New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

Homebrew Talk - Beer, Wine, Mead, & Cider Brewing Discussion Forum

Help Support Homebrew Talk:

tld6008

Master of Nothing
HBT Supporter
Joined
Aug 24, 2017
Messages
368
Reaction score
138
Location
Pensacola
I am having a heck of a time getting my blond ale harvested yeast to revive. I used WLP 095 in the blonde and had 6 pint jars of yeast. Meant to brew NEIPA this weekend but two of the samples so far have not woke up. They are 2 months old. Is this too old? Everything else has been followed exactly regarding cleanliness, storage, reviving.... although I do not have a stir plate but keep agitating it every couple hours.
 

milldoggy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2008
Messages
2,895
Reaction score
283
Location
Collegeville
I am having a heck of a time getting my blond ale harvested yeast to revive. I used WLP 095 in the blonde and had 6 pint jars of yeast. Meant to brew NEIPA this weekend but two of the samples so far have not woke up. They are 2 months old. Is this too old? Everything else has been followed exactly regarding cleanliness, storage, reviving.... although I do not have a stir plate but keep agitating it every couple hours.
2 months is nothing. I use 6-12 month old all the time.
 

Gustatorian

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2015
Messages
638
Reaction score
23
I wasn't happy with my results from a hop spider. I am pretty happy with my current setup though. I use the trub dam from SS Brewtech - whirlpool, trub rest, then use gravity to fill the carboy instead of the pump as to not disturb the cone. This is from a 15 gallon batch with 31oz hops in there.View attachment 547962
Did SS discontinue the trub dam?
 

Gustatorian

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2015
Messages
638
Reaction score
23
Not that I'm aware of. But...looking at their site, it appears the only way to get one is if you buy it with a kettle attached to it.

If you're interested in one, it wouldn't hurt to shoot them a message to see if they'd be willing to sell you just the dam.
Can you tell me more about it? How exactly does it work? Are you seeing big benefits from it?
 

TimmyWit

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
597
Reaction score
332
Location
Fairview Heights
I am having a heck of a time getting my blond ale harvested yeast to revive. I used WLP 095 in the blonde and had 6 pint jars of yeast. Meant to brew NEIPA this weekend but two of the samples so far have not woke up. They are 2 months old. Is this too old? Everything else has been followed exactly regarding cleanliness, storage, reviving.... although I do not have a stir plate but keep agitating it every couple hours.
Since you have 6 pints, I assume you're harvesting post fermentation. Try harvesting from your starter.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/yeast-harvesting-novel-approach.html

The slant that you get from this method will likely be more healthy than the yeast harvested from the bottom of your fermenter. This method is less of a hassle and I also like that it's a one for one swap. When I was harvesting from the fermenter, those mason jars started piling up in the fridge.
 

TimmyWit

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
597
Reaction score
332
Location
Fairview Heights
Can you tell me more about it? How exactly does it work? Are you seeing big benefits from it?
There's not much to it really. It just sits in front of the dip tube to block a good portion of the trub from ending up in your fermenter. Whether or not this is important is up for debate. But, I am a proponent of minimizing trub in the fermenter based on my experience (see post 5391 in this thread). There are plenty of folks who feel trub in the fermenter isn't a major factor. There is even a brulosophy experiment on it. So you will have to decide for yourself whether or not this is important to you. If you're pleased with the results you're getting, probably no need to change anything.

There are other options to achieve something similar. I tried a hop spider and personally, I was not happy with the results. I was using the same recipes that I used to use on my propane system with a false bottom and I felt my IPA's were lackluster in comparison. I probably could have adjusted my hopping rates and continued with the hop spider. But, I was ready to start doing bigger batches anyhow and I went with the SS Brewtech kettle. The trub dam/whirlpool allows me to leave the hops loose similar to my old propane system.
 

Gustatorian

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 1, 2015
Messages
638
Reaction score
23
There's not much to it really. It just sits in front of the dip tube to block a good portion of the trub from ending up in your fermenter. Whether or not this is important is up for debate. But, I am a proponent of minimizing trub in the fermenter based on my experience (see post 5391 in this thread). There are plenty of folks who feel trub in the fermenter isn't a major factor. There is even a brulosophy experiment on it. So you will have to decide for yourself whether or not this is important to you. If you're pleased with the results you're getting, probably no need to change anything.

