NEIPA dont’s

[ChaosB]

Regarding the few posts above about YVH stock. I received an email from them today about getting Galaxy in stock. By the time I read it 4 hours later, it appeared that they already sold out so I emailed them to confirm. Apparently they sold out a couple thousand lbs. in 15 minutes. They indicated that was a small batch for them and they would be getting larger shipments soon. So yeah, they have a lot of hops.

For guys getting stuck siphoning to keg. I put a nylon bag on the end of my racking cane with a steel nut inside to keep it from clogging. I used the smallest bag I had which was still probably 5'' x 7'' . I actually think I'll go bigger next time to keep the top of the bag out of the beer as I still ended up with some hop matter inside the bag when I was done.

 

[BrewRunning]

All good info about the water profile for these. My last IPA was 200 ppm chloride to 100 sulfate (as close as I could get any way) using calcium chloride and gypsum in RO water. That put my calcium levels around 100 and it ended up having a chalky taste I thought was due to the yeast. Reading this I'm thinking it might be the high additions I'm making to my water plus all the minerals being added by the grain. My latest IPA I split those number in half to see if that makes a difference. Will report back.

What did you cut those numbers to? We're you more satisfied with the latest batch? Have you brewed it again with different numbers as well?

 

[Cavpilot2000]

Don't add flour just to get haze.
Just...don't.

That's not from an experience standpoint - that's from an "it's a dumb thing to do" standpoint.

 

[jschein]

Don't add flour just to get haze.
Just...don't.

That's not from an experience standpoint - that's from an "it's a dumb thing to do" standpoint.

Yeah local brewery did that and it sucked big time

 

[Clyde McCoy]

Yea, that's the one.

Mean values of overall hop aroma intensity (OHAI; black circles), Citrus (white circles) and Herbal/tea (gray circles) sensory attributes vs dry-hopping rate. Letters associated with the markers in the figure indicate statistically significant groupings (Tukey's HSD tests p-value < 0.05).



I'd be curious to know how tight that mesh is. Guess you'll just have to use their mesh bag yourself to know what results to expect.

Keep in mind that the authors are dry hopping with whole cone hops. With that said, their suggested dosing of ~5.3 ounces per 5-gallon batch is consistent with rates brewers are using with pellets. Kimmich is quoted as saying Heady Topper is the equivalent of ~4 ounces of dry hops per 5-gallons. I think very high dry-hopping rates can produce incredible aromas, but can also overpower the beer with citrus flavors that drown everything else out. I am still experimenting with this idea.

 

[day_trippr]

I'm using 12 ounces of dry hop pellets for 10 gallons for all of my neipas.
I love being drowned in hop juice!

Cheers!

 

[jturman35]

Just kicked my latest Simcoe/Amarillo beer and keg hopped with 1oz each. I will likely get away from keg hopping, but thought I’d share I had great success doing it this way. I typically just throw the hops in the hop spider and when done they are all condensed into a small ball in the bottom of the basket.

Look at the amount of hops in the bottom of this keg, that my friends is only two ounces, looks like a hell of a lot more.

 

[Moose_MI]

Well, its been over 2 years since I tried another NEIPA...tomorrows the day...

15Gallon batch.....I welcome any quick feedback

Original Gravity:1.053
Final Gravity:1.012
ABV (standard):5.3%
IBU (tinseth):0
SRM (morey):3.73

Fermentables

34 lb	Total
Amount	Fermentable	PPG	°L	Bill %
28 lb	American - Pale 2-Row	37	1.8	82.4%
2 lb	Flaked Wheat	34	2	5.9%
2 lb	Flaked Oats	33	2.2	5.9%
2 lb	Flaked Wheat	34	2	5.9%

Hops

Amount	Variety	Type	AA	Use	Time	IBU	Bill %
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Boil	0 min		7.7%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		7.7%
3 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		11.5%
2 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		7.7%
1 oz	Calypso	Pellet	13	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		3.8%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
2 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
3 oz	El Dorado	Pellet	15.7	Dry Hop	3 days		11.5%
2 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
1 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Dry Hop	7 days		3.8%
2 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%
2 oz	Calypso	Pellet	13	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%

 

[Dgallo]

Well, its been over 2 years since I tried another NEIPA...tomorrows the day...

