Northern Brewer - Buyer Beware

[wepeeler]

So use if for something nice that you can wait a month to get.

I have a difficult time with patience during fermentation, let alone waiting for ingredients to arrive lol.

 

[PCABrewing]

I was about to hit Send and I just thought of this; they might have tried to implement just-in-time inventory with little or no warehousing, and that doesn't work when supply chains are disrupted. But you'd think they'd have figured that out by now

NB did not cite Supply Chain as a reason for my order delay.
They only said labor was an issue.
The reason I messaged them was to ascertain if the delay was a back-order. They said no.

 

[PCABrewing]

I don’t doubt nor disagree with the labor situation, and everyone here has made good points. Personally, I switched jobs from a high-demand trades job to a counter job at a heavy equipment rental place in large part because of the wages and part due to the physical demands of the work.

I don’t blame anyone for making a move out of necessity in today’s economy. To the point of some in this thread, my new employer wanted to match my pay after I explicitly said I didn’t want to make a lateral move in my interview. I negotiated a better rate, but the fact that they didn’t want to pay me says more about the state of employer pay on a larger scale than it does about a single employer. My boss didn’t want to pay me because it took off of her bottom line and therefore her commissions.

Point is, it’s hard to find good people who WANT to work. When you do, PAY THEM. Granted, this may not be NB’s issue, but if it’s the same excuse they’ve been using, then something needs to change.

I made the switch from a skilled trade job to corporate America many years ago. Reason initially was being fed-up with the BS.
Turns out the new role(s) in corporate were even more BS but they paid me well enough to tolerate it.
Eventually the needs evolved and thus the jobs changed as well. But if I wanted to stay gainfully employed I evolved.
But I never did, and still don't think I was under-paid in the blue-collar role. I just developed newer and more valuable skills as needed and qualified for better pay.
Today it seems the labor force wants a job they can do from home that pays enough to buy the latest hi-tech gadgets.
Problem is workers need to show extraordinary value to get extraordinary salary.
Were in a time of change for labor and it is going to get worse before it gets better.

 

[NobleNewt]

I made the switch from a skilled trade job to corporate America many years ago. Reason initially was being fed-up with the BS.
Turns out the new role(s) in corporate were even more BS but they paid me well enough to tolerate it.
Eventually the needs evolved and thus the jobs changed as well. But if I wanted to stay gainfully employed I evolved.
But I never did, and still don't think I was under-paid in the blue-collar role. I just developed newer and more valuable skills as needed and qualified for better pay.
Today it seems the labor force wants a job they can do from home that pays enough to buy the latest hi-tech gadgets.
Problem is workers need to show extraordinary value to get extraordinary salary.
Were in a time of change for labor and it is going to get worse before it gets better.

I hear ya. I don’t think I was underpaid in HVAC, but my pay rate hadn’t changed in nearly 3 years which included this most recent round of inflation. Our profit margins (in dollars) were higher and higher with the increased cost of equipment and supplies, but none of that ever reached the employees.

My wife and I live a frugal, conservative lifestyle and it was getting hard to buy groceries with both of us working full-time. That, and as an MBA, I was WAY overqualified to be an HVAC technician despite some of the backend business stuff I did.

All to say, you’re right. People wanna work from home and earn big bucks, but those jobs are few and far between (I tried). I’m glad I made the move I did when I did. It’s been good so far, and I get to use the skills I learned to be useful around the machines I work around now.

 

[NobleNewt]

Just an update for all of you following along.. I ordered from MoreBeer Saturday, and got an email a little bit ago saying my order has shipped! Even if it gets here Thursday or Friday, I’m still brewing this weekend.

NB, on the other hand, still hasn’t responded to my request to cancel my order.

 

[Teufelhunde]

Just an update for all of you following along.. I ordered from MoreBeer Saturday, and got an email a little bit ago saying my order has shipped! Even if it gets here Thursday or Friday, I’m still brewing this weekend.

NB, on the other hand, still hasn’t responded to my request to cancel my order.