There are other options to achieve something similar. I tried a hop spider and personally, I was not happy with the results. I was using the same recipes that I used to use on my propane system with a false bottom and I felt my IPA's were lackluster in comparison. I probably could have adjusted my hopping rates and continued with the hop spider. But, I was ready to start doing bigger batches anyhow and I went with the SS Brewtech kettle. The trub dam/whirlpool allows me to leave the hops loose similar to my old propane system.
Will it get clogged if I whirlpool through a pump? I throw a considerable amount of hops into the whirlpool then cycle it via a pump. I'm worried about all the hops collecting at the dam and essentially clogging the dam.
 

fragged

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
242
Reaction score
103
Location
SE Michigan
I am having a heck of a time getting my blond ale harvested yeast to revive. I used WLP 095 in the blonde and had 6 pint jars of yeast. Meant to brew NEIPA this weekend but two of the samples so far have not woke up. They are 2 months old. Is this too old? Everything else has been followed exactly regarding cleanliness, storage, reviving.... although I do not have a stir plate but keep agitating it every couple hours.

How long since you pitched? After 2 months you may get some lag, but should still take off. I wouldn't be surprised at 24 hours, if not a little longer. Probably a little faster if you had a stir plate.

Some yeast nutrient in the starter doesn't hurt either.

Now for me personally if I had 6 pints of two month old... I'd warm a liters worth (actual slurry amount, not beer and slurry, I'd guess 3 of your pint jars) of slurry to room temp while brewing that day, add some nutrient to the boil and pitch the liter directly into fermenter.

With that said, what I really would have done is make a starter from the yeast after not using it for a few weeks, dump the rest and then store my new yeast from said starter until needed.
 

TimmyWit

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Supporter
Joined
Jan 26, 2009
Messages
597
Reaction score
332
Location
Fairview Heights
Will it get clogged if I whirlpool through a pump? I throw a considerable amount of hops into the whirlpool then cycle it via a pump. I'm worried about all the hops collecting at the dam and essentially clogging the dam.
That's exactly what I do. Coincidentally, the first time I had any issues was the batch you see in the picture. That was nearly 2 lbs in a 20 gallon kettle. It won't get clogged while you're whirlpooling because everything is in motion and in suspension. But, afterwards, when everything settles out, part of your cone may settle on top of the dam. It just takes a couple flicks of the pump to create some suction and you'll be back in business. If you look at the pic, you can see the little channel near the dip tube.
 

tld6008

Master of Nothing
HBT Supporter
Joined
Aug 24, 2017
Messages
368
Reaction score
138
Location
Pensacola
Since you have 6 pints, I assume you're harvesting post fermentation. Try harvesting from your starter.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/yeast-harvesting-novel-approach.html

The slant that you get from this method will likely be more healthy than the yeast harvested from the bottom of your fermenter. This method is less of a hassle and I also like that it's a one for one swap. When I was harvesting from the fermenter, those mason jars started piling up in the fridge.
Thanks I will try and do this from now on I actually just started harvesting but when I can't get one to kick off 24 hrs before brew day things get pretty tense in my house. I actually got one to regenerate which was left from a starter I did not use, made it 2 weeks after the original harvest so its a little younger. Still can't understand why the others seem dead.
 

fragged

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
242
Reaction score
103
Location
SE Michigan
Thanks I will try and do this from now on I actually just started harvesting but when I can't get one to kick off 24 hrs before brew day things get pretty tense in my house. I actually got one to regenerate which was left from a starter I did not use, made it 2 weeks after the original harvest so its a little younger. Still can't understand why the others seem dead.
Assuming 2 months, Mr. Malty has your viability at 10%.
 

Rush

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 22, 2008
Messages
162
Reaction score
63
Location
New Orleans
Today is my 1st attempt at a NEIPA style beer. Used the "simple" method for water treatment in the first post.

