New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[aaronm13]

Latest hazy double ipa at 8.4%

Grain:
70% - proximity 2row
20% - flaked oats
10% - white wheat

Yeast:
Verdant

Hops:
Citra
Simcoe
Motueka CGX

The beers not bad but it’s quite muted. I really think verdant sucks so I’ll probably never use it again. Very ester forward on the character and thinner body (still fine but I’m hyper critical about mouthfeel/body) and really competes with the hops and takes away from the brightness.View attachment 850913

I' m with you now about Verdant. For 2+ years it was my go to strain and even with throwing 14-16oz dry hops all the beers felt muted and underwhelming. Could never wrap my head around what was going wrong. So did a bit of digging around and saw a few people mention that it really mutes hops. So on my last brew I used Imperial Dry hop and the result was great. Hops really popped and the beer was drinkable after only 2-3 days compared to 2 weeks minimum with Verdant. It was hands down my best NEIPA to date.

Used it again yesterday for my next beer, Citra and Riwaka hot side and Citra and Nelson cold side. Might use a small addition of Riwaka too, still undecided on this. Really looking forward to trying the results.

Out of curiosity have you moved away from malted oats to flaked oats?

 

[Dwaynehaze]

Damn I switched to verdant two hazies ago and I'm actually liking what I'm getting from it hop wise a lot better than juice. Also seems to let me get alot more hops in without getting much greenness at all compared to juice which is what I was using before

Got some cgx motueka and Nelson coming in so I'm super excited to use that in this beer

 

[beervoid]

You throw enough oats/wheat and dry hop at a high enough rate you can get any yeast to look super hazy lol

haze that will drop out within a week

 

[spersichilli]

Has anyone had a good experience with spectrum? I've opened two packs so far and both smelled like moldy cheese

 

[Redhouse Brewing]

For those struggling to get/keep hazy beer, try dry hopping on day 7. Two years ago, I watched a webinar from Laura Burns of Omega Yeast who discovered through her testing, that dry hopping on day 7 gives the most turbidity and therefore the best stable haze. I have been doing this ever since and every single hazy (I’ve made 10 so far) has been perfectly hazy throughout the keg.

 

[wepeeler]

For those struggling to get/keep hazy beer, try dry hopping on day 7. Two years ago, I watched a webinar from Laura Burns of Omega Yeast who discovered through her testing, that dry hopping on day 7 gives the most turbidity and therefore the best stable haze. I have been doing this ever since and every single hazy (I’ve made 10 so far) has been perfectly hazy throughout the keg.

That's interesting. Might have to give it a try. I think most brewers on here are soft crashing to drop yeast, then DH for 48 hours. I've been doing that, and my haze is stable to the last pour as well. I package all my hazies on day 14, so I'm dry hopping on day 12.

 

[Langerz]

Also, while it is new and not available in homebrew sized packs yet, the Lallemand + Escarpment Labs produced Pomona looks interesting. The text says "enhances biotransformation and haze for modern IPA styles" (where I think "modern" still means Hazies). I would not be surprised if it costs a couple dollars more than Verdant (but maybe still less than dry London Fog). When somebody asked on the Instagram announcement, they said homebrew packs would be out in a month or two.

https://www.lallemandbrewing.com/en/global/products/lalbrew-pomona/

Just came here after getting the email to see if this is had been brought up in the thread. When the email title said modern IPA yeast I was thinking more about the "New West Coast IPA" thread, but with all the discussion in the description about haze I'd agree this is a NEIPA/Hazy intended yeast.

Who's going to give it a try first? I just brewed a hazy on my last brew and have an old school WC IPA planned next. With a crazy couple months ahead I'm not sure when I'm going to have another NEIPA brewing. Also as I said above I'm pretty happy with results with current yeast so probably not going to make the jump until I hear some others report back.

 

[ihavenonickname]

Man there are so many conflicting anecdotes in this thread. Which yeast attenuates? Which yeast sucks? Which brewery loves malto? Fidens finishes DIPA at 1.024 or 1.016?

I have no idea what to think anymore.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

But it's true, there is no exact answer and that's what makes it fun. You get to experiment for yourself (with a little input from others) and find your path and your recipes and your ingredients and your process, then when it all comes together and you brew that perfect beer you've been chasing, it's like the first time you kiss your first love, unexplainable joy... or whatever... but hey, that's just me.

