New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[bailey mountain brewer]

I just use whirfloc in the boil, outside of that no fining for me.

 

[eugles]

Has anyone tried using fining agents in these beers? Whether it be gelatin, bio fine, or whatever else is available, I’m considering playing around with them. I typically do a soft crash prior to dry hopping and while it works out pretty good I know it could be better. My thought process is using one of these fining agents Prior to dry hopping to ensure that all yeast and any other particulate that could potentially bind with hop oils and drop them out, are removed.

It just seems like a sure fire way to make sure that everything is out-of-the-way before the beer is introduced to the dry hops.

I remember hearing Mike Tonsmeire on a podcast (can’t remember which one) talking about Sapwood’s use of Biofine to help drop out dry hop particulate. I think it was a while ago and not sure if they still go with that. I tried it before and didn’t notice a whole lot of impact. I’ve heard some brewers be adamant about no whirfloc, but I’ve used it every time personally.

 

[BeerFst]

I remember hearing Mike Tonsmeire on a podcast (can’t remember which one) talking about Sapwood’s use of Biofine to help drop out dry hop particulate. I think it was a while ago and not sure if they still go with that. I tried it before and didn’t notice a whole lot of impact. I’ve heard some brewers be adamant about no whirfloc, but I’ve used it every time personally.

Yeah it’s noted on their blog about being vegan and using bio fine.

I just dosed a beer two days ago with gelatin to see if it would drop out some serious hop burn from too much Vic secret.

So far a little improvement but nothing major yet. No clarity difference at all.

This was post dry hop tho

 

[aaronm13]

Has anyone tried using fining agents in these beers? Whether it be gelatin, bio fine, or whatever else is available, I’m considering playing around with them. I typically do a soft crash prior to dry hopping and while it works out pretty good I know it could be better. My thought process is using one of these fining agents Prior to dry hopping to ensure that all yeast and any other particulate that could potentially bind with hop oils and drop them out, are removed.

It just seems like a sure fire way to make sure that everything is out-of-the-way before the beer is introduced to the dry hops.

Do you use whirlfloc in the boil? I'm constantly going back and forth with the use of it. Can't decideif it makes a positive difference or not.

 

[R.A.I.D]

I used Honig Malt as 5% of the grain bill and liked it. But now I can't get it anymore.
What would be a good replacement? Caramel Pale Malt?

 

[beervoid]

I used Honig Malt as 5% of the grain bill and liked it. But now I can't get it anymore.
What would be a good replacement? Caramel Pale Malt?

Melanoidin light or close to the honey malt ebc

 

[HopsAreGood]

Do you use whirlfloc in the boil? I'm constantly going back and forth with the use of it. Can't decideif it makes a positive difference or not.

I’ve used it a bunch in the past but haven’t been using it at all lately. It certainly didn’t hurt anything but not sure how much it really improved anything either.

 

[aaronm13]

I’ve used it a bunch in the past but haven’t been using it at all lately. It certainly didn’t hurt anything but not sure how much it really improved anything either.

That's my exact conclusion too.

 

[stickyfinger]

Gelatin sometimes works in beers. I tried it in a belgian golden strong and it didn't seem to do much. i've used it in english beers and they were crystal clear. i'd be interested to see what you find if you use it. sounds like a great idea. i've been crashing to near freezing for a week before dry hopping and that works pretty well too.

Yeah, I’ve never actually used any fining agent before so I have zero experience. I’ve seen pretty clear beer turn extremely hazy after a significant dry hop though so I’d only really consider using it pre-dry hop. It just seems like it might make the dry hop more potent if there’s nothing in its way that could potentially drop some of those oils out. I would then leave it alone after the dry hop is complete.

 

[ScrewyBrewer]

For clearing beer I like to use Whirlfloc in the boil kettle and BREWCLEAR from WilliamsWarn when transferring from fermenter to kegs.

 

[skleice]

For clearing beer I like to use Whirlfloc in the boil kettle and BREWCLEAR from WilliamsWarn when transferring from fermenter to kegs.