Morebeer is the real deal....my go to

 

[bracconiere]

My girlfriend just got me a $150 giftcard to NB

sell it in the homebrew classifieds! lol

 

[bike2brew]

I don’t doubt nor disagree with the labor situation, and everyone here has made good points. Personally, I switched jobs from a high-demand trades job to a counter job at a heavy equipment rental place in large part because of the wages and part due to the physical demands of the work.

I don’t blame anyone for making a move out of necessity in today’s economy. To the point of some in this thread, my new employer wanted to match my pay after I explicitly said I didn’t want to make a lateral move in my interview. I negotiated a better rate, but the fact that they didn’t want to pay me says more about the state of employer pay on a larger scale than it does about a single employer. My boss didn’t want to pay me because it took off of her bottom line and therefore her commissions.

Point is, it’s hard to find good people who WANT to work. When you do, PAY THEM. Granted, this may not be NB’s issue, but if it’s the same excuse they’ve been using, then something needs to change.

Well said

 

[Whisky River]

NB did not cite Supply Chain as a reason for my order delay.
They only said labor was an issue.
The reason I messaged them was to ascertain if the delay was a back-order. They said no.

I can’t believe how they are running their business, it wouldn’t be a big deal of it was a one time thing but it’s every time. Each of the 4 orders I have placed with them have been delayed. Each time they had a different excuse.
In April 7 days to process the order, they said a machinery malfunction delayed processing grain orders. Ok seemed reasonable.
In June 11 days to process the order, they said unforeseen events brought down wharehouse operations and they were 2-3 days behind. Yeah right.
By August they didn’t even provide an explanation for 10 days to process an order for 1 piece of equipment.
This time in October after 7 days I got a response saying they were experiencing challenges and delays and were processing orders from 2 weeks ago. So there was no way I could make the brew day I had planned for 2 weeks after I placed my order. That was it for me, Missing another brew day I planned 2 weeks in advance was too much, I canceled the NB order and made it through Moorbeer. Shipped the next day and will be here before the end of the week.
Brew day saved and lesson learned.

 

[catalanotte]

I think we need a service than can walk into a LHBS, shop for someone and ship. Kind of like Instacart and Shipt combined for brewers or other specialty shops. Probably cost prohibitive, but given the dissatisfaction level with other options, who knows...

 

[wepeeler]

Placed an order last night. I text them, and let them know it's for my birthday, so maybe they'll push it through faster lol. YEAH RIGHT

*Edit - Received a text back saying it's scheduled to ship 10/17, so fingers crossed!

 

[bracconiere]

Placed an order last night. I text them, and let them know it's for my birthday, so maybe they'll push it through faster lol. YEAH RIGHT

*Edit - Received a text back saying it's scheduled to ship 10/17, so fingers crossed!

this year or next?

 

[Bobby_M]

I think we need a service than can walk into a LHBS, shop for someone and ship. Kind of like Instacart and Shipt combined for brewers or other specialty shops. Probably cost prohibitive, but given the dissatisfaction level with other options, who knows...

I can understand a need there if people were having trouble with an online retailer that has completely monopolized the homebrew supply market in the entire country. While the NB/Midwest/Austin/AiH corporate machine is pretty large, it's by no means even close to a monopoly. Either way, people need to put pressure on them until it hurts (by shopping elsewhere).

 

[bracconiere]

I think we need a service than can walk into a LHBS, shop for someone and ship. Kind of like Instacart and Shipt combined for brewers or other specialty shops. Probably cost prohibitive, but given the dissatisfaction level with other options, who knows...

shipping just 20lbs of malt cost me $80! the malt only cost me $5...

 

[seilenos]

Morebeer is the real deal....my go to

I recently forgot to add something to an order from MoreBeer and called Customer Support a few hours after I hit submit.

Not only were they able to add to the order (which is impressive given that they usually get stuff to me in two days) they also said "You didn't add the 15% off coupon we have up on our site. I put that on the order. You'll be getting a refund of $X."

Such a refreshing interaction.

 

[wepeeler]

I recently forgot to add something to an order from MoreBeer and called Customer Support a few hours after I hit submit.

Not only were they able to add to the order (which is impressive given that they usually get stuff to me in two days) they also said "You didn't add the 15% off coupon we have up on our site. I put that on the order. You'll be getting a refund of $X."

