MrMalty. I don't really like him.

[boydster]

Cervid, seriously, you are driving these threads downhill like it's your job. I subscribed to this thread before you posted to it, and as soon as you started posting it was clear this was going the same direction as the yeast rinsing discussion that you blessed with your presence. If you don't like the community, no one is forcing you to hang around. Maybe consider the possibility that everyone else isn't the problem, though.

 

[ArcLight]

I'm starting to realize that's how the bulk of the community is here. If you have the opposite opinion if the wrong person, they take it personal and attack you. I'm about to quit these forums and join the aha's. I'm glad i didn't pay this site for support, the community sucks, for the most past.

You should read the way you post. How you misinterpret things and blow up at people. You need to step back and calm down and not assume everyone is out to get you.


You did indeed post that Brewing Classic Styles was all wrong, and that the IBUs are off. You are entitled to your opinion, but if Jamil Zainasheff got every recipe wrong with respect to ingredients that would be pretty bad. But I don't think thats the case as most of the ones I've tried from that book are ok.

 

[Swarley88]

I'm starting to realize that's how the bulk of the community is here. If you have the opposite opinion if the wrong person, they take it personal and attack you. I'm about to quit these forums and join the aha's. I'm glad i didn't pay this site for support, the community sucks, for the most past.

Maybe it is because you react like everyone is against you. Just by browsing on this thread alone I see you obviously have a problem communicating with people and take offense from nothing.

If you can't get along/ don't want to, take a hike buddy go over to Aha, noone will stop you. This community will be better without you.

 

[Swarley88]

Also I am sorry, I just don't like to see people ruining good things because they are unhappy or just want to argue. I mean come on, this site has great people and great information. To say it doesn't is just idiotic.

 

[Komocabo]

Amen. Great, helpful people. I love this place!

 

[progmac]

I'm starting to realize that's how the bulk of the community is here. If you have the opposite opinion if the wrong person, they take it personal and attack you. I'm about to quit these forums and join the aha's. I'm glad i didn't pay this site for support, the community sucks, for the most past.

I think if you read through the first three pages of this thread, you'll see a spirited but respectful discussion on the topic of yeast pitch rates. Then on the fourth page, the bickering turns personal -- for example saying that posters have 'comprehension problems' for having a different view.

We're all just trying to figure out how to make the best beer that we can. We should treat each other like friends.

 

[LandoLincoln]

I think if you read through the first three pages of this thread, you'll see a spirited but respectful discussion on the topic of yeast pitch rates. Then on the fourth page, the bickering turns personal -- for example saying that posters have 'comprehension problems' for having a different view.

We're all just trying to figure out how to make the best beer that we can. We should treat each other like friends.

And hey, if they don't want to take my advice and instead would prefer to ruin their beer with insufficient pitching rates, that's fine too. This is America! People are allowed to be as dumb as they like!

I'm not helping this situation, am I.

 

[TimelessCynic]

Wow. I don't even have the patience to read about all this personal stuff it bores the F out of me. Was surprised too see soo many new posts though. Anyhow. I have another question/observation that should put this thread back on track. I think it could be interesting.

So i like to use my cold room during the initial stage of fermentation when the activity is crazy. Right now the room is around 55F. The thermometer sticker i have on the side of the carboy shows 60F. The recommended temperature range on the yeast packet is 62 - 74 F.

Lets assume we trust the conclusion in the link provided in the second post on this thread that RM-MN posted. Basically it states that under pitching results in more ester formation and over pitch in less.

So in my understanding of things higher than recommended fermentation temperatures result in additional unwanted ester formation and lower than recommended fermentation temperatures would do what? The opposite; less ester formation?

So what would happen if i fermented at less than recommended fermentation temperatures and i under pitched? Would the two assumptions cancel each other out and produce a more better beer? The two assumptions being that lower temperatures lead to less esters and lower pitching rates lead to more esters.

Please do not say i will have a stalled fermentation. Unless the yeast freezes or i try a 1.12 OG wort I don't think that could happen to me.

Thanks people

 

[Qhrumphf]

Wow. I don't even have the patience to read about all this personal stuff it bores the F out of me. Was surprised too see soo many new posts though. Anyhow. I have another question/observation that should put this thread back on track. I think it could be interesting.

So i like to use my cold room during the initial stage of fermentation when the activity is crazy. Right now the room is around 55F. The thermometer sticker i have on the side of the carboy shows 60F. The recommended temperature range on the yeast packet is 62 - 74 F.

Lets assume we trust the conclusion in the link provided in the second post on this thread that RM-MN posted. Basically it states that under pitching results in more ester formation and over pitch in less.

So in my understanding of things higher than recommended fermentation temperatures result in additional unwanted ester formation and lower than recommended fermentation temperatures would do what? The opposite; less ester formation?

So what would happen if i fermented at less than recommended fermentation temperatures and i under pitched? Would the two assumptions cancel each other out and produce a more better beer? The two assumptions being that lower temperatures lead to less esters and lower pitching rates lead to more esters.

Please do not say i will have a stalled fermentation. Unless the yeast freezes or i try a 1.12 OG wort I don't think that could happen to me.

Thanks people

I'd say that depending on the yeast and a bunch of other factors it can go a number of ways.

-No guarantee of stalled fermentation, but its possible. Especially if you're below the yeasts tolerance as fermentation dies down. You'll probably get some minor underattenuation.

-Some yeasts going colder brings out phenols. It may be something you want in the beer, it may not. I underpitch and ferment cold with Weizen beers for this reason.

-I would definitely expect a higher relative level of diacetyl.

That's what I've got off the top of my head.

 

[progmac]

if you're underpitching and keeping it cool, make sure to aerate/oxygenate well!

 

[TimelessCynic]

if you're underpitching and keeping it cool, make sure to aerate/oxygenate well!

I use the wine degasser attached to a drill. I go through about 5 separate 5 second vortexes. Other than pure oxygen and a half micron aeration diffuser i don't know what to do. I bailed on buying that stuff cause i didnt think it was worth it. I got the cash but I wanted to keep my cleaning down.

Any thoughts?

 

[LandoLincoln]

The wine degasser will probably do the job.

 

[Cyclman]

I am a big fan of O2 injection. For $50, after temp. control and a good pitch, it's the best predictor of good fermentations, IMO.

I use the beersmith yeast calculator, has worked well for me.

I like to do big beers, dubbels, quads, doppelbocks, imperials, so maybe those are more affected by O2.

I can say with O2 injection, I've not had any bad fermentations.

 

[g-star]

So what would happen if i fermented at less than recommended fermentation temperatures and i under pitched?

You can expect:

Excess levels of diacetyl
Increase in higher/fusel alcohol formation
Excessive ester formation
Increase in volatile sulfur compounds
High terminal gravities
Stuck fermentations
Increased risk of infection

Would the two assumptions cancel each other out and produce a more better beer? The two assumptions being that lower temperatures lead to less esters and lower pitching rates lead to more esters.

No. Pitch rates, O2 levels, and fermentation temperature/kinetics have been studied and peer reviewed at a high scientific level for at least 100 years. The optimal parameters for each of these variables has been well established through rigorous study. Go outside more than one of these ranges, and you risk one or all of the negative outcomes listed above.