Mash tun size help

[DonGavlar]

Hi Guys,

My first extract batch is only a week away from bottling time, it was great fun brewing but I'm already determined to start an all grain batch.

I've spent the last few week browsing these forums and trying to learn as much as I can on all grain brewing before jumping in.

From my current set up I've learnt that I'm going to need to upgrade my 5 gallon kettle to an 8 gallon+ one and also get myself a mash tun and an HTL.

Now, on the site I buy most of my brewing goods (not much choice here in the UK) they do 2 all grain starter kits. One is a 7 gallon tun and HTL and the second is a 10 gallon tun and htl.

As im only making 5 gallon batches, should i go for the 7 or the 10? the 10 is quite a bit more money and im guessing will take up a lot more room in the storage.

Im happy to go for the 10 if that what i will need but I'd rathe rstick with the smaller and cheaper set if theres no need for me to have a 10 gallon set up.

Any help would be greatly appriciated.

Thanks

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

A big part of the answer to that is whether you think you'll ever make "big" beers. If you think you'll want to brew some high ABV stuff, you'll want more room in the MLT. I use a 50 Qt rectangular cooler for my MLT, line it with a brew bag and just have a high heat rated hose stuck in the standard drain valve hole. It's a tight fit and does not leak. Put a ball valve in that hose and you've got a MLT.

For the HLT, I just use a 5 gallon round beverage cooler with a hose clamped on the standard output valve.

For process:
Put Brew Bag in MLT
Preheat the MLT with hot tap water.
Dump hot tap water.
Drain strike water from kettle (heated to strike temp) into MLT
Stir in the grains.
Mash (and heat sparge water during mash)
Move sparge water to HLT
Drain first runnings to kettle and start burner
Drain HLT to MLT for batch sparge
Stir like heck
Drain MLT to Kettle

Also, for 5 gallon batches, I strongly recommend a 10G kettle.

If you go with a 15G kettle, you can just BIAB, which is every bit as effective and requires less equipment. My only beef with BIAB is keeping the mash temp even. Many wrap a coat or sleeping bag around the kettle to insulate.

Good luck. Once you go full grain, extract will seem boring and lifeless.

 

[DonGavlar]

A big part of the answer to that is whether you think you'll ever make "big" beers. If you think you'll want to brew some high ABV stuff, you'll want more room in the MLT. I use a 50 Qt rectangular cooler for my MLT, line it with a brew bag and just have a high heat rated hose stuck in the standard drain valve hole. It's a tight fit and does not leak. Put a ball valve in that hose and you've got a MLT.

For the HLT, I just use a 5 gallon round beverage cooler with a hose clamped on the standard output valve.

For process:
Put Brew Bag in MLT
Preheat the MLT with hot tap water.
Dump hot tap water.
Drain strike water from kettle (heated to strike temp) into MLT
Stir in the grains.
Mash (and heat sparge water during mash)
Move sparge water to HLT
Drain first runnings to kettle and start burner
Drain HLT to MLT for batch sparge
Stir like heck
Drain MLT to Kettle

Also, for 5 gallon batches, I strongly recommend a 10G kettle.

If you go with a 15G kettle, you can just BIAB, which is every bit as effective and requires less equipment. My only beef with BIAB is keeping the mash temp even. Many wrap a coat or sleeping bag around the kettle to insulate.

Good luck. Once you go full grain, extract will seem boring and lifeless.

Great info thanks. yeah I definitely will be brewing some high ABV beers. I was also looking at brewing a barley wine.

Hmm, I actually have only briefly looked into BIAB method. Perhaps spending the money on just a 15g kettle may be wiser for me as it would save storage space etc.

I'll have to look into that. But as for a mash tun I'm better off looking at even bigger than 10 gallons? I'm from the UK so very unfamiliar with quarts. I am right in thinking 50 quarts is about 15 US gallons?

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Great info thanks. yeah I definitely will be brewing some high ABV beers. I was also looking at brewing a barley wine.

Hmm, I actually have only briefly looked into BIAB method. Perhaps spending the money on just a 15g kettle may be wiser for me as it would save storage space etc.

I'll have to look into that. But as for a mash tun I'm better off looking at even bigger than 10 gallons? I'm from the UK so very unfamiliar with quarts. I am right in thinking 50 quarts is about 15 US gallons?

4 quarts to a gallon, so 40 quarts is 10 gallons. 50 is 12.5 gallons.

Check out the BIAB forum for great info on that process. What I use is a hybrid....I mash in a bag, but use a cooler to hold temp. In an ideal world, I'd have a SS insulated 15G kettle that's heated with an electric heating element. I could heat the strike water, BIAB with little to no heat loss, pull the bag and boil in the same vessel.

