New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

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SteveLupoMax

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Hey Yall,


Man! I took my eye of this thread and now we're at 395pages of solid gold information!
@Dgallo can you recommend a water profile for a 7.0%abv hazy.
Pilsner, 20%wheat, 10%malted oats, 3%NGO...

Any tips on how to get that THIIIIICCCCC Trillium mouth feel?

Hope to brew tomorrow.

Thanks to all who have helped create this thread!
 

Dgallo

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@Dgallo any discernable difference between the no boil and your typical process?
IThis was the first pour off the so it’s kinda hard to say right now with any certainty. I also used my homegrown hops on the hotside and had no clue what their alphas were and the fact that I added fruit purée, so it’s starting off with some significant differences to my typical beer. All that said, Theres no clear negatives that I foresee preventing me from trying this from time to time. Mouth feel is good(maybe a touch thinner than usual but that could be simple from the fruit being nearly 100% fermentable), head retention is solid but I tend to get tighter bubbles but at the same time the carb is still a little lower than I like. I have a Homebrew club meeting tomorrow night where we have a mini competition and share. Im going to bring this beer and not share any info with them until after and see if anyone can tell it’s deferent then my usual. I honestly don’t think they will have any clue
 

Dgallo

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[QUOTE="SteveLupoMax, post: 9235470, member: @Dgallo can you recommend a water profile for a 7.0%abv hazy.
Pilsner, 20%wheat, 10%malted oats, 3%NGO...

Any tips on how to get that THIIIIICCCCC Trillium mouth feel?
[/QUOTE]
Ca:100ish ppm
Mg:<20ppm
Cl: 180-220ppm
Na: 70ishppm
So4: 100-125ppm

target 1.014-1.016 Fg, heavy dryhoping rate around 2oz/gallon with the majority being t90 pellets, & I like body building protein heavy malts like malted oats but trillium doesn’t use that often and rely on dextrin malts
 

wepeeler

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Hey Yall,


Man! I took my eye of this thread and now we're at 395pages of solid gold information!
@Dgallo can you recommend a water profile for a 7.0%abv hazy.
Pilsner, 20%wheat, 10%malted oats, 3%NGO...

Any tips on how to get that THIIIIICCCCC Trillium mouth feel?

Hope to brew tomorrow.

Thanks to all who have helped create this thread!
I switched to Mecca grain and the mouthfeel is insane. Doing a double batch on Thursday to confirm it wasn't a one off. Wort and finished product are about 1 SRM darker, but it's a beautiful deep orange color.

I start with RO water, and my profile is Ca 100, MG 10, Na 14, Cl 175, So4 100. Seems to be a balanced sweet spot.
 

SteveLupoMax

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Thanks! @Dgallo
This is what Ive put together.

Ca:95 ppm
Mg:3ppm
Cl: 200ppm
Na: 80ppm
So4: 105ppm

rice hulls 3%
Pilsner 56%
wheat malt 12.5%
flaked wheat 10%
malted oats 6.5%
Chit malt 6.5%
NGO 3%
MaltoDex 2.5%

OG 1.071
FG 1.019

Simcoe FWH 35IBU
Simcoe 10' 5ibu
Simcoe 3g/L 80c Whrilpool.

Verdant yeast.

1:0.5:0.5 Mosaic, Citra,Sabro @14g/l

Thoughts?
 

beervoid

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We always talk about water profiles, but never discuss where we are adding the ingredients. I find that to be equally important. Something to consider…
Supposedly you lose less minerals when added after the mash, I haven't seen any water calculators that take this into account though.
If anyone knows one I would be interested to try it out.
But from what I know its mostly calcium that you lose which is exactly what we want for this style.
I think its mostly done to control PH.
 
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LumberZach

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Newest IPA that I kegged yesterday. 70% 2Row, 20% Spelt, 10% Oat Malt. Really excited for this one to carb up.

20220209_183522.jpg
 

TBryerton

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Ingredients over all, or when we are adding the water chemistry minerals?
Where we are adding water chemistry minerals. In my experience reducing what I add in the MT/HLT and saving a % of certain minerals to BK has a very different impact. Point being, it’s probably worth a conversation on here to see what everyone’s method is. @Dgallo I’m curious what your technique is. BTW, I enjoy your IG channel - great job with that.
 

