No smoking debate

[Cheesefood]

I'm a smoker, but I'm sick to death of the smoking everywhere. I'm sick of asking for a seat in non-smoking and being put on the opposite side of the imaginary line that divides the smoking and non-smoking section. I'm tired of smelling it, feeling it and being burned by it when I go out. I'm tired of trying to quit smoking only to find that everywhere I go is filled with smokers tempting me back to the fold.

I agree that there can be tobacco bars for people who want to smoke, but why should it be allowed EVERYWHERE? Let the smokers go outside in the cold for a smoke.

Personall, everytime I hear someone say "When I go out to eat, I want to smoke immediately" it disgusts me. It's the dirtiest, stinkiest, most dangerous thing people can do. Smokers litter their butts everywhere and polute anywhere they go. I say that smokers be banned to the back-alleys if they need to puff whenever they go out. Let the world breathe.

 

[Rhoobarb]

...everytime I hear someone say "When I go out to eat, I want to smoke immediately" it disgusts me.

Amen! Nothing more stomach-turning than to have to endure smoke before the meal has even had a chance to be digested. Kind of like having dessert while you're sitting on the toilet.

... Smokers litter their butts everywhere...

To begin with, I hate litterers, period. But this is one of my personal #1 pet-peeves with smoking.

I would overlook all of the other 'faults' listed on this thread if I could only rid our country of littered cigarette butts. The filters take something like - oh, 100 years to decompose! Every time I see a butt tossed from the window of a car in front of me, I want to drag that person from their car and force-feed that butt to them!

 

[ScottT]

I would overlook all of the other 'faults' listed on this thread if I could only rid our country of littered cigarette butts. The filters take something like - oh, 100 years to decompose! Every time I see a butt tossed from the window of a car in front of me, I want to drag that person from their car and force-feed that butt to them!

Amen, Brother. I feel the rage every time I see it. Hell, they even throw there hot butts out on the road when we've got a dry conditions and a fire ban on. Every time I see it I want to grab that sucker by the hair and push his face in it to snuff it out.

 

[Cheesefood]

I worked in restaurants and I had to endure the smoking section. It was disgusting. Smokers toss their butts wherever they want without a thought about who has to clean them up.

Smoking in a restaurant is the equivalent of taking a big dump in the middle of the restaurant and leaving it there to stink up the place while people are trying to eat, then forcing someone else to clean it up.

I don't understand why some smokers think it's their God-Given right to ruin EVERYONE else's meal. Some smokers are just so self-centered. They go out to eat thinking only about what THEY want. THEY want to smoke. Never mind the fact that it smells disgusting and ruins other people's night out, it's all about the smoker.

Then they complain if their forced to go outside because it ruins THEIR smoking experience.

I hate how people smoke regardless of who's near them. I've seen people light up standing right next to a pregnant woman or a child. I've seen people take the time to buckle-up their kids in the car, then light a cigarette as soon as they get in.

Get a life smokers! Go outside and YOU be the one who's inconvenienced.

 

[Walker]

I worked in restaurants and I had to endure the smoking section. It was disgusting. Smokers toss their butts wherever they want without a thought about who has to clean them up.

Smoking in a restaurant is the equivalent of taking a big dump in the middle of the restaurant and leaving it there to stink up the place while people are trying to eat, then forcing someone else to clean it up.

I don't understand why some smokers think it's their God-Given right to ruin EVERYONE else's meal. Some smokers are just so self-centered. They go out to eat thinking only about what THEY want. THEY want to smoke. Never mind the fact that it smells disgusting and ruins other people's night out, it's all about the smoker.

Then they complain if their forced to go outside because it ruins THEIR smoking experience.

I hate how people smoke regardless of who's near them. I've seen people light up standing right next to a pregnant woman or a child. I've seen people take the time to buckle-up their kids in the car, then light a cigarette as soon as they get in.

Get a life smokers! Go outside and YOU be the one who's inconvenienced.

I'm a smoker. Have been for about 10 years, but I do not fit your stereotype.

I only smoke in bars (that allow it) and outside the building at work. I do not smoke in any public place that is not explicitly marked as a smoking area. I don't even take my cigarattes home with me after work because of the fact that I have kids there. I not only want to avoid the toxic affects on their bodies, but I don't even want them to SEE me smoking (the toxic affects on their minds, if you will.)

I have no problems getting up and going outside to smoke. In fact, I will even do this when not required, simply because I know how much it can bother other people. Heck, if I'm at a dinner table with other smokers, in a place that is full of only smokers, I won't light up while they are eating. I'll either wait for everyone to finish, or go outside to do it.

Even as a smoker, I get super pissed when I see people smoking with their kids in tow. This is an addiction that I got myself into (well.. that's debatable, because I spent a lot of time around my father who smoked, and I only started after he quit). But... no one else should have to suffer because of my poor personal choices, especially my children.

I don't litter with my butts. I either put them into a ashtray (or suitable rubbish desposal vessel after rolling the burning tobacco out of the paper) or... if there is nothing like this nearby I will stick them into my pocket and throw them away at the next opportunity.

I'm trying to kick the habit, so please don't harp on me about that.