View attachment 725144

Gorgeous! That's my favorite beer color

 

[eugles]

I’ve used it a bunch in the past but haven’t been using it at all lately. It certainly didn’t hurt anything but not sure how much it really improved anything either.

Pretty much the only reason I’ve used it is to try to avoid transferring so much trub and hop material into the fermenter... and even with it I never personally get a good whirlpool “cone.” I get more of a pancake of yuck end it still drives me a little nuts that I can get a nice professional looking cone haha. Strangely enough in the last week I’ve seen mentions about adding whirlfloc in the last five minutes rather than the last 15 minutes, but haven’t looked at it when to much.

 

[beervoid]

Pretty much the only reason I’ve used it is to try to avoid transferring so much trub and hop material into the fermenter... and even with it I never personally get a good whirlpool “cone.” I get more of a pancake of yuck end it still drives me a little nuts that I can get a nice professional looking cone haha. Strangely enough in the last week I’ve seen mentions about adding whirlfloc in the last five minutes rather than the last 15 minutes, but haven’t looked at it when to much.

Whirlfloc science is out there, look it up. Its only active for a certain amount of time

 

[eugles]

Whirlfloc science is out there, look it up. Its only active for a certain amount of time

And as with all things brewing related, there’s a lot of contradicting posts out there. I’ve always added it at 15, but am going to try 5 next time.

 

[Taket_al_Tauro]

Pretty much the only reason I’ve used it is to try to avoid transferring so much trub and hop material into the fermenter... and even with it I never personally get a good whirlpool “cone.” I get more of a pancake of yuck end it still drives me a little nuts that I can get a nice professional looking cone haha. Strangely enough in the last week I’ve seen mentions about adding whirlfloc in the last five minutes rather than the last 15 minutes, but haven’t looked at it when to much.

Do you whirlpool hot (e.g. at hop stand temperature, let's say 150 - 175 F), or cold after chilling down to pitching temps?
IME it makes a big difference on the resulting cone.
In my previous system I would whirlpool hot, transfer and then chill to pitching temp in the fermenter (a bucket).
... and I always managed to get a pretty decent cone

Now due to a swich to better fermenters as well as double the volume as before, it is just so much easier to chill in the kettle, whirlpool and then transfer. But it seems I'm never getting a nice cone anymore. So I also resorted to using whirlfloc, which is quite effective in limiting trub transfer to the fermenter...probably not as much as a nice cone, but it's a good compromise for me.

 

[beervoid]

And as with all things brewing related, there’s a lot of contradicting posts out there. I’ve always added it at 15, but am going to try 5 next time.

Maybe, but this particular subject is studied quiet extensively by the whirlfloc producers themselves, they have a manuel for how to use it.
Having types that, I personally trialed with and without and havent noticed any differences.

 

[aaronm13]

That's very interesting about whirlfloc. I've always added it with around 15 minutes left in the boil. I'll try it with 5 left next time.

 

[Noob_Brewer]

I came home, ambient temp was 72, good Krausen and 5psi on the spundle, so I dry hopped. I’m leaning to taking it off pressure later and putting it in the mini fridge at 67 ambient.

Thoughts?

Your ferm process is different than mine, but if its motoring well at 72, Id just let it ride through myself at 72 until finished if you have temp control. Ive also never tried to ferment under pressure, so sorry I can't offer a useful opinion on that.

 

[stickyfinger]

you don't get a nice cone b/c there is probably cold break in there right? professionals chill after/during transfer from the kettle in a plate chiller.

Pretty much the only reason I’ve used it is to try to avoid transferring so much trub and hop material into the fermenter... and even with it I never personally get a good whirlpool “cone.” I get more of a pancake of yuck end it still drives me a little nuts that I can get a nice professional looking cone haha. Strangely enough in the last week I’ve seen mentions about adding whirlfloc in the last five minutes rather than the last 15 minutes, but haven’t looked at it when to much.

 

[beervoid]

you don't get a nice cone b/c there is probably cold break in there right? professionals chill after/during transfer from the kettle in a plate chiller.