 

[JTtilinfinity]

I’m doing a Brujos style DIPA tomorrow. Grain bill below based on the wheat/oats I’ve got on hand. I have a bunch of Citra (t-90, lupomax and incognito) so I want to do an all-Citra utilizing all three. Would love some advice on the best hop schedule to get the most out of each. TIA, cheers!

 

[Dgallo]

I’m doing a Brujos style DIPA tomorrow. Grain bill below based on the wheat/oats I’ve got on hand. I have a bunch of Citra (t-90, lupomax and incognito) so I want to do an all-Citra utilizing all three. Would love some advice on the best hop schedule to get the most out of each. TIA, cheers!
View attachment 851151

Just know golden naked oats are a crystal oat malt and that’s 5-10x(depended on who you ask) the recommended crystal percentage for an ipa and most people don’t put any crystal in a hazy. Your srm will probably be near 8 which hazy will look burnt orange and on the verge of Brown. If your dead set on using it I would drop it to 0.5lbs and fill the 4.5lbs of it with regular oat malt

 

[JTtilinfinity]

Just know golden naked oats are a crystal oat malt and that’s 5-10x(depended on who you ask) the recommended crystal percentage for an ipa and most people don’t put any crystal in a hazy. Your srm will probably be near 8 which hazy will look burnt orange and on the verge of Brown. If your dead set on using it I would drop it to 0.5lbs and fill the 4.5lbs of it with regular oat malt

Ha! Thank you for catching that total rookie mistake. I’m fresh out of oat malt and somehow had it in my head that GNO was interchangeable. I’ll cut it back to around 5% and make up the difference in extra white wheat, maybe some extra Pilsner.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

I' m with you now about Verdant....saw a few people mention that it really mutes hops.

In some ways it's the flip side of biotransformation, by definition if the yeast is "consuming" some of the hop flavour to turn it into other compounds, some of which may be below flavour threshold, then the overall intensity of yeast flavour is reduced, but you get more complexity.

When I did a split batch with around 6g/l Chinook hot/cold side, I can't remember without my notes what the control was - a Chico or M36 - but that had a bright grapefruit flavour, whereas the one with T-58 had maybe 80% of the intensity, but a much more complex flavour based around lime.

It just depends what you're looking for.

 

[Fergal]

Was a long time contributor to this thread. Started homebrewing in 2016 and spent countless hours on this site. From 2019-2021 I brewed one beer 40 or so times with plenty of info I’d gleaned from threads like this. The goal was to try to brew something lowish in ABV that punched well above its weight. Opened my brewery in September 2021 and this is our house beer. Available all the time and all around town. We brew it once a week at times when we’re busy. We have some dumb liquor laws here in UT so max ABV on draft can only be 5%. Sounds weird but I’ve actually grown to really appreciate it.

Anyways this beer is called Dopo and it recently just scored a 95 in the latest Craft Beer and Brewing summer IPA issue. The print edition didn’t include any notes on it but the online version did. It was tied for highest score in the “session IPA” category. I hate the term Session IPA so we call these beers L IPAs (pronounced Lie P A) cause a 5% IPA is a lie. Thought I’d give everyone very detailed recipe on exactly how we brew this beer. We brew a few versions with different hops so substitute your favorite hop combo as you see. We change the hops up on this beer all the time but this is what we submitted back in March.

If you love hops and hop saturation but want something a little lower in ABV I think you’ll really appreciate this.

OG 13p
FG 3.6p
5% ABV

Water Profile
Ca 100ppm
We use 2:1 CaCl to CaSo4 by weight to hit this target Ca amount using RO water. We do equal additions of salts to the mash and then with 10 minutes left in the boil. We also add NaCl at 10 minutes left in the boil targeting 50ppm Na.

Grain Bill:
2row Base Malt
20% Simpsons Golden Promise
7% Carafoam
2% Simpsons Caramalt
Acid as you see fit to hit 5.4 mash pH with the above salts
- We’ve started using a localish base malt called Mountain Malt. We were Rahr 2 row forever but this new malt has better extract and a slightly sweeter profile.

Mash

45 minutes at 155
20 minutes at 162
Mash out at 168

Recirc until as clear as possible

Boil for 90. Target 5.4 start of boil pH

- we are at almost 7000 ft in elevation so we have to boil longer due to our boil temp being 201. 60 minutes might be fine at sea level.

Hop additions

60 minutes
Simcoe for 14 IBUs
10 minutes
Nelson for 8 IBUs
WP -180/185
3/4lb / bbl
Nelson, Simcoe 3:1

Citric/Lactic Acid blend at 5min target 5.0 KO pH with whirlfloc addition.