-walker

 

[Walker]

BTW: I am the single vote for "banning in restaurants is OK, but not in bars".

-walker

 

[drengel]

walker--i think the majority of smokers are like you and me, they know their habit is disgusting and try to not inconvenience others because of it. thats why i dont think it would be a big deal to make bars non-smoking or to have closed off ssmoking sections. they do it in airports and everyhwere else, why should abar be any different. on the other hand, i dont like to hear that businesses have to close or change because of bureacracy, there should be exceptions that allow for closed off areas, or tobacco bars that are designed to sell tobacco products.

 

[Cheesefood]

I'm a smoker. Have been for about 10 years, but I do not fit your stereotype.
...
I'm trying to kick the habit, so please don't harp on me about that.

-walker

I've been smoking for about 17 years now. I've taken long breaks, but obviously I've never quit. Glad to hear that there are smokers like me who want to make the world a better place for those non-smokers out there. I'm glad you don't fit my stereotype, we need less people who do.

 

[Walker]

I've been smoking for about 17 years now.

holy cow, man! you're only 31 years old, right?

-walker

 

[Genghis77]

For smokers consider this: If you quit you will have more money for brewing equipment and supplies. And that is much healthier.

I quit smoking 17 years ago. I had to. I couldn't afford the expense of three packs a day. Never been tempted to go back. Being around smokers doesn't bother me so much as being in a room with stale smoke or so much smoke visibility is about 6 feet.

 

[Walker]

yikes.. 3 packs a day is a LOT of smoking. You're talking 60 cigarettes a day there, average waking time of 16 hours/day.... that's 3 or 4 cigarettes every HOUR! I think I would be coughing up tarballs.

I'm below the 1/2-pack-a-day mark (about 3 packs a week). At my worst, I was about 1pack/day. That was many years ago, though.

-walker

 

[BlightyBrewer]

I saw something once that read,

"You're a smoker. The by-product of your habit is smoke. It gets in my hair, on my clothes...

I drink beer, the by product of my habit is urine. How would you like it if I pi$$ed all over your hair and clothes!"

This is a very interesting debate. My opinion (FWIW):-

I'm all for an outright ban on smoking in public places. When I was in CA last, it was very refreshing for me being in a smoke-free bar, and the smokers didn't seem to mind smoking outside (but it is CA - good weather etc).

The cold hard fact is that second hand smoke can affect the health of those around the smoker. So is it right that someone should be allowed to affect the health of others in a public place?

As I am writing this I am also thinking that one could argue that beer (if taken in excess) can also effect the health of others if that person resorts to voilence due to being drunk (an ever increasing problem in the UK). I suppose it is all about the individual taking responsibility for their own actions....

Walker, Cheesefood, I admire your respect for others.

 

[Walker]

Walker, Cheesefood, I admire your respect for others.

It's not just respect for others. That *IS* a large portion of it, but a portion of it (for me, at least) comes from outright shame. I'm often embarassed by hte habit.

-walker

 

[Cheesefood]

It's not just respect for others. That *IS* a large portion of it, but a portion of it (for me, at least) comes from outright shame. I'm often embarassed by hte habit.

-walker

I'll stand by my earlier analogy. Smoking is like crapping - it should be done privately in places where one expects it. Walking into a bathroom, I fully expect to smell poop. It's unfortunate that we equate the smell of smoke with bars.

Years ago, the Wife and I moved to a new apt. We couldn't believe how bad our clothes smelled in our new place because of the smoke. We made a vow to never smoke inside our place again, and we've stuck to it.

In the winter, we just smoke less. It's not worth standing out in the freezing cold (and we're talking Chicago winters with windchills in the -20º zone). So I **REALLY** have to want a cigarette to go outside.

And Walker, I'm 30. Started when I was 13. I'm now at about 2-4 per day. Not packs, 2-4 cigarettes.

 

[Genghis77]

2 to 4 cigaettes a day! You didn't get addicted to them like most then. The vast majority of smokers are about 1-1/2 packs a day.I went from 3 packs a day to nada like turning off a light switch. Definitely would not have a single cigarette or I fear I would quickly return to the same level again. But, I have never been tempted since I quit. And I had a nice MRI and CT scan with a physical and my lungs have cleared up as though I had never been a smoker. I get both done every 5 years as I used to work around lots of radioactive materials and on the watch for the consequences....... maybe that was a reason I was such a heavy smoker.

 

[Genghis77]

Back when they allowed smoking on planes, something really annoyed me. Smokers would get non smoking seats and frequently get up move into the smoking section (where I was seated) smoke and then return to their non-smoking seats. Then there are people who have no smoking signs on the front of their house and in fact they are smokers. I think they are just in a state of denial or just imposing standards on others.

 

[kornkob]

Er--- why does not wanting people to smoke in your house make you a hypocrit? I often smoke when I'm out drinking but I'll be damned if I'll let someone light up in my house.

 

[Walker]

back when both I and my wife were smoking (before we had kids), we smoked at home, but NEVER inside the house. The stank from the stale smoke was wretched. Most of my smoking friends are this way, too...