TBryerton

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Anyone knowledgeable on here in regards to protein vs gluten in this style? I made back to back DIPAs - first one was 2row/white wheat. Second one I replaced wheat with Spelt. So second beer should be more protein, less gluten. The mash for the spelt beer was like cement - I had to constantly stir it to keep the wort circulating. I was very surprised how different it was. The spelt beer was much less hazy. Maybe hazy isn’t the best word - the wheat beer looked ‘solid’ like TH/OH style. The spelt beer was hazy like a Heady Topper. I assumed the opposite would be true. The spelt beer was great - just different than what I expected. Would the mash being so compact and creating a really strong filter have an impact? I had no problem filling the BK. Or was it impact of less gluten?
 

Taket_al_Tauro

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Anyone knowledgeable on here in regards to protein vs gluten in this style? I made back to back DIPAs - first one was 2row/white wheat. Second one I replaced wheat with Spelt. So second beer should be more protein, less gluten.

Gluten is actually protein. It is the main protein fraction in both wheat and spelt, and accounts for roughly 55 -65 % of total protein content.
Actually, the gluten content is on average even a bit higher in spelt as compared to common wheat.
Gluten is composed primarily of two protein classes, the so called gliadins and glutenins.
So what is different, is the gluten composition, specifically the gliadin/glutenin ratio, which is significantly higher in spelt.
That is also the main reason why it is often difficult to get a satisfactory bread making quality out of pure spelt flour. There aren't enough glutenins in there, which are main drivers of high baking volumes.

As for what it does to this style, I'm certainly not knowledgeable here. Maybe the higher concentration of gliadins in spelt is responible for the phenomenon you observed, or maybe it is due to other compounds/factors...
 

TBryerton

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Gluten is actually protein. It is the main protein fraction in both wheat and spelt, and accounts for roughly 55 -65 % of total protein content.
Actually, the gluten content is on average even a bit higher in spelt as compared to common wheat.
Gluten is composed primarily of two protein classes, the so called gliadins and glutenins.
So what is different, is the gluten composition, specifically the gliadin/glutenin ratio, which is significantly higher in spelt.
That is also the main reason why it is often difficult to get a satisfactory bread making quality out of pure spelt flour. There aren't enough glutenins in there, which are main drivers of high baking volumes.

As for what it does to this style, I'm certainly not knowledgeable here. Maybe the higher concentration of gliadins in spelt is responible for the phenomenon you observed, or maybe it is due to other compounds/factors...
The label on the spelt I have specifically stated higher protein and lower gluten than wheat.
 

Taket_al_Tauro

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The label on the spelt I have specifically stated higher protein and lower gluten than wheat.


I find this label a bit "suspect", as is the whole marketing around spelt as having less gluten than wheat, or a better, more digestible gluten. I'm talking here primarily about the bread making context, not the brewing one...but anyway.
Well, it could be true that that particular spelt variety or lot has less gluten (on average) than wheat, at least in theory.
But the fact is that the statement "higher protein and lower gluten than wheat" is ambiguous at best, becasue gluten is protein.

Edit: Here a link to a fairly recent study that illustrates a bit what I'm talking about:
.
 
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Dgallo

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Where we are adding water chemistry minerals. In my experience reducing what I add in the MT/HLT and saving a % of certain minerals to BK has a very different impact. Point being, it’s probably worth a conversation on here to see what everyone’s method is. @Dgallo I’m curious what your technique is. BTW, I enjoy your IG channel - great job with that.
I personally make all my adjustments in the mash/sparge. but its funny you mentioned that because our home-brew club is now meeting at The Warbler Brewery in Delmar, NY and we just discussed this exact topic with the Brewer/owner. we also discussed pre-dryhop ph adjustments. He believes you can be more consistent making adjustments in BK. So I think I am going to try to add them to the bk next brew. when it comes to ph, he said he will adjust to 4.2-4.3 pre-dryhopping if needed (he said targeting 5.1/5.2 at start of boil will get him there) because he wants to land right at 4.6 going into packaging. which I found interesting .

and thanks regarding my Instagram page, I am certainly trying to make it somewhat interesting lol
 
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Dgallo

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Janish said in his book that dry hopping at 4.2 is ideal for haze development.
I don’t recall actually reading that in there but It def correlate with what Chris said (the Brewer/owner) but his reasoning for dryhoping there and finishing was about a softer hop profile and smoother character from the hops
 
