Oktoberfest - How long necessary to lager?

[bassballboy]

I'm going to brew a variation of Biermuncher's Octoberfast on Friday, and I'm debating between lagering and using ale yeast. *I have the capability to lager via a fermentation chamber, the real debate is timing. *I know that a traditional Oktoberfest is supposed to age for multiple months, but I want this beer ready for, well, October. *In theory, brewing this weekend would give me about 5 weeks for aging between the primary and secondary (however that should be split).

Is this enough time to lager it, or should I go the route of using Ale yeast instead?

 

[corkybstewart]

5 weeks is plenty.

 

[twistr25]

I'm going to brew a variation of Biermuncher's Octoberfast on Friday, and I'm debating between lagering and using ale yeast. *I have the capability to lager via a fermentation chamber, the real debate is timing. *I know that a traditional Oktoberfest is supposed to age for multiple months, but I want this beer ready for, well, October. *In theory, brewing this weekend would give me about 5 weeks for aging between the primary and secondary (however that should be split).

Is this enough time to lager it, or should I go the route of using Ale yeast instead?

If you mean 5 weeks total I think you may be a little short. If you have really good temp control, I would check your FG after a week, and if you're good then go ahead and move to lager. Three weeks will be close if you do a two week primary.

 

[bassballboy]

In theory, primary for 10 days @ 50°, then in the secondary at lagering temps for 3.5 weeks, and then bottle aging for 3 weeks should be good to go?

 

[JimRausch]

In theory, primary for 10 days @ 50°, then in the secondary at lagering temps for 3.5 weeks, and then bottle aging for 3 weeks should be good to go?

The yeasties don't read and will do whatever they want, so 10 days in primary may not be long enough. Serial stable SGs will be the only way to know if you are at FG.
Good luck!

 

[BigFloyd]

You may also need to allow a few days in there for a d-rest (around 60-62*F). Unless, that is, you want your Oktoberfest to taste like movie popcorn butter.

 

[freisste]

You may also need to allow a few days in there for a d-rest (around 60-62*F). Unless, that is, you want your Oktoberfest to taste like movie popcorn butter.

+1. Taste for diacetyl after a few days. If there is some and you are approaching your target FG (say 75-80% of the way), warm it up to finish fermentation for a d-rest. Let if finish there and cool to your lagering temp.

 

[W0rthog]

It's my understanding that the reason for long traditional lagering was due to a lot of beer being brewed in March (before it got hot outside) and held in Kegs all summer. When Oktober rolled around, they needed to clear out their kegs, so they held big festivals.

The lagering period depends on the mash method, gravity of cooled wort and primary time/temp.

In general: Based on "New Brewing Lager Beer" by Greg J. Noonan
Light beers and beers from decotion can range from 3-12 days. Very strong beer can be lagered for 6 to 8 months.

 

[bassballboy]

+1. Taste for diacetyl after a few days. If there is some and you are approaching your target FG (say 75-80% of the way), warm it up to finish fermentation for a d-rest. Let if finish there and cool to your lagering temp.

I was planning on using this methodology:
http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-2-How-to-Lager_ep_57-1.html

I'm using Wyeast 2633 Octoberfest Lager, so I plan to do a large starter, then ferment at 50*, after that's done jump it to 62* for 2 days, then lager at 35* for the remaining time left in the 5 weeks. That sound correct?


Also, I'll be bottling via priming sugar - no force carbing. Will lagering make it so the bottle take a long time to get correct carbonation?

 

[freisste]

I was planning on using this methodology:
http://www.homebrewing.org/Lagering--Chapter-2-How-to-Lager_ep_57-1.html

I'm using Wyeast 2633 Octoberfest Lager, so I plan to do a large starter, then ferment at 50*, after that's done jump it to 62* for 2 days, then lager at 35* for the remaining time left in the 5 weeks. That sound correct?

Also, I'll be bottling via priming sugar - no force carbing. Will lagering make it so the bottle take a long time to get correct carbonation?

You say "after that's done" where 'that' is fermentation. Keep in mind that you need active yeast for a cleanup (or else it DOES take a LONG time to clean up the diacetyl). So if you catch the yeast as they finish eating sugar, you are good. Most people try to catch the yeast at 75-80% to make sure they don't miss it.

For bottle conditioning after lagering, give yourself a little extra time but there will still be enough yeast.

 

[mysteryshrimp]

My method for quick lagers:


In the boil, add irish moss or whirlflock and count on leaving a full gallon in your pot. You want your wort clear to start with. Virtually no break goes into primary.

Ferment with Wyeast 2124 at 62 for about two weeks. When the airlock bubbles at 4/minute, raise temp to about 66 and hold it for two days after bubbles slow to a crawl.

Add gelatin and hold for 12 hours or so.

Cold crash in the fridge for as long as you can. Two weeks before you want to drink it, hydrate a highly flocculant yeast and reinoculate in the bottling bucket.

What I sometimes do is split the batch and drink some early and truly lager the rest.

 

[freisste]

My method for quick lagers:

In the boil, add irish moss or whirlflock and count on leaving a full gallon in your pot. You want your wort clear to start with. Virtually no break goes into primary.

Ferment with Wyeast 2124 at 62 for about two weeks. When the airlock bubbles at 4/minute, raise temp to about 66 and hold it for two days after bubbles slow to a crawl.

Add gelatin and hold for 12 hours or so.

Cold crash in the fridge for as long as you can. Two weeks before you want to drink it, hydrate a highly flocculant yeast and reinoculate in the bottling bucket.

What I sometimes do is split the batch and drink some early and truly lager the rest.

Is your ferment temp a typo? 62 seems pretty warm...

 

[mysteryshrimp]

2124 can be used pretty warm for lagers. It's the main reason why it's my house yeast for lagers. It can be used in the normal lager way, or it can be used at low ale temps. Very versatile lager yeast.

 

[BigFloyd]

WY2124 Bohemian Lager is my house lager strain. It can produce some excellent lagers. If used in the 60's, it can ferment a California "steam beer".

I like to use it at 48*F, let it come up to 50-51*F after about 4 days and then (on around day 8-10 when it hits 85% or so) go up to 61*F for 3 days of d-rest. Cold crash it a week, rack over to a keg, gel it and cold condition 6+ weeks (depending on when a keezer tap becomes vacant).

 

[mysteryshrimp]

In the low 60s it won't be quite as clean as a real lager should be, but it's still a lot more lager-like beer than an ale version of a lager. If you can get it down to 60 or 62 it will be hard to tell in the finished product that anything is off, especially in an amber or darker. I've put a traditional bock in competition that was grain-to-glass (and bottle conditioned) in 30 days using this method and there was nothing on the sheet about esters or off flavors. There were no fermentation issues detectable.

I haven't tried it above 62, though. It might start throwing off esters in the mid 60s.

If I have the fridge space, don't need it within 6 weeks, or make a light lager, I do it "properly". If I want a "lager" but don't have the space or time, this is a viable substitute.