Yeast: VT Ale. We use something i banked when I was a homebrewer. Closest thing is Bootleg Classic New England.

Pitch at 64 with ALDC & Zinc
target .75mil/ml/*plato
Aerate at 16ppm o2
Ferment at 66 for 2-3 days. Set to 70 when gravity hits 5p. Give 2 days at terminal then cool to 58 for 18-24 hour. Harvest yeast

Dry Hop at 2.5lbs/bbl
60:40 Mosaic:Nelson
Rouse from racking arm the next day to break up hop rafts on top.

Start slowly cooling after 48 hours on hops and dumping hops as often as you can.

Carbonate to 2.62 volumes.

The boil additions are key as is the NaCl and rest at 162.

We make a version with Nectaron, Nelson, Riwaka called Laser Kiwi and one with 586, Citra, Idaho7, and a dab of 1019 called Divi. We’ll substitute malted oats for the Carafoam sometimes or use NA pils as a base instead of 2row, or some Carahell instead of Caramalt but percentages are generally always the same.

Lots of details and clearly you have to have the gear to do everything but I know lots of folks on here do as I did when I was homebrewing.

Enjoy

Thanks for the detailed post on your beer. Very generous of you. I remember the back and forth and the disbelief from many back in the day that you could make a hazy beer without wheat or oats! I think the 5 to 5.5% heavily hopped pale is my favourite way to drink this style and one I enjoy brewing the most. I enjoy mine finishing around 1.010 and enjoy them a bit crisper but that's just my personal preference.
Would you be able to explain how you go about blending and calculating the citric / lactic blend? Did you consider dropping the pH before the boil instead?

Cheers

 

[couchsending]

Thanks for the detailed post on your beer. Very generous of you. I remember the back and forth and the disbelief from many back in the day that you could make a hazy beer without wheat or oats! I think the 5 to 5.5% heavily hopped pale is my favourite way to drink this style and one I enjoy brewing the most. I enjoy mine finishing around 1.010 and enjoy them a bit crisper but that's just my personal preference.
Would you be able to explain how you go about blending and calculating the citric / lactic blend? Did you consider dropping the pH before the boil instead?

Cheers

You should be able to use bru’n water to input different acids. The amount of acid it takes to move the mash a specific amount is usually pretty similar in the kettle.

We try to keep boil pH as high as possible for as long as possible. We’re not usually adding salts or acid until 5-10 minutes left in the boil. We are at almost 7000 feet and boil temps are really low so DMS is always a concern. High pH will convert the DMS precursor faster so we keep boil pH around 5.4 until the very end. If I was at sea level I probably would target a lower kettle pH at the beginning of the boil.

 

[Clyde McCoy]

Has anyone used Denny’s 1450 with this style?

 

[Dgallo]

Has anyone used Denny’s 1450 with this style?

I have early in. It’s a good yeast but in my experience it’s more finicky with temperature fluctuations, so temp control would be a must. Light esters, lets more malt come through. It’s my go to with porters and amber ales though

 

[spersichilli]

Got gold in the 21C Hazy IPA category at NHC Tampa with this one

OG 1.065, FG 1.020, 6% ABV, calculated IBUs 45

For 6 gallons
11.5lb Pilsner
4.5lb White Wheat
2lb Flaked Oats
Mashed at 154 for 60 mins, phosphoric acid to mash pH of 5.2

water: 170:85 Cl:SO4

~5ibu at 60mins
WP: 4oz Citra 21 T45 @ 170 for 40 mins (~40 ibu)
dropped pH to 5.0 at knockout with 10% phosphoric

Pitched LAIII (don't have the exact pitch rate because it was harvested off of a pro brewer friend's tank and he did the math for me) started fermentation at 68, bumped up to 72 at day 3 when I switched to my pressure transfer lid.

DH: 6oz Citra (crosby), 4oz Nelson (freestyle), 2oz Citra LUPOMAX, 2oz Galaxy (YVH) for 36 hours at 70 - normally I DH cold but I set the wrong chest freezer lol

Big orange tropical fruit up front, drinks a lot bigger than 6% - super soft body. A little bit of earthiness of the finish which I think was galaxy-derived. It was about 3 weeks in the can when it was judged I believe, normally I think 2 weeks is when it hits it's stride. Lower DH than I normally do because the judges at these things seem allergic to a little bit of hop burn. I was aiming for 6.5% but missed my gravity slightly, so for the finals I'm going to bump that up a bit and switch the galaxy out for something, then MAYBE work some incognito in but otherwise really happy with this.

