The good news is that cleaning your equipment is more important than sanitizing it. If there isn't any residue left in the fermenter or bottles, then you will likely get acceptable beer even without sanitizing. The reverse is also true, if you have dirty equipment and only use a sanitizer, you might still get infected beer.
Mold in Sanitizer
- Thread starter Mekchu
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Even Charlie Talley said this in a podcast - sanitizer is insurance. But I really like the insurance.
Iodine based sanitizers also don't store well.
Mekchu
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the observation. Yeah, I'm ready to do a military style shutdown of operations to review procedures. I think I'm off storing sanitizers/cleaners for a while.
Mekchu
Well-Known Member
I can't argue with that or Charlie Tally. I tasted my brown ale today. I was planning to let it condition for 4 weeks but decided to try it today. In a word it was gorgeous. First time with this recipe but it was everything I was looking for. Nutty, biscuit flavor, great mouth feel, spot on carbonation. I feel a little silly talking up my beer, but what I'm trying to say is that even when you use old cleanser as a sanitizer you can make pretty good beer. Beer, indeed, is forgiving.
A working solution of Starsan can be stored for several months, even longer.
To prevent mold growth in the headspace you need to use it from time to time. Mop the headspace sides and lid with it and there you are, re-sanitized! Good for another few weeks!
There's really nothing that can grow in Starsan itself, not even mold.
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Would you please share your recipe? That sounds like heaven, my second favorite beer style. Miabock being first.
Mekchu
Well-Known Member
Brown Ale
from John Palmer, How to Brew. I've had good luck with his recipes.
7 lbs. pale ale malt (i use maris otter)
2 lbs. amber malt
0.5 lb. crystal 60L malt
0.25 lb. chocolate malt
BG for 6.5 gal. 1.041
OG for 5.5 gal. 1.049
60 min. boil
Hops
0.5 oz. Nugget (12%) 60 min.
0.5 oz. Willamette (5%) 15 min.
Yeast
WLP13 London Ale, Primary fermenter at 68 for 2 weeks.
Mash - Single - Temp. Infusion
152F for 60 min.
He calls it Oak Butt Brown Ale. I'm not sure how long it took him to come up with such a horrible name, but I doubt he could make it worse with more thought. Nevertheless, I absolutely love my first batch. Good luck and cheers!
I might have that book. I don't think I ever brewed that though. I was planning to ask the questions you have been asking about Starsan. I might go back to hot water for sanitizing. If I knew how to store my tubing properly it would almost be unnecessary to sanitize. I stored them in Starsan and now they are milky and funky looking.
SanAequitas
Member
StarSan is a mix of acids. Not all tubing is going to be fully resistant to that, especially if you let it sit in it for a while. I always rinse any non-glass stuff before storing it.
Mekchu
Well-Known Member
I've used my tubing far longer than recommended. I clean/sanitize before and after use. Before I put tubing away I take it outside hold it in the center and whip in a circle as hard/fast as I can. this drives most of the fluid out the ends. I than hang them in an upside down U shape. They seem to dry well enough and have not yet grown anything funky.
D.B.Moody
Well-Known Member
I can't say that what I do is proper, but for over 25 years my tubing has been washed, rinsed, and draped over a post of the shelving that holds, among other things, brewing supplies in a closet in my basement. I've never had an infection. My experience is that at least with simple equipment cleanliness is enough.
Edit: M posted while I was writing. I do the whirling thing too. But I do not reclean before use.
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I wouldn't let that stop me from using Star San. Just store tubing dry and sanitize just before using. I leave mine hanging so it can dry out.
NSMikeD
Well-Known Member
I found that the combination of oxy (one step ) and contact acid (star San) can lower over all cost. One step does the heavy lifting and will kill a good amount of germs. (Hospitals prefer to use an oxy as a disinfectant) and I never had an issue using it as the only cleans sanitizer. But that got expensive and yet it has a short shelf life.
now I make up a gal of one step (1 tbl ). And 2 qts of starsan (2ml). Everything gets a good cleaning with one step and a soak. Then the fermenter or keg gets a goods swish of star san before going into the spray bottle. Everything else gets a spray as I go.
I find this combination very economical and effective.
now I make up a gal of one step (1 tbl ). And 2 qts of starsan (2ml). Everything gets a good cleaning with one step and a soak. Then the fermenter or keg gets a goods swish of star san before going into the spray bottle. Everything else gets a spray as I go.
I find this combination very economical and effective.
All great info. I use powdered Oxyclean and TSP in a 7:3 ratio. 3 oz of nonphosphate TSP and 7 oz of Oxyclean. I was looking to see if Oxyclean would suffice as a sanitizer a year ago at the beginning of the Scamdemic when I still believed. I found the recipe as a substitute for PWB. We call it magic goo now because it cleans like a mofo. When I started brewing around 1990 I used boiling water and tongs to sanitize tubing and everything else that needs sanitizing.
I just happened across this. I hope some of the smart chemistry guys weigh in here. It seems like it would be safe for a sanitizer but what do I know?
"The solution should be diluted to prevent tissue damage. The recipe from the CPG is for a “half strength” that then gets diluted for actual use. Only make up the solution as needed. The components store perfectly fine on their own. The recipe is 1L of boiled water(let cool to room temp before use to prevent burns to casualty), 5ml (or 1tsp) of household unscented bleach, and 1/2 tsp of baking soda. Dilute this 1:10 with water for use. Dakins solution should be used liberally for full effect." Dakins solution
"The solution should be diluted to prevent tissue damage. The recipe from the CPG is for a “half strength” that then gets diluted for actual use. Only make up the solution as needed. The components store perfectly fine on their own. The recipe is 1L of boiled water(let cool to room temp before use to prevent burns to casualty), 5ml (or 1tsp) of household unscented bleach, and 1/2 tsp of baking soda. Dilute this 1:10 with water for use. Dakins solution should be used liberally for full effect." Dakins solution
Starsan is just phosphoric acid with a surfactant. It is not a mixture of acids.
The building blocks of life are: Carbon, Nitrogen, and Phosphorus. Look up the Redfield Ratio if you're interested, that is the relative amount of each of those components in typical lifeforms. Adding phosphoric acid to water and then having that solution in the presence of air (it contains carbon and nitrogen) and you have what's necessary to support life.
The big problem with Starsan is that it does not kill mold spores. As the OP found out, they can eventually take hold and grow...even in this solution of "sanitizer".
The building blocks of life are: Carbon, Nitrogen, and Phosphorus. Look up the Redfield Ratio if you're interested, that is the relative amount of each of those components in typical lifeforms. Adding phosphoric acid to water and then having that solution in the presence of air (it contains carbon and nitrogen) and you have what's necessary to support life.
The big problem with Starsan is that it does not kill mold spores. As the OP found out, they can eventually take hold and grow...even in this solution of "sanitizer".
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