No good cone is a matter of having a strong enough whirlpool going

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I agree, so I use a counter flow chiller, if I do a wp addition I will chill to temp then disconnect my chiller to make sure I get a fast enough wp to get a good cone. If I leave the wort transfer through the chiller the entire time it doesn't spin fast enough.

 

[Taket_al_Tauro]

No good cone is a matter of having a strong enough whirlpool going

Don't know about cold break, but it is definitely also a matter of wort temperature. In fact I can whirlpool much stronger now than in my previous system, as I have one of these whirlpool paddles you can attach to a drill. Still the cone is way less developed than previously when I used to whirlpool for a shorter time and by hand (but in hot wort).

 

[eugles]

you don't get a nice cone b/c there is probably cold break in there right? professionals chill after/during transfer from the kettle in a plate chiller.

Are you saying that I can get a better cone to form if I world pool prior to chilling? I use an immersion chiller so I don’t really have an option to transfer clean but hot wort.

 

[eugles]

Do you whirlpool hot (e.g. at hop stand temperature, let's say 150 - 175 F), or cold after chilling down to pitching temps?
IME it makes a big difference on the resulting cone.
In my previous system I would whirlpool hot, transfer and then chill to pitching temp in the fermenter (a bucket).
... and I always managed to get a pretty decent cone

Now due to a swich to better fermenters as well as double the volume as before, it is just so much easier to chill in the kettle, whirlpool and then transfer. But it seems I'm never getting a nice cone anymore. So I also resorted to using whirlfloc, which is quite effective in limiting trub transfer to the fermenter...probably not as much as a nice cone, but it's a good compromise for me.

interesting so in your experience the con forms better at hotter temps?

 

[Dgallo]

Don't know about cold break, but it is definitely also a matter of wort temperature. In fact I can whirlpool much stronger now than in my previous system, as I have one of these whirlpool paddles you can attach to a drill. Still the cone is way less developed than previously when I used to whirlpool for a shorter time and by hand (but in hot wort).

I have a hard time coning when I get a good cold break. It precipitates so slowly that it’s a very low dome when it settles

 

[Noob_Brewer]

Pretty much the only reason I’ve used it is to try to avoid transferring so much trub and hop material into the fermenter... and even with it I never personally get a good whirlpool “cone.” I get more of a pancake of yuck end it still drives me a little nuts that I can get a nice professional looking cone haha. Strangely enough in the last week I’ve seen mentions about adding whirlfloc in the last five minutes rather than the last 15 minutes, but haven’t looked at it when to much.

If your goal is to limit the amount of trub into the fermenter, you have several options: 1) get a great whirlpool cone so that the dip tube grabs from the side and not the cone, 2) use an assortment of mesh bags/filters/etc to filter out the trub as it goes into the fermenter, and 3) wait for it all to settle and then transfer. I have tried #2 and its a PITA for me and didn't like it. Probably poor execution on my part but I didn't like it. I use the anvil foundry 10.5g and its tall and narrow, so even when I do get a decent cone from a decently strong whirl pool while chilling, once the wort level gets to the top of the cone, it immediately collapses and since my kettle is narrow - trub gets sucked through. So for me with my anvil foundry, I rely on time to settle (#3). Once I get it to pitching temps through chilling, I wait an hour or three (depending on my family duties and needs). Then when I transfer, I rotate my dip tube upwards and get very clean looking wort into the fermenter with minimal trub. Obviously this method is viable because of the perk of having a rotating dip tube which many peeps may not have the luxury of having. But it works well for me. I also do use whirlfloc in the boil (15minutes). After reading some of the above posts, maybe I should be using it at 5minutes of the boil?

EDIT: I let my hops roam free in the kettle, so I also voluntarily take more losses going into the fermenter to avoid excess trub going into the fermenter. So adjusting your total wort volume to account for these losses is another strategy (option #4 in addition to the above options?) you may want to consider whats best for you.

Cheers!

