pH Meter Calibration

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DOH! Apologies for the stupid link trick (fixed).
This three solution kit is what I've been buying...

Cheers!

Thanks. Do you actually use the pH 10 buffer? That one is perishable; it's a carbonate/bicarbonate buffer and readily absorbs CO2 from the air.

If you need a high-pH buffer, you can make your own 9.18 solution from borax and distilled water (1.9 grams per 500ml of water) and mix it fresh every time.

I'll order the Biopharm 7 and 4 buffers, and just do a 1-point calibration this weekend while I'm learning to use my new toy. :ban:
 
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Sorry, I totally missed the above post & question way back in October.
If @z-bob is still around...the answer is one of my meters (Hanna phep 98128) doesn't support 3 point calibration so for that one I only use the 10 to check the high end of the meter's scope. My other meter (Hach PP+) does support 3 point and I do use the 10 solution for that meter just on GPs.

Speaking of which...I went to calibrate my Hach last night and it was stuck on ~4.53 no matter what I dipped it in.
Finally took an actually look at the sensor...

hached!.jpg


Yeah, I don't think that's gonna ever cal again ;)

Don't know how I managed that - I'm a hard-core tool guy across numerous disciplines and take care of my stuff. I even use a Fluke IR gun before sticking a pH meter in anything if there's any chance of over-temperature exposure (cheap insurance) and yet this barely two year old probe went to Meter Heaven the hard way...

Cheers!
 
My other meter (Hach PP+) does support 3 point and I do use the 10 solution for that meter just on GPs.
Don't know what GP's are. I'll point out, though, that your meter assumes linearity between buffers so that, for example, if you are checking mash pH there is no point in calibrating against the 10 buffer. Calibration data derived from 10 buffer are used only for measurements between 7 and 10 pH.
 
"General Principle"
I use my pH meters for more than brewing, so knowing that a meter's scope is accurate at testable points is reassuring...

Cheers!
 
I got a nice scare when an allegedly brand new replacement sensor for my PP+ arrived direct from Hach's Amazon presence - with a reactive slope that was roughly 1/∞. So slow it couldn't really be calibrated as the reading wouldn't get with .5 of any sample. Eventually I tried accepting the readings anyway, but when the cal routine ended the meter immediately started flashing the "SENSOR?" error.

FML, I thought whatever took out the original sensor took out the meter as well! I tried using the Hach probe cleaner but even with a 2 hour soak there was no change in behavior. Sat down and had a beer while pondering what just happened, and realized it had to be a defective sensor, so I boxed the probe back up and went through the AMZN replace & return sequence.

Two days later the replacement for the replacement showed up and this one is perfect. And wicked fast - switching samples through the cal routine it was already reading within a few hundredths of the next sample before I had the cap back on the bottle. It's actually faster than the original probe ever was.

So the $75 ***** slap wasn't without a small bonus...

Cheers!
 
I tried calibrating my Hach pH meter today and was surprised to find that even after multiple calibrations, it's still not reading the 4.1 sample correctly...it's reading around 3.95 or so. It reads the 7 solution just fine.

This pH meter is less than a year old and has been reliable up until recently. I just so happen to have another brand new Hach (long story) so I decided to give that a spin...same result.

Could my 4.1 solution be bad? I did just get new bottles.
 
It doesn't matter if the buffer is bad. The meter thinks it is at 4.01 and adjusts slope and offset so that it reads 4.01 initially even if the pH is, in fact, 3.95 (which, for a buffer labeled 4.01 ± 0.02, it could be). Initially is in bold for a reason. Intitially your meter thought the pH of the buffer was 4.01. It doesn't now. It thinks it is 3.95. Thus represents a drift of 0.06 pH in however long it was between the time you calibrated and the time you rechecked the buffer. Read the pH calibration Sticky in this forum and carry out the stability check described there.

Now the fact that two meters behave in exactly the same way is unlikely. That doesn't mean it can't happen - just that it happens rarely. A new meter will often exhibit strange behaviour on the day it is commissioned but should settle in quickly after that. The stability test is designed to help you diagnose problems like this. Try it and let us know what happens.
 
I thought it should read 4.01 even if solution was bad but then I'm really confused...both of my meters and now a buddy of mine's meter (same model) are all reading the same after a fresh calibration. So that's 3 different hach meters reading 3.95 after calibrating with that same solution to 4.01. All at ~72F.

I have done the stability test on main hach a few months ago and it was rock solid...the problem with testing it now is it fails the very first test seconds after calibrating it so is it even worth doing the subsequent tests.
 
This is getting weirder. Yes, it is still worthwhile to leave the meter in the buffer and observe what goes on over a few minutes time. If it stays steady at 3.95 then the electrode is stable. You just didn't wait long enough before accepting the cal reading. Be sure to monitor that when you do calibrations and be sure the reading is stable before pressing the button to accept it. With a new meter it should be pretty stable after 30 seconds but even with a new meter it is worth while to wait a further minute or even 2 before accepting cal.
 
Hopefully, I will be receiving some hop plants soon that will be planted in 10 gallon grow bags using Kellogg Raised Bedding Soil that has a pH range of 5.8-7.5. I want to measure the pH using my Milwaukee MW102 but I want to make sure if that is advisable.

I plan on taking eight tablespoons of dirt and put it in a beaker. Then I was going to add eight tablespoons of irrigation water and mix it with the soil for a couple of minutes and then let it rest for 15 minutes, then stir again and let the soil settle. Once the soil settles, I was then going take a measurement reading of the liquid only so as not to scratch or damage the probe.

Is my process correct? Will that process damage the probe?
 