I'm not worried about the following, just more curious about what I should expect. I hit the "flameout" addition on point, 160ºf addition was missed and I sat them at 150ºf for 30 minutes instead. Should I expect much difference here?

Also, I did Warrior for FWH and Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo for all additions @ 1oz each.
 
Last edited:

tld6008

Master of Nothing
HBT Supporter
Joined
Aug 24, 2017
Messages
368
Reaction score
138
Location
Pensacola
Today is my 1st attempt at a NEIPA style beer. Used the "simple" method for water treatment in the first post.

I'm not worried about the following, just more curious about what I should expect. I hit the "flameout" addition on point, 160ºf addition was missed and I sat them at 150ºf for 30 minutes instead. Should I expect much difference here?

Also, I did Warrior for FWH and Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo for all additions @ 1oz each.
You won't notice a difference in those whirlpool temperatures. I did my first at 140 and it was great. In fact I get it below 150 for the addition. Can't comment on the Simcoe and Amarillo other than they are commonly used.
 

tld6008

Master of Nothing
HBT Supporter
Joined
Aug 24, 2017
Messages
368
Reaction score
138
Location
Pensacola
2 months is nothing. I use 6-12 month old all the time.
I had approx 1/2 inch of yeast in the jars with beer on top. Are you doing anything specific to wake the yeast up? Another replied that at 2 months viability would be 10% according to a Mr. Malty blog. I had one jar which was a starter I did not use & made about 10 days after the original harvest and it took off well, in fact I made and used it since the original post. I am now trying another jar, will know tomorrow if there is life in it
 

stickyfinger

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2009
Messages
2,250
Reaction score
590
Location
Hudson Valley
I had approx 1/2 inch of yeast in the jars with beer on top. Are you doing anything specific to wake the yeast up? Another replied that at 2 months viability would be 10% according to a Mr. Malty blog. I had one jar which was a starter I did not use & made about 10 days after the original harvest and it took off well, in fact I made and used it since the original post. I am now trying another jar, will know tomorrow if there is life in it
take that slurry at 2-3 mo old into a L starter on a stirplate and in 24-48 hrs you will have yeast ready to rip
 

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
With this style, I feel like the minimum amount of trub/wort I leave behind when doing a straight transfer to fermenter with an auto-siphon is around 2G-2.5G from a 6.5G post boil volume. I'm getting a lot of hop material transferring by the time I get down to 2G remaining.
?!?!?

I may be doing it wrong, but i siphon into a strainer with cheesecloth over it. When the siphon finally starts to clog up, I just pour the last quart or so into the strainer. I leave a few cups of hop-heavy trub in the kettle but that's it. I end up with a big mass of hops in the strainer, but that seems better than a big mass of hops in the fermenter. I even squeeze them a bit to get the extra wort because I'm scottish and frugal.
 

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
Sorry, I think this been addressed, but what's the earliest that you could add the first dry hop charge? I'm on day three and fermentation has really slowed. I should dry hop asap, no?
If starting with a healthy yeast peach, I add first hops at 48 hrs. That has generally been in the 1.020-1.025 gravity range, which is what was recommended by the brewer of one of the best commercial examples of the style.
 

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
Wanted to ask again...

Hey all,

Quick questions about water chemistry for these beers (Sorry if this has been covered, if so, please point me to the post).

In one post I saw Braufessor talked about playing with the Sulfate:Chloride ratios to achieve different flavor profiles/mouthfeels for this type of beer. My question is, what types of flavors/feels does each type of adjustment lead to? What happens to hop/grain flavors and mouthfeel when you have a 1:1 ratio? 2:1 ratio? 1:2 ratio?
stop thinking in terms of ratio, and start thinking in terms of levels. if the levels are small, the ratio is meaningless.

If you want to learn something, make the same exact beer but with different mineral levels. I did this with 150/50 and 50/150 (sulfate to chloride). Both beers were delicious, but the high chloride beer had a bit softer mouthfeel, and the high sulfate beer retained the bright hop flavors longer. Now I do 100-150-ish sulfate/chloride and am happy with it. It's just one of many things going on in this style, but it's fun to isolate a single variable and play with it and then taste the results with your friends and compare notes.
 