 

[chieftain]

Yes, the Lallemand New England. I’m enjoying mixing dry yeasts lately. I used the Lallemand pitch rate calculator, fully aware that the cell count in the New England is woefully low, and determined that (according to the calculator) 1 pack of verdant is suggested to be good for 2/3 of a 5 gallon batch of 1.070 wort, and 1 pack of the New England is suggested to be good for 1/3 of a 5 gallon batch of 1.070 wort. So pitching 1 pack of each results in about 2/3 verdant and 1/3 Conan. Obviously there are many factors that come into play but I used that rough estimate and am very pleased with the results. I intend to use this exact combo for many future brews.

I just did this yeast combo today. I checked the Lallemand calculator and it recommended 4 (!!!) packs of the New England for 6 gallons of 1.080 wort.

 

[eugles]

If your goal is to limit the amount of trub into the fermenter, you have several options: 1) get a great whirlpool cone so that the dip tube grabs from the side and not the cone, 2) use an assortment of mesh bags/filters/etc to filter out the trub as it goes into the fermenter, and 3) wait for it all to settle and then transfer. I have tried #2 and its a PITA for me and didn't like it. Probably poor execution on my part but I didn't like it. I use the anvil foundry 10.5g and its tall and narrow, so even when I do get a decent cone from a decently strong whirl pool while chilling, once the wort level gets to the top of the cone, it immediately collapses and since my kettle is narrow - trub gets sucked through. So for me with my anvil foundry, I rely on time to settle (#3). Once I get it to pitching temps through chilling, I wait an hour or three (depending on my family duties and needs). Then when I transfer, I rotate my dip tube upwards and get very clean looking wort into the fermenter with minimal trub. Obviously this method is viable because of the perk of having a rotating dip tube which many peeps may not have the luxury of having. But it works well for me. I also do use whirlfloc in the boil (15minutes). After reading some of the above posts, maybe I should be using it at 5minutes of the boil?

EDIT: I let my hops roam free in the kettle, so I also voluntarily take more losses going into the fermenter to avoid excess trub going into the fermenter. So adjusting your total wort volume to account for these losses is another strategy (option #4 in addition to the above options?) you may want to consider whats best for you.

Cheers!

This was the closest thing I’ve got to a cone and I’m not even sure what I did differently. I have a spincycle from brewhardware on my kettle and after a few of the above posts am wondering if the speed of the whirlpool is not where it should be as compared to having the wort enter directly into the kettle as opposed to being forced down.

 

[Noob_Brewer]

View attachment 725232
This was the closest thing I’ve got to a cone and I’m not even sure what I did differently. I have a spincycle from brewhardware on my kettle and after a few of the above posts am wondering if the speed of the whirlpool is not where it should be as compared to having the wort enter directly into the kettle as opposed to being forced down.

Looks like a decent cone to me! How much hops did ya get into the fermenter on this batch? Curious as to what type of kettle you have. Is your dip tube fixed or rotatable? FWIW I have the spin cycle as well and have it low like you as well.

 

[eugles]

Looks like a decent cone to me! How much hops did ya get into the fermenter on this batch? Curious as to what type of kettle you have. Is your dip tube fixed or rotatable? FWIW I have the spin cycle as well and have it low like you as well.

Thanks hah! The kettle is a 10gal generic I got off of Amazon for my first homebrew years ago. Concord I think? It was cheap and due for an upgrade badly. No volume markers and it drives me insane. I added an anvil foundry dip tube having no idea if it would work, but it’s been great. I trimmed a few centimeters off of it with a pipe cutter as the clearance to the kettle floor was too small. Actually thinking of buying another anvil dip tube and using it as a whirlpool instead of the spincycle. The dip tube is not rotatable. I think the picture was just a 5 gallon batch with maybe like 6 ounces in the kettle. That was one of the few times I did not end up with a ton of stuff in my fermenter.

I really am kind of just over spending so much effort to get clean wort into the fermenter. I could get a nice kettle with a domed bottom etc. or I’m wondering if I should just get a conical fermenter, transfer over everything, and just dump trub right before pitching haha.