15Gallon batch.....I welcome any quick feedback

Original Gravity:1.053
Final Gravity:1.012
ABV (standard):5.3%
IBU (tinseth):0
SRM (morey):3.73

Fermentables

34 lb	Total
Amount	Fermentable	PPG	°L	Bill %
28 lb	American - Pale 2-Row	37	1.8	82.4%
2 lb	Flaked Wheat	34	2	5.9%
2 lb	Flaked Oats	33	2.2	5.9%
2 lb	Flaked Wheat	34	2	5.9%

Hops

Amount	Variety	Type	AA	Use	Time	IBU	Bill %
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Boil	0 min		7.7%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		7.7%
3 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		11.5%
2 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		7.7%
1 oz	Calypso	Pellet	13	Whirlpool at 160 °F	30 min		3.8%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
2 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
3 oz	El Dorado	Pellet	15.7	Dry Hop	3 days		11.5%
2 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Dry Hop	3 days		7.7%
1 oz	Simcoe	Pellet	11.6	Dry Hop	7 days		3.8%
2 oz	Citra	Pellet	11	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%
2 oz	Amarillo	Pellet	8.6	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%
2 oz	Calypso	Pellet	13	Dry Hop	7 days		7.7%

Is it 4 lbs of flaked wheat? I see it says 2 lbs of it on 2 lines or was it a miss type? And for you dryhop times, is it 7 days contact time for the first and 3 days for the second? If so you don’t really need to go 7 days. If you did 5 days and 3 days or 4 days and 2 days, you’ll get the same level of extraction and even brighter notes.

Other than that I think it will be fine. Just make sure you use best anti o2 practices

 

[Moose_MI]

ooops...2 lbs each of flaked oats, barley, and wheat

The dry hops come in 2 steps...3 days into fermentation....then at 7 days onto fermentation...I plan to leave each step in for 4 days

Thank you for the feedback...a boost to my confidence!

 

[Dgallo]

ooops...2 lbs each of flaked oats, barley, and wheat

The dry hops come in 2 steps...3 days into fermentation....then at 7 days onto fermentation...I plan to leave each step in for 4 days

Thank you for the feedback...a boost to my confidence!

Thanks for clarifying. Honestly, I would throw it them in loose and not take them out. The 7 day dryhop I would push back until your 2 or 3 days away from kegging or bottling. Not that what your planning won’t work, but putting them in closer to your packaging day will make a bigger impact on the final beer

 

[stickyfinger]

Unless you want a really dry beer, I'd boost the OG some. I'd be worried it's going to taste thin with such a low OG. I wouldn't go below 1.060 minimum for NEIPA. Juice/1318 are good choices for lower OG beers as they leave more sweetness and fullness in the finish.

Thanks for clarifying. Honestly, I would throw it them in loose and not take them out. The 7 day dryhop I would push back until your 2 or 3 days away from kegging or bottling. Not that what your planning won’t work, but putting them in closer to your packaging day will make a bigger impact on the final beer

 

[day_trippr]

If you have never done an neipa using all malted grains you should give it a try. I think the result is better than using flaked grains...

Cheers!

 

[Dgallo]

Unless you want a really dry beer, I'd boost the OG some. I'd be worried it's going to taste thin with such a low OG. I wouldn't go below 1.060 minimum for NEIPA. Juice/1318 are good choices for lower OG beers as they leave more sweetness and fullness in the finish.

1.012 isn’t very dry. I’ve degassed treehouse and trillium recently and they all were 1.010-1.013. I have a feeling they are using high protein grains and finishing lower to give the light but full and fluffy mouthfeel. At close to 20% flaked adjuncts he should be alright.

I also just figured he wanted a lower abv beer with the lower og

 

[TheMadKing]

Chances are the 3 oz at 5' added as much or more bitterness than the 0.5 oz at 60'.

So either stick with the 60' hops but push those 5' hops to the whirlpool at 180 and let it drop to 170 over 10-15 min. Then add your 2nd whirlpool hops at 170-160 and leave at that (a little heating may be required) for 20-30' before chilling down to pitching temps.

Edit: fully agree, but I deleted the comment when I realized this thread was 2 years old

But Incidentally, also brewing a NEIPA tomorrow and only using flaked barley as an adjunct. I added white wheat and golden naked oats because I love them, and the hops will be Apollo for bittering and a small 5 min addition for some grapefruit, and then Citra Simcoe Mosaic for the real fireworks

 

[IslandLizard]

If you have never done an neipa using all malted grains you should give it a try. I think the result is better than using flaked grains...

Cheers!

What makes you say that? Why steer away from raw/flaked grain? Have you compared them?
What grain bill would you suggest?

 

[Moose_MI]

Thanks everyone..appreciate the discussion...a couple thoughts..

Yes, I’d like to stay a little lower ABV 5-5.5%

Interesting thought on the All malted grains option. I think im going to keep the flaked this time but i will keep this in mind. I dont care about haze to be honest..it’s the mouthfeel, body, and head retention I’m more interested in

Pushing the 7day hop back to a couple days before kegging..Got It!..i like that!

Thanks all

 

[TheMadKing]

What makes you say that? Why steer away from raw/flaked grain? Have you compared them?
What grain bill would you suggest?

I like a 50/50 mix of 2 Row and wheat with about 1/4lb of orange flavored metamucil in it. Nothing gives you a thick mouthfeel like psyllium husk and a citrus punch like powdered tang

 

[IslandLizard]

1/4lb of orange flavored metamucil

Seriously?

 

[TheMadKing]

Seriously?