 

[FringeDweller]

l

Got gold in the 21C Hazy IPA category at NHC Tampa with this one

OG 1.065, FG 1.020, 6% ABV, calculated IBUs 45

For 6 gallons
11.5lb Pilsner
4.5lb White Wheat
2lb Flaked Oats
Mashed at 154 for 60 mins, phosphoric acid to mash pH of 5.2

water: 170:85 Cl:SO4

~5ibu at 60mins
WP: 4oz Citra 21 T45 @ 170 for 40 mins (~40 ibu)
dropped pH to 5.0 at knockout with 10% phosphoric

Pitched LAIII (don't have the exact pitch rate because it was harvested off of a pro brewer friend's tank and he did the math for me) started fermentation at 68, bumped up to 72 at day 3 when I switched to my pressure transfer lid.

DH: 6oz Citra (crosby), 4oz Nelson (freestyle), 2oz Citra LUPOMAX, 2oz Galaxy (YVH) for 36 hours at 70 - normally I DH cold but I set the wrong chest freezer lol

Big orange tropical fruit up front, drinks a lot bigger than 6% - super soft body. A little bit of earthiness of the finish which I think was galaxy-derived. It was about 3 weeks in the can when it was judged I believe, normally I think 2 weeks is when it hits it's stride. Lower DH than I normally do because the judges at these things seem allergic to a little bit of hop burn. I was aiming for 6.5% but missed my gravity slightly, so for the finals I'm going to bump that up a bit and switch the galaxy out for something, then MAYBE work some incognito in but otherwise really happy with this.

View attachment 851398View attachment 851399

Love that color!

 

[Matteo57]

is there an easy way to rouse the hops in a conical fermenter? I'm assuming connecting a Co2 to a 1.5 triclamp nipple turned on like 10 psi or something would make a big mess and not do what I wanted done anyways..... haha
I see a few people that rouse their hops periodically but haven't seen anyone describing how they would do it in a conical.
Thank you for any advice here!

 

[Dwaynehaze]

is there an easy way to rouse the hops in a conical fermenter? I'm assuming connecting a Co2 to a 1.5 triclamp nipple turned on like 10 psi or something would make a big mess and not do what I wanted done anyways..... haha
I see a few people that rouse their hops periodically but haven't seen anyone describing how they would do it in a conical.
Thank you for any advice here!

I just shake my conical but it's only a 7 gallon uni

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

is there an easy way to rouse the hops in a conical fermenter? I'm assuming connecting a Co2 to a 1.5 triclamp nipple turned on like 10 psi or something would make a big mess and not do what I wanted done anyways..... haha
I see a few people that rouse their hops periodically but haven't seen anyone describing how they would do it in a conical.
Thank you for any advice here!

Step 1, get all the yeast out first, this is important... Step 2, hook up co2 nipple to bottom of fermenter, mine is set up, sight glass, valve, 90° elbow, valve, co2 quick connect. Step 3, purge the dead space in the elbow, put 10 psi on the fitting, open valve by co2 nipple, loosen the tc clamp until pressure starts to escape, let that go til your satisfied, tighten clamp. Step 4, 10psi still on open bottom valve into fermenter, use the prv on the top to control flow of co2 into fermenter. I burst until I see all the hops have left the sight glass and it's just liquid in there, if no sight glass I would guess 5 or more bursts to be sufficient.

Edit, step 1 should clearly be done before dry hopping..

 

[beervoid]

Step 1, get all the yeast out first, this is important... Step 2, hook up co2 nipple to bottom of fermenter, mine is set up, sight glass, valve, 90° elbow, valve, co2 quick connect. Step 3, purge the dead space in the elbow, put 10 psi on the fitting, open valve by co2 nipple, loosen the tc clamp until pressure starts to escape, let that go til your satisfied, tighten clamp. Step 4, 10psi still on open bottom valve into fermenter, use the prv on the top to control flow of co2 into fermenter. I burst until I see all the hops have left the sight glass and it's just liquid in there, if no sight glass I would guess 5 or more bursts to be sufficient.

Edit, step 1 should clearly be done before dry hopping..

Any specific reason you open the pressure valve instead of putting more pressure then head pressure and slightly opening the butterfly?

