic smell?

[merline]

Hi,
I like to brew Belgians (mostly high gravity) ales. But I also brew Hefeweizens, IIPAs, etc. Recently I've been getting better at letting the Belgians ferment at a bit higher temps after the first couple days. My latest attempt was simple: 85% pilsner and 15% cane sugar (added after a few days of fermenting). After 2 days of active fermentation (Wyeast 3942) I let the temp rise naturally. It got to around 75-77 degrees. Smelled great too. When I bottled, it still smelled great with a good amount of that Belgian fruitiness.

I tasted a bottle a little early (with full knowledge it wouldn't be carbed much). I was surprised in that the beer had a strong phenolic smell - not the good phenolics like clove but more of a medicinal smell. I don't get that with my other beers so I didn't think it could be chlorine/chloramine in the water (I just use tap water). I add some pH stabilizer in the sparge water so the pH is kept low. But no other water additions.

Could the medicinal smell be more pronounced due to the Belgian yeast at an elevated fermentation temp? If so, then maybe I should start using campden tabs?

Many thanks for the analysis and advice,
-Ellis (Raleigh, NC, USA)

 

[beeber]

What was the alcohol content? It sounds to me like this beer will need some age. It may mellow out.

 

[lititzbrew]

Hi,
I like to brew Belgians (mostly high gravity) ales. But I also brew Hefeweizens, IIPAs, etc. Recently I've been getting better at letting the Belgians ferment at a bit higher temps after the first couple days. My latest attempt was simple: 85% pilsner and 15% cane sugar (added after a few days of fermenting). After 2 days of active fermentation (Wyeast 3942) I let the temp rise naturally. It got to around 75-77 degrees. Smelled great too. When I bottled, it still smelled great with a good amount of that Belgian fruitiness.

I tasted a bottle a little early (with full knowledge it wouldn't be carbed much). I was surprised in that the beer had a strong phenolic smell - not the good phenolics like clove but more of a medicinal smell. I don't get that with my other beers so I didn't think it could be chlorine/chloramine in the water (I just use tap water). I add some pH stabilizer in the sparge water so the pH is kept low. But no other water additions.

Could the medicinal smell be more pronounced due to the Belgian yeast at an elevated fermentation temp? If so, then maybe I should start using campden tabs?

Many thanks for the analysis and advice,
-Ellis (Raleigh, NC, USA)

Did you taste it before bottling? What did you use to sanitize the bottles? I once had an issue when I used (too much) Iodine to sanitize my bottles and got that phenolic smell like you describe. I didn't let them dry so I added a little bit of Iodine to every one of my bottles!

 

[merline]

Thanks for the quick replies! I know this one will take alot of time to mellow out - it's ~10%abv. But I wanted a taste since the pre-bottling small taste was so good. I use Starsan to sanitize. Thanks again.

 

[merline]

I guess to distill this down (ha ha), my question is: if cloramine in the water is causing the phenolic smell, could it be more intense with Belgian yeast then with, for example, US-05?

 

[lititzbrew]

I think if you used US-05 you wouldn't have had this issue but I highly doubt it has anything to do with cloramine in your water. A high fermentation temperature with a yeast that has a phenolic trait is most likely your issue. Belgian yeast fermented too warm can get lots of phenols. I'm going to say that your yeast is the culprit here and not your water.

 

[merline]

Thanks for the reply. Interestingly, I was under the impression that you need the higher temps with Belgian yeast in order to attain that nice fruitiness which is a characteristic of Belgian ales. I have a lot to learn (which is good).

 

[Yooper]

Thanks for the reply. Interestingly, I was under the impression that you need the higher temps with Belgian yeast in order to attain that nice fruitiness which is a characteristic of Belgian ales. I have a lot to learn (which is good).

It really depends on the yeast strain, but most Belgian strains still need temperature control, at least for the first few days but many do fine up to 75 degree.

Here's the info on the yeast strain you used:
YEAST STRAIN: 3942 | Belgian Wheat™

Back to Yeast Strain List

Isolated from a small Belgian brewery, this strain produces beers with moderate esters and minimal phenolics. Apple, bubblegum and plum-like aromas blend nicely with malt and hops. This strain will finish dry with a hint of tartness.

Origin:
Flocculation: medium
Attenuation: 72-76%
Temperature Range: 64-74° F (18-23° C)
Alcohol Tolerance: approximately 12% ABV
Styles:
Belgian Pale Ale
Belgian Tripel
Witbier

____________________________________________

The description does say "minimal phenolics", so that makes me think that stressed yeast is a factor in the phenolic beer you have. I wonder if it's something as simple as underpitching? How many packages of yeast did you use, and what was the OG of the beer?

 

[merline]

Regarding the yeast, it was a 1 liter starter (one smackpack). My volume into the fermentor was 2.5g (half batch). And the OG not counting sugar was 1.076. Over several days, I added a total of 1lb cane sugar. I'm starting to think maybe the temp is at least in part the issue - it got up to the upper 70s. But the offsmell (in my opinion) reminds me of chloroseptic mouthwash. .

 

[duboman]

1lb of sugar into a 2.5 gallon batch could also be a contributing factor, kind of like rocket fuel


Sent from the Commune

 

[merline]

That's what I get for reading "Brew Like a Monk"! In that book it's stated that American brewers are afraid to use enough sugar. I do keep it at ~15% or less. I suppose I'll try eliminating the chlorine next time and see if that eliminates the off-flavor. Only other thing I can think of is the dreaded fear of infection.