So, i guess we would all be the kind of people who smoked but did not allow smoking in the house. Hypocrite? I don't think so. We weren't telling people not to smoke at all, we were just asking them to step outside.

Now, if I was a smoker, but gave people a hard time about smoking... OR... if I did not allow smoking in my house but complained that someone asked me go outside to smoke... THAT would be hypocritical, but being a smoker that prefers it to happen outside? Not hypocritical.

-walker

 

[Genghis77]

The cases I knew of the people smoked in their own house but apparently tried to advertise that they were non smokers. Once inside you would see the used ash trays though.

 

[Genghis77]

Come to think of it, in cases the people with the no smoking signs had stickers on their cars that were anti-drug. But they used illicit drugs. Just a ruse, they thought the police wouldn't suspect them.

 

[El Pistolero]

Wow, look at this new law that just took effect in Washington State!

On Thursday, a law passed overwhelmingly by voters in November went into effect, not only banning indoor smoking in public accommodations but also requiring people who light up to stay at least 25 feet from the door of any such place. Officials here say the ban is the toughest anywhere in the country to be adopted statewide.

 

[Cheesefood]

The cases I knew of the people smoked in their own house but apparently tried to advertise that they were non smokers. Once inside you would see the used ash trays though.

Maybe they wanted to control the amount of smmoking in their house. I have a friend who lets us smoke inside his place, and when I'm there I can easily smoke a pack or more in a few hours. However, by banning indoor smoking at my place, its out of sight, out of mind and I can go the entire day without a cigarette.

But if you let your friends over and they all smoke a pack, you have like 3-4 packs being smoked in your place at one time. THAT will stink up your clothes pretty nasty.

 

[Cheesefood]

Wow, look at this new law that just took effect in Washington State!

Good for Washington! I wish they'd make cigarettes illegal. Why is tobacco legal but not pot? Let's save that debate for another day.

 

[Genghis77]

An outright ban on smoking would be frightening like the Prohibition on alcohol. I don't think it would work for the same reasons. When passing laws on smoking they need to keep in mind a place for smokers too. Otherwise, the smokers will most likely ignore the law. Maybe the solution is to have the manufacturers make cigarettes nicotine free. People might quit when it no longer provided pleasure.

 

[Genghis77]

Just got to thinking about the consequences of making manufacturers make nicotine free cigarettes. It would vastly expand the grow your own. roll your own market, just as exists with pot. What is definitely not needed is more laws that cannot be effectively enforced.

 

[kornkob]

Never mind the 'consequence' of forcing a company to make a product for which there would be no market to speak of.

Besides, I don't think nicotine is the problem. It's all the other crap that makes it dangerous.

 

[Walker]

An outright ban on smoking would be frightening like the Prohibition on alcohol. I don't think it would work for the same reasons. When passing laws on smoking they need to keep in mind a place for smokers too. Otherwise, the smokers will most likely ignore the law. Maybe the solution is to have the manufacturers make cigarettes nicotine free. People might quit when it no longer provided pleasure.

I read this last year, so maybe they can be found on the market now...

A small cigaratte company (Vector; the company that make Pyramid brand cigarettes and others) had developed genetically engineered tobacco that was nicotine free. In a weird business model, they were actually selling these as a "stop-smoking" item. They plan to sell the new "Quest" brand cigarettes in three strengths by mixing the nicotine free tobacco with regular tobacco in varying proportions, and the smoker could then ween themselves off the nicotine while continuing to satisfy the oral and hand habits and puffing away on the cigarettes.

I think this would work for me. The nicotine cravings are gone after a few days, but I have the urge to lght up when driving in my car or thinking about a problem at work... for me it's the physical ACTION of smoking that's hardest to kick. If I could eliminate the nicotine in one step, and then the action in a second step, I think I would probably be more successful.

Granted, those nicotine free cigarettes are still horrible for your health, since they still contain ALL of the carcinogens and nasty crap that a regular cigarette does, but they just aren't chemically addictive.

-walker

PS: oh.. and the weird thing about this genetically engineered, nicotine free tobacco was that it was grown by cell-phone carrying Amish farmers!

Here's a link: http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.02/smoking.html

 

[Genghis77]

When I quit, I carried an unopened pack of cigarettes for about a month. One day someone asked me for a cigarette and I gave him the pack and the lighter......<grinning>. I think your right, the motion is a good part of giving up the habit. Many people substitue chewing gum.

Something I have found it among those that really quit for good, they managed to quit without withdrawl. They just decided to and did. It is only diffcult before it is accomplished.

 

[DeRoux's Broux]

i don't smoke cigarettes, only a cigar once in a while. and when i smoke a cigar, at do it at home, in the back yard, down wind of everyone in the yard.

i think after i go out to a club/bar, and come home after several beers, my hangover's are way worse than when i stay home or go to a friends and drink. the the second-hand smoke just kick's my arse and makes me feel like hammered dog sh*t!

smoking just doesn't affect the person smoking. it affects everyone around that person. it's a health issue to me......

 

[Orfy]

If I go into a pub with only one person smoking, the next day I can smell it on my coat when I'm in the car. It stinks!