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Typically the pressure in my conical is 2psi when I dry hop, 10 psi will lift the hops then the pressure in the conical will rise to 10psi and no more movement, pulling the prv allows the co2 pressure to burst into the fermenter therefore rousing more effectively. And max pressure in my fermenter I'd 15psi so I don't try to push it to the max.

 

[Fergal]

Typically the pressure in my conical is 2psi when I dry hop, 10 psi will lift the hops then the pressure in the conical will rise to 10psi and no more movement, pulling the prv allows the co2 pressure to burst into the fermenter therefore rousing more effectively. And max pressure in my fermenter I'd 15psi so I don't try to push it to the max.

I do this sometimes too but I can see everything in my fermzilla. I do wonder though because the smells are amazing - am I smelling something that should be in the final beer? Probably not but who knows.

 

[redrocker652002]

Got gold in the 21C Hazy IPA category at NHC Tampa with this one

OG 1.065, FG 1.020, 6% ABV, calculated IBUs 45

For 6 gallons
11.5lb Pilsner
4.5lb White Wheat
2lb Flaked Oats
Mashed at 154 for 60 mins, phosphoric acid to mash pH of 5.2

water: 170:85 Cl:SO4

~5ibu at 60mins
WP: 4oz Citra 21 T45 @ 170 for 40 mins (~40 ibu)
dropped pH to 5.0 at knockout with 10% phosphoric

Pitched LAIII (don't have the exact pitch rate because it was harvested off of a pro brewer friend's tank and he did the math for me) started fermentation at 68, bumped up to 72 at day 3 when I switched to my pressure transfer lid.

DH: 6oz Citra (crosby), 4oz Nelson (freestyle), 2oz Citra LUPOMAX, 2oz Galaxy (YVH) for 36 hours at 70 - normally I DH cold but I set the wrong chest freezer lol

Big orange tropical fruit up front, drinks a lot bigger than 6% - super soft body. A little bit of earthiness of the finish which I think was galaxy-derived. It was about 3 weeks in the can when it was judged I believe, normally I think 2 weeks is when it hits it's stride. Lower DH than I normally do because the judges at these things seem allergic to a little bit of hop burn. I was aiming for 6.5% but missed my gravity slightly, so for the finals I'm going to bump that up a bit and switch the galaxy out for something, then MAYBE work some incognito in but otherwise really happy with this.

View attachment 851398View attachment 851399

I hate to ask stupid questions, well since most of mine are I guess I don't. LOL. On the hop end of your post, you have in parenthesis names, are those where you got the hops? Also, you use Citra and Citra Lupomax? Are they different? I want to give this a try, it looks really really good. checking out YVH, I found a T90 but no T45. Is there a difference Sorry for the dumb questions, but trying to figure out what to get on the hop side.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I do this sometimes too but I can see everything in my fermzilla. I do wonder though because the smells are amazing - am I smelling something that should be in the final beer? Probably not but who knows.

Yeah I agree, and I haven't roused the past couple batches because of that and also I have been doing 2 dry hop charges to hopefully help with extraction.

 

[tracer bullet]

On the hop end of your post, you have in parenthesis names, are those where you got the hops? Also, you use Citra and Citra Lupomax? Are they different?

They are indeed farms

Lupomax is "concentrated"

 

[redrocker652002]

They are indeed farms

Lupomax is "concentrated"

I tried plugging the recipe into Brewfather and came up with very different numbers than you did. My ABV was in the 8% with my IBU only at about 20 or so. I think I am probably doing something wrong, but it still looks really good.

I tried dropping the OG to 1.060 and it brought the ABV down to about 6%. It reduced the grain bill some to compensate. If I add 2oz of citra to the whirlpool I get to about 40 IBU total. I hate messing with people's recipes as I am sure you put alot of work into it Do these changes sound ok? Or am I making it way too complicated. LOL

 

[FringeDweller]

Planning a Hazy with A24 yeast after reading the majority of this theard. What fermentation temps do you guys recommended. On a different thread it's recommended to pitch A24 at 68f let it rise to 74f, then for cool crash bring it down to 55f, drop yeast then dry hop? The question is what are your best temps for fermentation with A24 and cool crash\dry hop temps?

2 row 50%
Malted Oats 30%
Spelt 20%

Citra & nelson 1oz per gallon whirlpool
Citra & nelson 2oz per gallon dry hop

I also have a fermzila with the hop bong for CO2 pressurized dry hops