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Jimmy_Hops

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My latest batch is cold crashing and carbing but I couldn’t help myself. This bag of Idaho 7 I got from YVH is crazy strong. Super musty pineapple. I have 6 oz. of Lupomax Citra, 1 oz. of Citra Cryo, and 1.35 oz. of t90 Citra in the dry hop, while only having 3 oz. of Idaho 7 in there and it’s blowing the Citra away! The last batch I did was Citra, Mosaic, Galaxy, and Idaho 7 and they almost taste identical. Needless to say, I have figured out that Idaho 7 is super overpowering (not a bad thing). I’m going to do the same recipe next time keeping the Citra the same and just swap out the secondary hop every time I brew this recipe. Should be fun to see what different hops do when paired with Citra. I’m either going to do El Dorado or Sabro next. Leaning El Dorado as I love the fruit punch flavor it brings. Side note, I’m loving what Verdant IPA yeast has done to this beer. That apricot note is really shining and I’m picking up some cream/vanilla in there too. It finally helped me get a NEIPA down to 1.016 to help dry it out and cut out that cloying sweetness. Right at 8% ABV too which I’m not complaining about.
 

SteveLupoMax

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I personally make all my adjustments in the mash/sparge. but its funny you mentioned that because our home-brew club is now meeting at The Warbler Brewery in Delmar, NY and we just discussed this exact topic with the Brewer/owner. we also discussed pre-dryhop ph adjustments. He believes you can be more consistent simply worrying about ph in the mash and adding your specific profile adjustments in BK. So I think I am going to try to add them to the bk next brew. when it comes to ph, he said he will adjust to 4.2-4.3 pre-dryhopping if needed because he wants to land right at 4.6 going into packaging. which I found interesting .

and thanks regarding my Instagram page, I am certainly trying to make it somewhat interesting lol

Sorry @Dgallo, What do you mean by BK (embarrassed)
 

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Kegged this yesterday and couldn't resist taking a sample. This is my Nectaron and Citra DIPA. Citra hot side and Nectaron and Citra T90 and Lupomax cold side. Really excited about this as it's very impressive already. Can't wait to see how this conditions out in a couple of weeks. Just hope I can leave it alone.

Got very high efficiency this time so OG was 1.084 and still finished at 1.020 but left out the honey malt this time so it's not crazy sweet. With the higher OG I'm kinda glad it didn't go much lower. Nectaron is incredible but I just wish I got more at the time. Hope supply of this hop improves. Has all the New Zealand goodness of Nelson but so much more.
 

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HopsAreGood

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Kegged this yesterday and couldn't resist taking a sample. This is my Nectaron and Citra DIPA. Citra hot side and Nectaron and Citra T90 and Lupomax cold side. Really excited about this as it's very impressive already. Can't wait to see how this conditions out in a couple of weeks. Just hope I can leave it alone.

Got very high efficiency this time so OG was 1.084 and still finished at 1.020 but left out the honey malt this time so it's not crazy sweet. With the higher OG I'm kinda glad it didn't go much lower. Nectaron is incredible but I just wish I got more at the time. Hope supply of this hop improves. Has all the New Zealand goodness of Nelson but so much more.

Looks great. I absolutely love Nectaron as well. I’ve searched high and low to see if I can get some and I simply can’t. The only place I found that has some is more beer and they only have an 11 pound box for $330. I was gonna see if anyone in here wanted to go in on somewhat of a group by, but the logistics are probably ridiculous trying to break it up and ship it all over the place etc.

 

Dgallo

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Looks great. I absolutely love Nectaron as well. I’ve searched high and low to see if I can get some and I simply can’t. The only place I found that has some is more beer and they only have an 11 pound box for $330. I was gonna see if anyone in here wanted to go in on somewhat of a group by, but the logistics are probably ridiculous trying to break it up and ship it all over the place etc.

I could be wrong but I could have sworn Kane put out a beer with Nectron, have you thought about asking them if you could buy a lb of them
 

HopsAreGood

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I could be wrong but I could have sworn Kane put out a beer with Nectron, have you thought about asking them if you could buy a lb of them
I have not thought about asking them, but it might be worth a shot. I’d probably lean towards them saying no, but I guess you never know. Magnify also has some Nectaron in their beers and they’re pretty local to me as well.

With it being as scarce as it is, I’d be surprised if they let even a little bit go.

But great suggestion, I’ll probably give it a try.
 

Dgallo

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I have not thought about asking them, but it might be worth a shot. I’d probably lean towards them saying no, but I guess you never know. Magnify also has some Nectaron in their beers and they’re pretty local to me as well.

With it being as scarce as it is, I’d be surprised if they let even a little bit go.

But great suggestion, I’ll probably give it a try.
You never know. The amount they need, a lb is most likely negligible.

