Need a recipe for use with WLP773 Scottish Cider

[Drewed]

I just found out that my order of WLP773 Scottish Cider yeast has shipped. I'm going to dive right in and make a 5+ gallon batch. I have a source of good cider - a local orchard freezes a bunch and it is still decent when thawed. OG is ~1.040. Should I add some corn sugar, brown sugar, sugar in the raw, corn syrup, or just let it fly? I definitely want a cider taste, but some alcohol is a good thing.

 

[bernardsmith]

To each their own but a gravity of 1.040 has a potential ABV of 5.25 %. That ain't wine but that means you can drink this by the pint.. and isn't that the best way to drink cider? You want to up the gravity? Freeze the juice and collect the runnings as it thaws. The first 1/3 of the runnings will double the SG (1.080). That is not an inexpensive way to make apple wine but you are not cutting the flavor with corn or molasses or beet sugar

 

[Maylar]

If White Labs' spec of 80% attenuation is correct, that will leave you with less than 5%. I think I'd bring it up to 1.050 with corn sugar.

 

[Drewed]

Oops, yeah, forgot that. It will supposedly do 80% attenuation in 12 Plato apple juice. 12 Plato is about 1.048. If my math is correct that should net me only 4.2 abv - with a starting gravity of 1040.

I think I need to up the SG to 1.050. Corn sugar or frozen concentrate or other?

 

[Maylar]

Concentrate. Good idea.

 

[MarkKF]

To each their own but a gravity of 1.040 has a potential ABV of 5.25 %. That ain't wine but that means you can drink this by the pint.. and isn't that the best way to drink cider? You want to up the gravity? Freeze the juice and collect the runnings as it thaws. The first 1/3 of the runnings will double the SG (1.080). That is not an inexpensive way to make apple wine but you are not cutting the flavor with corn or molasses or beet sugar

I love this idea!

 

[rivalry15]

I've got a few packets on the way too. I just made 6 gallons of cider apple cider so I'm not what I will do with this. I'm thinking maybe a pomegranate cider or something along those lines.

 

[dmtaylor]

I would just add about 1 pound of sugar, then roll. Simple as that. Give it a good 6 weeks to ferment out. Low and slow is best, about 55-60 F.

 

[Drewed]

I just had a thought on this....
If the yeast poops out due to hitting tolerance, adding more sugar shouldn't start fermentation again, so will it bottle carbonate?

 

[dmtaylor]

Hard to say for sure. Sometimes a tired yeast will stay alive but it could take 3-4 months to carbonate. Other times it doesn't do anything. About a 50/50 chance for truly tired yeast.

 

[rivalry15]

Anyone using this stuff yet?
I have 6 gallons bubbling away now, and I'm surprised how strong it's going while being kept at 60 degrees compared to wlp002. Might need to cool it even lower to slow it down.

 

[Drewed]

I also have about 6 gallons bubbling away. I ended up adding 3 cans of frozen apple juice and a pound of corn sugar to get the SG up to 1050.
I have it chugging along at about 60-62 ( basement temp.) Mine kind of smells, sort of like apple juice and rhino farts. I've been feeding it Fermaid -O and shaking the crap out of it to rid it of the sulfur. Smells bad, tastes really nice at only 4.2% ABV.....

 

[rivalry15]

Yea mine has the same smell to it. Unexpected won't affect it in the end

 

[madscientist451]

Over the last few years, I've run many trials using different apple juice blends and many different yeasts. I've used ale, saison, cider, wine and wild yeasts. At this point, my conclusion is that different yeasts are somewhat interesting, but to get really good cider the variety of apples that are used are way more important than the yeast.
If you have a really good cider apple blend, you don't have to add any yeast, the wild yeast does fine. Alright, your wild yeast "might" do fine, but since its unpredictable, it might not.
If your juice blend isn't very good, the kind of yeast doesn't really matter. These are just my observations using the apples I can get in this area. Your results will probably be different depending on many factors including what your individual taste preferences are.
My favorite yeasts for cider at this point are: Cider house Select dry yeast. WL 002 ale yeast, and WL english Cider yeast.
I am going to order some WLP 773 and keep it alive until late next fall, when I can get the best juice, and run yet more trials.
Hoping to hear from other cidermakers soon how this blend is working out.

 

[blasterooni]

Over the last few years, I've run many trials using different apple juice blends and many different yeasts. I've used ale, saison, cider, wine and wild yeasts. At this point, my conclusion is that different yeasts are somewhat interesting, but to get really good cider the variety of apples that are used are way more important than the yeast.
If you have a really good cider apple blend, you don't have to add any yeast, the wild yeast does fine. Alright, your wild yeast "might" do fine, but since its unpredictable, it might not.
If your juice blend isn't very good, the kind of yeast doesn't really matter. These are just my observations using the apples I can get in this area. Your results will probably be different depending on many factors including what your individual taste preferences are.
My favorite yeasts for cider at this point are: Cider house Select dry yeast. WL 002 ale yeast, and WL english Cider yeast.
I am going to order some WLP 773 and keep it alive until late next fall, when I can get the best juice, and run yet more trials.
Hoping to hear from other cidermakers soon how this blend is working out.