Beerdrinker85

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
108
Reaction score
42
Location
Boston
Result with WLP644, pineapple, pineapple, mango and pineapple. What a wonderful yeast for NEIPA!! So juicy and fruity. I mashed at 156, went from 1.060 to 1.008 and I can assure you that this is not dry at all. Not even near it. Dry hopped 6oz at day 2 until the end.

Switched Galaxy for El Dorado, it's the second time I do this and I like it more than galaxy.

For those who are tired of Conan and 1318, try this, you will not be disappointed!

Cheers
 

chickypad

lupulin shift victim
Joined
Jul 19, 2010
Messages
5,817
Reaction score
1,342
Location
SF Peninsula
Result with WLP644, pineapple, pineapple, mango and pineapple. What a wonderful yeast for NEIPA!! So juicy and fruity. I mashed at 156, went from 1.060 to 1.008 and I can assure you that this is not dry at all. Not even near it. Dry hopped 6oz at day 2 until the end.

Switched Galaxy for El Dorado, it's the second time I do this and I like it more than galaxy.

For those who are tired of Conan and 1318, try this, you will not be disappointed!

Cheers
Sounds yummy. Just the single yeast strain? How long did it take to get to terminal gravity?
 

Beerdrinker85

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 8, 2016
Messages
108
Reaction score
42
Location
Boston
Yes, I made a 1.6L starter from a purepitch pack. It took only 3 hours to start bubbling.

According to my notes, it took 9 days to have a stable gravity. Fermented the whole time at 75-76F before I cold crash.
 

homebrewdude76

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2012
Messages
595
Reaction score
63
Location
Chesterton
Yes, I made a 1.6L starter from a purepitch pack. It took only 3 hours to start bubbling.

According to my notes, it took 9 days to have a stable gravity. Fermented the whole time at 75-76F before I cold crash.
I accidently allowed mine to ferment at 73-74F and I want to dump it now...
With S04 dry yeast.

Anyone else fermenting this high?
 

stickyfinger

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2009
Messages
2,250
Reaction score
590
Location
Hudson Valley

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
Result with WLP644, pineapple, pineapple, mango and pineapple. What a wonderful yeast for NEIPA!! So juicy and fruity. I mashed at 156, went from 1.060 to 1.008 and I can assure you that this is not dry at all. Not even near it. Dry hopped 6oz at day 2 until the end.

Switched Galaxy for El Dorado, it's the second time I do this and I like it more than galaxy.

For those who are tired of Conan and 1318, try this, you will not be disappointed!
I'm definitely not tired of 1318, but i'm making a mental note to try this yeast in the late spring when it becomes more difficult to maintain the 68-73 degree range (i currently only have temp control for warming, since I only brew during the colder time of year ). I also am pretty stoked on el dorado hops.
 

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
I searched the thread but didn't find much about non-chill methods for this style. I have coils to force cool, but was considering non-chill as a way to split up the brewing process between 2 evenings, and wondering what effect if any people might have found that letting the wort cool slowly had on whirlpool hop rates.
 

motosapiens

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2016
Messages
291
Reaction score
115
Location
Kuna
I accidently allowed mine to ferment at 73-74F and I want to dump it now...
With S04 dry yeast.

Anyone else fermenting this high?
i finish at 73 with 1318, but start at 68 for 2 days, then bump it up 1 degree per day. I personally wouldn't dump it, even if it tastes weird now. I have found most beers taste weird early on, and 3 weeks after bottling they magically seem to be just fine... maybe not optimal, but perfectly drinkable.
 

GnenieGone

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2014
Messages
13,403
Reaction score
23,201
Today is my 1st attempt at a NEIPA style beer. Used the "simple" method for water treatment in the first post.

I'm not worried about the following, just more curious about what I should expect. I hit the "flameout" addition on point, 160ºf addition was missed and I sat them at 150ºf for 30 minutes instead. Should I expect much difference here?