 

[DonGavlar]

4 quarts to a gallon, so 40 quarts is 10 gallons. 50 is 12.5 gallons.

Check out the BIAB forum for great info on that process. What I use is a hybrid....I mash in a bag, but use a cooler to hold temp. In an ideal world, I'd have a SS insulated 15G kettle that's heated with an electric heating element. I could heat the strike water, BIAB with little to no heat loss, pull the bag and boil in the same vessel.

Thanks.

After doing some scanning around on BIAB articles, videos etc I'm thinking it may be a good idea for me to try out a few BIAB batches before going down the 3 vessel path. Would save a lot of storage space, cleaning and possibly money.

From what I've read, both methods seem to produce similar quality of beers.

 

[Bombo80]

When I started out 30 years ago, I picked up one of the 33qt black enamel canning pots. I still use it today, along with my new Spike Brewing 10gal stainless pot.

Just a suggestion. You might be able to find one at a local hardware store.

 

[Droot]

I have been brewing 10 gallon batches with a 7.5 gallon mash tun. It will hold 24 pounds of grain. This makes about a 1.066 wort for 12.5 gallons after brewing. I usually use 20 lbs. Grain.

With a 5 gallon system a 10 gallon mash tun is too big.

If you a are going to grow bigger, then why wait?

David

 

[DonGavlar]

I have been brewing 10 gallon batches with a 7.5 gallon mash tun. It will hold 24 pounds of grain. This makes about a 1.066 wort for 12.5 gallons after brewing. I usually use 20 lbs. Grain.

With a 5 gallon system a 10 gallon mash tun is too big.

If you a are going to grow bigger, then why wait?

David

would having a 10g tun hinder the production of a 5 gallon batch? its just I've read a few times that even with 5 gallon batches its better off having a larger tun, especially if i was to make some high ABV beers/ large grain bill beers.

The other thing i was think was even if i was to get a 10g tun, it probably wouldn't suffice if i was to move up to 10g batches.

Thanks for the reply

 

[eric19312]

would having a 10g tun hinder the production of a 5 gallon batch? its just I've read a few times that even with 5 gallon batches its better off having a larger tun, especially if i was to make some high ABV beers/ large grain bill beers.

The other thing i was think was even if i was to get a 10g tun, it probably wouldn't suffice if i was to move up to 10g batches.

Thanks for the reply

When I brewed in a cooler I found be mash held temperature best when the cooler was nearly full. For 5 gallon batches I'd think that 7.5 gallon tun would be fine. Check out the "can I mash it?" tool on this page to think about grain bill vs volume needed in mash tun. https://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml

I do like your idea of trying out BIAB before going down the 3 vessel path. I doubt you will ever regret having invested in a large kettle even if you decide BIAB is not for you.

One thing is for the big beers there are a number of tricks to get to higher strength wort in a system undersized for that beer. Easiest is to bump the OG with dry malt extract. Next you could work with thicker mash. I've managed as low as 1 quart per pound to really maximize grist in tun. You could combine two mashes in the boil kettle. Once I did that and put first runnings from both mashes into the primary big beer and secondary runnings from both mashes into the smaller beer. You could brew a 3 gallon batch of that huge barley wine as who really wants 5 gallons of barley wine... Lots of options so I'd recommend designing your brewing equipment to best fit the beers you brew most often.

 

[RM-MN]

Since you have made a batch of extract beer you have everything you need to "get your feet wet" with all grain except for a bag for doing a half size batch via BIAB. A paint strainer bag or one you make yourself from "swiss voille" curtain material will be all you need to get started to see if all grain is for you. I make 2 1/2 gallon batches in my 5 gallon (20 litre) pot. Thats enough for a case of beer.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Thanks.

After doing some scanning around on BIAB articles, videos etc I'm thinking it may be a good idea for me to try out a few BIAB batches before going down the 3 vessel path. Would save a lot of storage space, cleaning and possibly money.

From what I've read, both methods seem to produce similar quality of beers.

There is zero difference in the resulting beer with BIAB vs 2 or 3 vessel. Same base process, just a different way to get there. I don't do BIAB because I bought a used multi vessel setup from a guy who turned pro and doesn't homebrew anymore. Even so, I now use a bag in my MLT and would probably switch to BIAB if my kettle was bigger. 10G is really tight for anything other than a really low gravity brew.

 

[GrogNerd]

along with the can I mash it calculator, there's good info here: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=123585

 

[DonGavlar]

Thanks for all the advice guys, appreciate it.

After some further digging around, and scanning both the BIAB and all grain forums, I think I've decided im going to take the 2 vessel route. This would involve batch sparging. Seeing as I already have a 5G kettle, all i would need to buy is a cooler to mash and a larger kettle to boil in.