How did you like 773?

I know this thread is quite old, but I should add that I'm loving 773. I ferment at room temp. Both times I've used it, the cider still has a great apple taste, even with store bought juice (I use mostly gravenstein juice from Berkeley bowl, a local grocery store). My notes on the last batch say "soft and refreshing, clean with no evident off flavors, apple taste still abundant, not too tannic, good acidity." Obviously, some the tasting notes are based on the apples. It ferments to 1.000-1.002, and took about 2 weeks to get there. I racked at 1.002, FG was 1.001-ish.SG was 1.060. I did use ferm-k at the beginning and at 1/3 sugar break. It flocculates fairly well, but I used fining agents to get it fully clear. I kegged it.

 

[Maylar]

My 773 batch came out very nice. Scored a 37 with it in a comp.

 

[blasterooni]

My 773 batch came out very nice. Scored a 37 with it in a comp.

I take it that 37 is good? Never been to nor know about competitions...

 

[Maylar]

I take it that 37 is good? Never been to nor know about competitions...

37 out of 50. Not a medal winner but yes, very good. One of the judges commented, "I'd buy it".

 

[blasterooni]

37 out of 50. Not a medal winner but yes, very good. One of the judges commented, "I'd buy it".

Going off topic for a second...If you don't mind me asking, what were some of the flaws if any, and what category did you compete in? I'm nowhere near that level of cider making, but I'd like to be at some point. I think I like to mess around with different techniques too often, and haven't settled on one thing just yet. Although, I am liking this "lagering" technique I'm trying out at the moment.

 

[Maylar]

Going off topic for a second...If you don't mind me asking, what were some of the flaws if any, and what category did you compete in? I'm nowhere near that level of cider making, but I'd like to be at some point. I think I like to mess around with different techniques too often, and haven't settled on one thing just yet. Although, I am liking this "lagering" technique I'm trying out at the moment.

I make straight up cider, using fresh pressed juices from local cider mills. It's an October/November activity here in New England, as that's when the late season apples are ripe. Always carbonated via keg, slightly sweet (my preference). Been experimenting with different yeasts for 10 years, still looking for the elusive perfect one. The WLP-773 had appeal because of it's claim to leave residual sweetness, but that proved to be BS. It went dry like any other yeast would.

I enter style C1A, New World Cider, per the BJCP guidelines: https://www.bjcp.org/docs/2015_Guidelines_Cider.pdf

Sometimes I get reports of off flavors like sulfur, or green apple that might be indicative of a process flaw, but most often it's lack of tannin and/or acid that keeps my score down. This year's batch has aged a few months on oak, we'll see if that changes anything.

 

[blasterooni]

I make straight up cider, using fresh pressed juices from local cider mills. It's an October/November activity here in New England, as that's when the late season apples are ripe. Always carbonated via keg, slightly sweet (my preference). Been experimenting with different yeasts for 10 years, still looking for the elusive perfect one. The WLP-773 had appeal because of it's claim to leave residual sweetness, but that proved to be BS. It went dry like any other yeast would.

I enter style C1A, New World Cider, per the BJCP guidelines: https://www.bjcp.org/docs/2015_Guidelines_Cider.pdf

Sometimes I get reports of off flavors like sulfur, or green apple that might be indicative of a process flaw, but most often it's lack of tannin and/or acid that keeps my score down. This year's batch has aged a few months on oak, we'll see if that changes anything.

Thanks Maylar! Seems that the lack of tannin or acid must be the apples? As far as a process flaw, would it be not aging long enough?

This will be my second year making cider, and I hope to get a good variety of apples this year. Last year, I was late in the game, mostly due to being a super noob, getting apples, and only got 3 bushels, or was it 4...? Anyhow, this year will hopefully be different. I have to find out which orchards have what apples so I can get at least a few bushels of each. Lots of prep to do!

 

[Maylar]

Thanks Maylar! Seems that the lack of tannin or acid must be the apples? As far as a process flaw, would it be not aging long enough?

Yes, I have relied on the apples for my acid and tannin and even though the cider mill adds crab apples sometimes or quince, some judges think it's just not complex enough. Process flaws can be warm ferment (too fast), which I now have control of, lack of nutrient (sulfur), oxidation, or contaminants (don't leave a paper towel in your keg lol).

The competitions happen in Oct/Nov too which means my cider is almost a year old by then. I could age some longer, but it never seems to last long at my house...

 

[blasterooni]

The competitions happen in Oct/Nov too which means my cider is almost a year old by then. I could age some longer, but it never seems to last long at my house...

Ha! Same here, a 5 gallon corny lasts 3-5 days depending a few factors like ABV, taste, or if it's the weekend. I'm looking for one or two year 10-15 gallon primary fermenters...