Such a refreshing interaction.

They're awesome. Sucks they don't carry Mecca Grade malt though. I've fallen in love with Mecca.

 

[Teufelhunde]

They're awesome. Sucks they don't carry Mecca Grade malt though. I've fallen in love with Mecca.

Maybe let them know how much you like it. You never know, they may look at it and decided to try carrying it and see if it sells....

 

[Dancy]

Email I received today after emailing MW yesterday to inquire about my order:

”We apologize for the delay! We have been really swamped lately, and a bit shorthanded as well, and the result is that we are running behind schedule, particularly on the grain-room orders. We're all working hard to get caught back up, and get everyone's orders out the door, as quickly as we can. I see your order is shipping today, so you'll have it tomorrow. Thanks again, have a good day! -Mike, Midwest Supplies CS”

As mentioned before, their issues have been going on for a relatively long time now so customers are losing (or have lost) their patience. I’m afraid MW and NB are causing long term damage to their business.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

... "your order is shipping today"

 

[Beermeister32]

Take a look around. Nearly every business in the country has supply chain/covid/labor shortage issues, and now we are looking at a recession, plus war in a heavy grain producing region.

These companies are distributors of what are essentially specialty “food” products from around the world if you will and low volume, hand produced brewing equipment. It should come to nobody’s surprise there are issues filling orders.

Most companies like this are run by equity managers that combine companies to make the whole machine run more efficiently or to cut internal duplication, expand supply chains, etc. similar thing happened to Cabella’s and Bass Pro Shops. They were brought together by equity managers. Then oftentimes these companies are sold off for profit by equity managers who usually plan an exit in about 5 years.

Anyway, I’d lighten up on the expectations. If these companies could sell you stuff faster, they would. We’re just going through a difficult time. It will improve at some point, just be happy you can source some of these items.

 

[wepeeler]

Take a look around. Nearly every business in the country has supply chain/covid/labor shortage issues, and now we are looking at a recession, plus war in a heavy grain producing region.

These companies are distributors of what are essentially specialty “food” products from around the world if you will and low volume, hand produced brewing equipment. It should come to nobody’s surprise there are issues filling orders.

Most companies like this are run by equity managers that combine companies to make the whole machine run more efficiently or to cut internal duplication, expand supply chains, etc. similar thing happened to Cabella’s and Bass Pro Shops. They were brought together by equity managers. Then oftentimes these companies are sold off for profit by equity managers who usually plan an exit in about 5 years.

Anyway, I’d lighten up on the expectations. If these companies could sell you stuff faster, they would. We’re just going through a difficult time. It will improve at some point, just be happy you can source some of these items.

I don't think anyone is being unreasonable by simply saying let your customers know there is a delay. Post it on your website, or at least during checkout that shipping is delayed 3-5 days or 2 weeks or whatever.

I'm in an industry that is experiencing supply chain issues, but we tell our consumers up front that your product make take 2 weeks or even longer.

 

[Steveruch]

shipping just 20lbs of malt cost me $80! the malt only cost me $5...

That's 25¢ a pound. Where is that?

 

[NobleNewt]

Take a look around. Nearly every business in the country has supply chain/covid/labor shortage issues, and now we are looking at a recession, plus war in a heavy grain producing region.

These companies are distributors of what are essentially specialty “food” products from around the world if you will and low volume, hand produced brewing equipment. It should come to nobody’s surprise there are issues filling orders.

Most companies like this are run by equity managers that combine companies to make the whole machine run more efficiently or to cut internal duplication, expand supply chains, etc. similar thing happened to Cabella’s and Bass Pro Shops. They were brought together by equity managers. Then oftentimes these companies are sold off for profit by equity managers who usually plan an exit in about 5 years.

Anyway, I’d lighten up on the expectations. If these companies could sell you stuff faster, they would. We’re just going through a difficult time. It will improve at some point, just be happy you can source some of these items.

I agree with your first 3 paragraphs, but dispute the last one. I can understand if NB doesn’t have malt or other agricultural supplies or if they’re stricken by other supply chain issues, but the fact that any of us can place an order through MoreBeer, Ritebrew, or any number of online suppliers and get our order within 3 business days kinda kills that argument.