I literally just asked Steve from fiden’s if he’d sell me a lb of Nelson lol they have a hand selected contract with freestyle hops for their NZ varieties. I’m hoping he says yes lol
 

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@Dgallo
Great to see you got inspired by the Nordic tradition of RAW brewing. Looking forward to read more about your impressions of the brew.

Why did you quit spelt malt this time? Earlier on you were pretty impressed by it.
 

Dgallo

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@Dgallo
Great to see you got inspired by the Nordic tradition of RAW brewing. Looking forward to read more about your impressions of the brew.

Why did you quit spelt malt this time? Earlier on you were pretty impressed by it.
I still love spelt but I brewed with what I had on hand honestly. The whole beer was kind of, we have a party in 3 weeks what do I have on hand and what can speed up my brew day lol
 
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Hi,
I'm curious as to what percent of head space you have during fermentation?
I use a 7.9 gallon fermenter with a 5 gallon bucket. So I have 27% head space available.
Thanks!
In my conical I might have a half gallon of headspace, especially with this style I get as much in as I can to account for trub loss from the big dry hop amount.. so a half gallon if head space and 17.5 gallon of wort at start of fermentation.. I also use a 1/2 inch blow off tube into a bucket of starsan. My non dry hopped beers I have probably close to 2 gallons of headspace.
 

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Looks great. I absolutely love Nectaron as well. I’ve searched high and low to see if I can get some and I simply can’t. The only place I found that has some is more beer and they only have an 11 pound box for $330. I was gonna see if anyone in here wanted to go in on somewhat of a group by, but the logistics are probably ridiculous trying to break it up and ship it all over the place etc.

Just managed to pick just under a lb of Nectaron from Malt Miller in the UK. Not cheap though, at about $14 for 100g plus shipping. Not sure if they ship to the US but could be worth a look. They seem to be the only place with stock of it.
 

HopsAreGood

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Just managed to pick just under a lb of Nectaron from Malt Miller in the UK. Not cheap though, at about $14 for 100g plus shipping. Not sure if they ship to the US but could be worth a look. They seem to be the only place with stock of it.
They don’t…I emailed them A while ago to ask them about shipping to the US. I wanted to get some of the broken down homebrew size incognito tubes. I have seen that they have Nectaron in stock, but unfortunately they won’t ship to me.
 

aaronm13

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They don’t…I emailed them A while ago to ask them about shipping to the US. I wanted to get some of the broken down homebrew size incognito tubes. I have seen that they have Nectaron in stock, but unfortunately they won’t ship to me.
My local homebrew store in Ireland has Incognito tubes and says they deliver world wide but don't see the US listed so could be worth dropping them a mail. Their customer service is very good. They also do the tubes of Spectrum which I want to try but the price is putting me off.

Citra Incognito 15ml - Get Er Brewed
 

HopsAreGood

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My local homebrew store in Ireland has Incognito tubes and says they deliver world wide but don't see the US listed so could be worth dropping them a mail. Their customer service is very good. They also do the tubes of Spectrum which I want to try but the price is putting me off.

Citra Incognito 15ml - Get Er Brewed
Thanks for this. It’s funny because I emailed them as well a while ago, and they said no shipping to the US. It’s basically them and Malt Miller that always come up when I’m searching for things. Maybe the policies have changed on shipping to the US, I’m not quite sure. Maybe I’ll email them again.
 

aaronm13

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Thanks for this. It’s funny because I emailed them as well a while ago, and they said no shipping to the US. It’s basically them and Malt Miller that always come up when I’m searching for things. Maybe the policies have changed on shipping to the US, I’m not quite sure. Maybe I’ll email them again.
Ah sorry about that. I think both companies have tie ins with Haas so they always have those newer hop products.

New regulations came into effect within the EU last July about customs and vat so everything is more expensive now importing and exporting. Also Brexit in the UK has had a massive difference.

Is there any mail forwarding services you could use? This is how I order my hops from Yakima as they don't ship to Europe anymore. My latest Yakima arrived in Jersey today actually so should have them here in a week or so.
 

HopsAreGood

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Ah sorry about that. I think both companies have tie ins with Haas so they always have those newer hop products.

New regulations came into effect within the EU last July about customs and vat so everything is more expensive now importing and exporting. Also Brexit in the UK has had a massive difference.

Is there any mail forwarding services you could use? This is how I order my hops from Yakima as they don't ship to Europe anymore. My latest Yakima arrived in Jersey today actually so should have them here in a week or so.
I’m not sure to be honest. I’ve never even looked into a mail forwarding service but I guess that’s something I could do. Thanks for the suggestion.
 
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