The benefits I see in this are;

• No need to figure a way to strain the bag without the assistance of a hoist etc.
• no need to buy a 15g+ kettle. An 8 or 10 should do the job I assume.
• no need to buy a HLT as I can just heat up water as needed in the old 5G kettle.
• should't have a problem with mash temp if im using a cooler.
• The whole process seems quite simple and easy to understand to me (from watching youtube demonstrations)

My process would be to heat the water in the 5G, mash in the cooler, recirculate back into the cooler until clear wort, dump the wort into the larger kettle, rinse the grains through with heated water from the old smaller kettle into the bigger kettle, continue brewing as normal.

Thoughts?

 

[GrogNerd]

sounds like you got your poop in a group

&

 

[DurtyChemist]

I did the BIAB thing for a long time. I currently have a 3 vessel 10 gallon setup which includes two 10 gallon igloo coolers and a half barrel keg for a boil kettle. I've made a total of two 10 gallon batches so, no, a 10 gallon setup won't hinder making 5 gallon batches. It's actually easier as you can make some high gravity 5 gallon batches.

I did BIAB for at least a year before switching to a 3 vessel. When you start making bigger batches the weight of the grain and water soaked together gets heavy. You can look into adding a pulley system like most guys do. It's supposed to make things easier to lift the grain bag out. I just fully converted to a 3 vessel setup. I started with a half barrel keg making 10 gallon extract batches and then went BIAB. Having the larger boil kettle was nice to have. Less chances of a boil over and I grew into it for 10 gallon batches.

Your process sounds almost identical to what I do. The only difference is I heat my sparge water and transfer it to my HLT (10 gallon cooler) and batch sparge. I've considered switching to a gravity feed setup and fly sparging but I kind of like the single tier setup. I bought one igloo cooler off craigslist (https://nottingham.craigslist.co.uk/ I don't know if this is close to you) and another at a garage sale. I think they cost me $40 for both. I added a nice three piece ball valve and a bazooka tube to make my mash tun. You could also use a hot water heater hose. My friend has one like that and I don't think he will ever get a stuck sparge. You can always make it for less than a shop sells it for.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

Thanks for all the advice guys, appreciate it.

After some further digging around, and scanning both the BIAB and all grain forums, I think I've decided im going to take the 2 vessel route. This would involve batch sparging. Seeing as I already have a 5G kettle, all i would need to buy is a cooler to mash and a larger kettle to boil in.

The benefits I see in this are;

• No need to figure a way to strain the bag without the assistance of a hoist etc.
• no need to buy a 15g+ kettle. An 8 or 10 should do the job I assume.
• no need to buy a HLT as I can just heat up water as needed in the old 5G kettle.
• should't have a problem with mash temp if im using a cooler.
• The whole process seems quite simple and easy to understand to me (from watching youtube demonstrations)

My process would be to heat the water in the 5G, mash in the cooler, recirculate back into the cooler until clear wort, dump the wort into the larger kettle, rinse the grains through with heated water from the old smaller kettle into the bigger kettle, continue brewing as normal.

Thoughts?

Spot on. I use brew365.com to calculate strike temp and I've nailed my mash temp every time (well, within a degree). The last one was off by .1 degrees. Don't forget to preheat your mash tun with hot tap water first. Otherwise you have to try to guess how much heat you'll lose warming up the cooler.

 

[helibrewer]

Thanks for all the advice guys, appreciate it.

After some further digging around, and scanning both the BIAB and all grain forums, I think I've decided im going to take the 2 vessel route. This would involve batch sparging. Seeing as I already have a 5G kettle, all i would need to buy is a cooler to mash and a larger kettle to boil in.

The benefits I see in this are;

• No need to figure a way to strain the bag without the assistance of a hoist etc.
• no need to buy a 15g+ kettle. An 8 or 10 should do the job I assume.
• no need to buy a HLT as I can just heat up water as needed in the old 5G kettle.
• should't have a problem with mash temp if im using a cooler.
• The whole process seems quite simple and easy to understand to me (from watching youtube demonstrations)

My process would be to heat the water in the 5G, mash in the cooler, recirculate back into the cooler until clear wort, dump the wort into the larger kettle, rinse the grains through with heated water from the old smaller kettle into the bigger kettle, continue brewing as normal.

Thoughts?

You will be using that 3rd vessel even with batch sparging. Once the mash is complete you need to drain the MT into your kettle then either single sparge (all of your sparge water goes into the MT) or split it into 2 even batches, either way, the kettle has wort in it and you need that 3rd vessel for heating/holding sparge water.