I’ll temper my expectations when these shortages actually hit (they’re coming without a doubt), but IMO NB has had ample time to work out their warehouse and logistics issues. Everyone else can handle it, why can’t they?

 

[bracconiere]

That's 25¢ a pound. Where is that?

well they doubled the price of barley on me from $13 a 50lb sack, to $23...so it's like 48c a pound now...

i've been malting my own barley since 2016, right after inbev bought NB. i thought it'd be a good idea to start.

 

[Beermeister32]

I agree with your first 3 paragraphs, but dispute the last one. I can understand if NB doesn’t have malt or other agricultural supplies or if they’re stricken by other supply chain issues, but the fact that any of us can place an order through MoreBeer, Ritebrew, or any number of online suppliers and get our order within 3 business days kinda kills that argument.

I’ll temper my expectations when these shortages actually hit (they’re coming without a doubt), but IMO NB has had ample time to work out their warehouse and logistics issues. Everyone else can handle it, why can’t they?

I'd take issue there. In the construction and manufacturing, and chemical industries we have been plagued by shortages, delays and unknown availability of every chemical, materials, manufactured item and supply you can think of. Year number 2 of this now. Major players (and I mean major Fortune 500 companies) can't tell you when it will level off and most manufacturers I'm aware of have pulled guidance for the year and well into the future. I'm not sure that you can place all this blame on one distributor, they are getting supplies from all sorts of sources, some come in some do not.

It's so easy to hop on here and shoot off big negative opinions about this or that when there are so many factors at play. Most of the business people I work with are doing everything possible to fulfill products, or substitute products in every industry you can think of. This morning I pulled the trigger on a truckload of substitute materials as our regular supplier is out for weeks. This really needs to be a big picture view, if you want to come down and start bagging on specific companies, I guess that is your prerogative to do so on get in a big huff about it. I suppose you can go vote with your feet and go elsewhere, sounds like that's where you're going.

 

[NobleNewt]

well they doubled the price of barley on me from $13 a 50lb sack, to $23...so it's like 48c a pound now...

i've been malting my own barley since 2016, right after inbev bought NB. i thought it'd be a good idea to start.

Have you had good luck with your own malting? Good modification? Looks like an easy enough process.

 

[bracconiere]

Have you had good luck with your own malting? Good modification? Looks like an easy enough process.

well i get ~85% beersmith2 effec with store bought, and ~75% with my homemalt, i have no sense of taste. to me i like the taste of my homemalt better, from what i can get from it. @Sammy86 brewed with some, and said it was pretty decent, although same lower effec.

it's not 'hard' just time consuming, the only hard part is deculming, which i've made easy now with a dedicated clothes dryer, and leaf vacuum bag to catch the rootlets blown out.

 

[aceluby]

The only issue I have is that at checkout it says it'll be here in 3 days. A week later there's nothing, a week after that you get your coupon, then at some point it actually ships. That's a super frustrating process and feels like a very underhanded sales technique. I don't think it's asking too much to have on their website that they are experiencing delays up to 2 weeks when ordering instead of finding out like that. Maybe you choose someone else, maybe you just plan a little further ahead, but at least give the whole picture to the customer so they have the option to make that decision up-front.

 

[D.B.Moody]

It's so easy

. . .because Northern Brewer's problems were self created by their purchase of and closing Austin Homebrew Supply and Adventures in Homebrewing. They messed up. This (and their poor communication/response to customers) is why they do not get a pass.

They have disappointed people in Ann Arbor, Michigan, Austin, Texas, and pretty much everywhere on line. Why people keep ordering from them i do not understand.

I have never ordered from Northern Brewer because their prices are high. My ordering is done months in advance, so immediate shipping is not important to me. My last order was for 9 brews. I still have three of those to brew, but I will be ordering soon for the first 6 brews of 2023. My order will be split among Rite Brew, Homebrew Ohio, and my local, Missouri Malt.

 

[Beermeister32]

I have never ordered from Northern Brewer,

You are dumping on a company you have never ordered from before??? They've been great any time I've dealt with them.