Also, I did Warrior for FWH and Citra/Simcoe/Amarillo for all additions @ 1oz each.
Mercene hop oil is volatile above 147F. Done many IPAs like this. Super juicy!
 

fragged

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
242
Reaction score
103
Location
SE Michigan
i finish at 73 with 1318, but start at 68 for 2 days, then bump it up 1 degree per day. I personally wouldn't dump it, even if it tastes weird now. I have found most beers taste weird early on, and 3 weeks after bottling they magically seem to be just fine... maybe not optimal, but perfectly drinkable.
I wouldn't dump anything I brewed that came out with alcohol and a tolerable taste. Does that make me an alcoholic, or just "frugle"?
 

chrisisnapping

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
62
Reaction score
15
Result with WLP644, pineapple, pineapple, mango and pineapple. What a wonderful yeast for NEIPA!! So juicy and fruity. I mashed at 156, went from 1.060 to 1.008 and I can assure you that this is not dry at all. Not even near it. Dry hopped 6oz at day 2 until the end.

Switched Galaxy for El Dorado, it's the second time I do this and I like it more than galaxy.

For those who are tired of Conan and 1318, try this, you will not be disappointed!

Cheers
Recently kegged an oat-cream IPA using a20 (imperial organic's version of sacch trois) with a centennial boil addition, Amarillo and mosaic in the whirlpool, then those two plus citrus in the dry hops. It is quite a tropical beer with just a little backend bite to remind you that it is indeed a beer and not juice.

Started ferm at 69 and worked up to 75.
 

Attachments

Northern_Brewer

British - apparently some US company stole my name
Joined
Aug 16, 2017
Messages
3,386
Reaction score
2,798
Location
UK
I searched the thread but didn't find much about non-chill methods for this style. I have coils to force cool, but was considering non-chill as a way to split up the brewing process between 2 evenings, and wondering what effect if any people might have found that letting the wort cool slowly had on whirlpool hop rates.
That'll be because no-chill isn't particularly well-suited to the style, most people are looking for rather more control of what's happening to their hops at the precise moment that no-chill takes control away from you; flameout additions with no-chill are generally regarded as equivalent to a 20-min addition with chilling, and normally NEIPAs have significant additions rather later than 20 minutes.
 
OP
Braufessor

Braufessor

Supporting Member
HBT Supporter
Joined
Dec 27, 2011
Messages
4,195
Reaction score
1,845
Location
NE Iowa
I am having a heck of a time getting my blond ale harvested yeast to revive. I used WLP 095 in the blonde and had 6 pint jars of yeast. Meant to brew NEIPA this weekend but two of the samples so far have not woke up. They are 2 months old. Is this too old? Everything else has been followed exactly regarding cleanliness, storage, reviving.... although I do not have a stir plate but keep agitating it every couple hours.
I did not see if you said anywhere that you made an starter..... what do you mean when you say "revive?" When I take a jar of yeast out that I have harvested, I always make a brand new 1L starter with the yeast. I decant the beer off the top of the yeast down the drain, and then add the yeast to a flask with 1L of 1.035 wort. Not sure if you are making a new starter or just taking the jar out and waiting for it to do something.
 

tld6008

Master of Nothing
HBT Supporter
Joined
Aug 24, 2017
Messages
368
Reaction score
138
Location
Pensacola
I did not see if you said anywhere that you made an starter..... what do you mean when you say "revive?" When I take a jar of yeast out that I have harvested, I always make a brand new 1L starter with the yeast. I decant the beer off the top of the yeast down the drain, and then add the yeast to a flask with 1L of 1.035 wort. Not sure if you are making a new starter or just taking the jar out and waiting for it to do something.
Revive means grow. I have tried to follow your procedure, take a jar of blonde ale yeast and make a starter with it. I just made another one (2 days ago) and it has shown signs of life today so I may be a little impatient and I'm not using a stir plate ...yet. I had been trying to make it 18-24 hrs before brew day and was not seeing anything worth pitching. A few months ago I initially had a bad result with my first liquid yeast use (WLP095) due to the shipment being delayed in Houston during the recent hurricane and it never kicked off in the starter. I had a hard time finding the yeast at that time as it is not sold in my area. Since finding it again I will not use any yeast that does not show signs of life.... even dry yeast gets a little starter treatment.
 
Last edited:
Top