For best results, distilled - or at least low TDS RO water - will produce the highest fidelity results.

fwiw, I check the pH of our veggie garden three times each year to keep up with the tendency to go acidic. I scoop up tablespoon samples from five spots (corners and middle), mix them together, then pull two tablespoons of the mix, add it to two tablespoons of RO water (tds under 10) in a small screw top container, shake it up, let it sit for five minutes, then dip the meter in...

Cheers!
 
Not at all. If the TDS is very low there's so little behind that pH reading it will be easily shifted.
Indeed, if you leave your RO water sitting out its pH it will gradually drop as it absorbs CO2. I often find my RO water reading in the low 6s.

It's the ionic content you're trying to avoid, not the intrinsic pH...

Cheers!
 
Yes, that intrinsic pH value of the RO water has little effect when its mixed with the soil matrix. The TDS of RO water should be low enough to substitute for distilled water.
 
I don't brew beer (sounds like great fun but I can't start a new hobby). I just read this whole thread to get a better understanding of how to choose and use a pH meter for potted plants.

If it's not too late, I would very strongly recommend that you do NOT use any type of "bedding" soil, top soil, or garden soil in a pot or grow bag. You want to use a soilless medium (although it might be labled as potting "soil" and it will look like what most people think of as soil). Bedding soil, top soil, etc. have absolutely the wrong drainage and water retention characteristics for a potted (or bagged) plant of any sort. They will drown the roots with too much water and too little oxygen, taking too long to dry out between waterings. Even pre-packaged potting "soil" is virtually always far too water retentive and slow draining and, thus, does not allow enough oxygen to the roots for ideal plant growth, but it will do much better than bedding soil.

To keep things simple, I would suggest high quality potting soil such as Pro Mix or Fox Farm. If you want to go a step further, add around 20-40% perlite by volume (depending on how hot and dry your climate is). Even that "recipe" leaves much to be desired, but it will be vastly better in a grow bag than bedding soil.

To answer your question, for plants in containers (pots, bags, etc.) with soilless media, it's typically more useful to pay attention to the pH of your irrigation water/ fertigation solution than the media itself (assuming you start out with a reasonable pH, which the above suggestions will). Controlling the pH of container media can be very difficult, and unnecessary when you irrigate/ fertigate within the correct range. However, if you want to get an idea of the media pH, the best approximation you can get at home is probably with the pour-through method, not by shaking up a sample of the soil/media in water: www.css.cornell.edu/courses/260/Media%20testing.pdf

Keep in mind that most plants will want to be around a full pH unit lower when grown in containers with soil-less media vs. soil. So, hops like soil at pH 6-7 but in soilless media, they'll do better in the range of 5-6 (FYI, growing in containers is equivalent to hydroponics if you're using soilless media, which includes peat-based "potting soil", so any recommendation for pH in hydroponics would be applicable). On the other hand, if you're planning to grow organically with a living soil, ignore everything I just wrote. However, successfully growing with a living soil in a pot is a far bigger challenge than most people realize. I suggest you stick with "synthetic" fertilizers if you don't have any expertise in organic container gardening.

Finally, keep in mind that the range of pH at which plants take up each essential nutrient varies, so there's no single ideal pH. For example, a plant may take up Mn at pH 5-5.75 but the same plant may take up Ca at 6-7.5, so there's no pH at which it readily takes up both Mn and Ca. The ideal is to let your pH vary throughout the preferred range to ensure the plant will be able to uptake everything it needs.

Hopefully, I will be receiving some hop plants soon that will be planted in 10 gallon grow bags using Kellogg Raised Bedding Soil that has a pH range of 5.8-7.5. I want to measure the pH using my Milwaukee MW102 but I want to make sure if that is advisable.

I plan on taking eight tablespoons of dirt and put it in a beaker. Then I was going to add eight tablespoons of irrigation water and mix it with the soil for a couple of minutes and then let it rest for 15 minutes, then stir again and let the soil settle. Once the soil settles, I was then going take a measurement reading of the liquid only so as not to scratch or damage the probe.

Is my process correct? Will that process damage the probe?
 
I appreciate your post, thank you. I ended up using roughly 80% of this Kellogg Garden Organics 3 cu. ft. Raised Bed and Potting Mix Premium Outdoor Container Mix-649 - The Home Depot along with roughly 15% of desert dirt and 2" of my compost soil on top. Supposedly, the raised bedding mix contained sand.

I transplanted the four hop plants into 15 gallon grow bags almost two weeks ago and they have been really taking off. Even the one worse looking plant is now looking a lot better.

Since we are experience 100F+ weather here, my watering schedule has changed to about every 18-20 hours. You make a good point about my water's pH which is 6.9.

Thanks again!
 
I jus hope no one is trying to measure the pH of their tap water and think that the measurement is accurate.
 
I jus hope no one is trying to measure the pH of their tap water and think that the measurement is accurate.

Although tap water pH is basically irrelevant in regard to mash pH, I'll bite. Why?
 
Although tap water pH is basically irrelevant in regard to mash pH, I'll bite. Why?

I'm not the one who asked of it, and my answer may indeed differ, but pH meters are at their least accurate and most sluggish when measuring near or right at waters neutral pH point. And particularly more so if the water is deionized or distilled or good RO.
 
I'm not the one who asked of it, and my answer may indeed differ, but pH meters are at their least accurate and most sluggish when measuring near or right at waters neutral pH point. And particularly more so if the water is deionized or distilled or good RO.

I have noted this with distilled water. But with (my) tap water, I have not. It agrees very well with water reports. I would assume the phenomenon varies with TDS/conductivity.
 
I would assume the phenomenon varies with TDS/conductivity.

That matches my assumption. pH meters have little trouble with pH 7.01 buffers for example. I've never ran a conductivity test on such a buffer, but it is likely well up there in TDS.
 
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