Lol no.. Totally joking.. But someone is going to try it now

 

[Dgallo]

What makes you say that? Why steer away from raw/flaked grain? Have you compared them?
What grain bill would you suggest?

Flaked adjuncts tend to actually drop clearer faster since they are unmalted the protein chains are longer and have more molecular weights. Also Scott Jannish did some study’s with some maltsters and found that flaked grains have a greater percentage of manganese than malted grains and oxygen attaches to it easily so it’s been linked to causing increased oxidation.

 

[Moose_MI]

Lol no.. Totally joking.. But someone is going to try it now

****...I just mashed in

 

[IslandLizard]

Flaked adjuncts tend to actually drop clearer faster since they are in malted the protein chains are longer and have more molecular weights. Also Scott Jannish did some study’s with some maltsters and found that flaked grains have a greater percentage of manganese than malted grains and oxygen attaches to it easily so it’s been linked to causing increased oxidation.

I have a sack of Oat Malt, so some of that will be used instead of flaked, hopefully tomorrow.
How does 8% oat malt, 8% wheat malt and 8% C20 sound?
Simpson's Golden Promise for the balance, or use Rahr 2-row, for possibly higher protein?

 

[Dgallo]

I have a sack of Oat Malt, so some of that will be used instead of flaked, hopefully tomorrow.
How does 8% oat malt, 8% wheat malt and 8% C20 sound?
Simpson's Golden Promise for the balance, or use Rahr 2-row, for possibly higher protein?

I tend to used honey malt but c20 is very similar to that. I’d drop the c20 to between 3-5% depending on what srm you’re targeting and just aim for 20% for your wheat and malted oat combo. Golden promise vs 2row for me is always a srm question. In NEIPA, my pallet can’t pick up the subtle difference in flavor Between the two

 

[day_trippr]

Flaked adjuncts tend to actually drop clearer faster since they are in malted the protein chains are longer and have more molecular weights. Also Scott Jannish did some study’s with some maltsters and found that flaked grains have a greater percentage of manganese than malted grains and oxygen attaches to it easily so it’s been linked to causing increased oxidation.

^All of that^ Thanks!

And, yes, I did one batch of the same recipe but substituting malted oats and malted wheat for the flaked. Still enjoying it, and it just seems to have even longer legs than my usual version. Which, being as the visitor traffic is virtually zilch these days, is important...

Cheers!

 

[Moose_MI]

Brew day went well...but...Houston, we have a problem....

I used Lallemand New England for first time....and I’m now reading that the 11g pack is not intended to ferment 5G of average gravity beer? WTF? 3 packs to ferment 5G? I do rehydrate and I did pure O2 aerate ... I guess well see what happens.

 

[TheMadKing]

Brew day went well...but...Houston, we have a problem....

I used Lallemand New England for first time....and I’m now reading that the 11g pack is not intended to ferment 5G of average gravity beer? WTF? 3 packs to ferment 5G? I do rehydrate and I did pure O2 aerate ... I guess well see what happens.

Wtf.. I just used lallemand Kolsch yeast and didn't notice that...thanks for the heads up!

Edit: Can confirm big chutes... 11g packet but they recommend 100g per hL of wort which equates to 19g per 5 gallons on the Koln Kolsch yeast

 

[IslandLizard]

Brew day went well...but...Houston, we have a problem....

I used Lallemand New England for first time....and I’m now reading that the 11g pack is not intended to ferment 5G of average gravity beer? WTF? 3 packs to ferment 5G? I do rehydrate and I did pure O2 aerate ... I guess well see what happens.

11g packet but they recommend 100g per hL of wort which equates to 19g per 5 gallons on the Koln Kolsch yeast

5 cents worth of yeast (if that) and they can't just double the amount for the correct pitch? Packaging price stays the same.
I'm still using WY1318 from a $7 pouch I bought over 4 years ago at my LHBS... At least 20 pitches in, still counting, with 10 jars of stock in the fridge.

 

[stickyfinger]

Its the lower og that i worry about. Desired sweetness is very relative though. Some like very dry some syrupy. I dont generally like ipa with an OG lower than 1.060

1.012 isn’t very dry. I’ve degassed treehouse and trillium recently and they all were 1.010-1.013. I have a feeling they are using high protein grains and finishing lower to give the light but full and fluffy mouthfeel. At close to 20% flaked adjuncts he should be alright.

I also just figured he wanted a lower abv beer with the lower og

 

[Moose_MI]

Brew day went well...but...Houston, we have a problem....

I used Lallemand New England for first time....and I’m now reading that the 11g pack is not intended to ferment 5G of average gravity beer? WTF? 3 packs to ferment 5G? I do rehydrate and I did pure O2 aerate ... I guess well see what happens.

UPDATE....Not much activity at 24 hr but at 36 I have a nice krausen and air lock activity. I pitched at 63F and Im holding at 65F for now. The data sheet says this yeast can have a little longer lag so maybe this is normal