Mash pH and salt additions

[Mike7431]

Hello everyone!

So, I made the jump to all grain brewing a few batches ago and haven't really looked too much into treating my water until now. I am using Chicago water from Lake Michigan and the ion level numbers that I received in the report are as follows:

Ca: 34
Mg: 12
Na: 8
SO4: 26
Cl: 14
HCO3: 112
Hardness: 134
Alkalinity: 101

Using the Residual Alkalinity Nomograph from John Palmer's "How To Brew", I determined that my water was best for brewing brown ales and porters, so that is what I have been doing. However, now that it is summertime, I want to brew some lighter colored, more refreshing beers.

Using the nomograph, I discovered that I would need a calcium addition of 165 ppm for my desired SRM. When I calculated the gypsum addition that I would need for that, I realized that it would bring my sulfate levels up to 431 ppm. That seems really high. Then I thought that I would add chalk with the gypsum but, while it would keep the sulfate levels in check, it would raise my bicarbonate levels to 305 ppm.

I wanted to know if there is a way to get my mash pH where I need it to be without raising my sulfate and bicarbonate levels too much. I'm very new to all of this and I'm trying to figure out if the water is worth messing with. I know mash pH is important but I don't want a bunch of off flavors from making salt additions.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

Thank you in advance

 

[jekeane]

if you are going to play with water then you should try using either Brunwater or EZwater calculator. You can accomplish about anything you want using one of those spreadsheets and a mix of your water and RO water from the machines outside your local supermarkets.

 

[porterpounder]

Add enough salts to get your Ca up to 50-100 ppm or so and balance the Sulfate/Chloride ratio. Then use lactic acid to adjust your mash pH from there. Easy and effective.

 

[brewkinger]

Hello everyone!

Using the Residual Alkalinity Nomograph from John Palmer's "How To Brew"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

My advice is to ignore that nomograph in the Palmer book.

Check out BrunWater and the Brew Science subforum on HBT and you will be on your way to understanding this much better.

 

[fun4stuff]

Hello everyone!

So, I made the jump to all grain brewing a few batches ago and haven't really looked too much into treating my water until now. I am using Chicago water from Lake Michigan and the ion level numbers that I received in the report are as follows:

Ca: 34
Mg: 12
Na: 8
SO4: 26
Cl: 14
HCO3: 112
Hardness: 134
Alkalinity: 101

Using the Residual Alkalinity Nomograph from John Palmer's "How To Brew", I determined that my water was best for brewing brown ales and porters, so that is what I have been doing. However, now that it is summertime, I want to brew some lighter colored, more refreshing beers.

Using the nomograph, I discovered that I would need a calcium addition of 165 ppm for my desired SRM. When I calculated the gypsum addition that I would need for that, I realized that it would bring my sulfate levels up to 431 ppm. That seems really high. Then I thought that I would add chalk with the gypsum but, while it would keep the sulfate levels in check, it would raise my bicarbonate levels to 305 ppm.

I wanted to know if there is a way to get my mash pH where I need it to be without raising my sulfate and bicarbonate levels too much. I'm very new to all of this and I'm trying to figure out if the water is worth messing with. I know mash pH is important but I don't want a bunch of off flavors from making salt additions.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated

Thank you in advance

The book is by and large outdated. Read the stickies in the brew section, particularly the water primer thread.

 

[Drk93TT]

Add enough salts to get your Ca up to 50-100 ppm or so and balance the Sulfate/Chloride ratio. Then use lactic acid to adjust your mash pH from there. Easy and effective.

This.

 

[Mike7431]

if you are going to play with water then you should try using either Brunwater or EZwater calculator. You can accomplish about anything you want using one of those spreadsheets and a mix of your water and RO water from the machines outside your local supermarkets.

Thanks for the reply! Just downloaded the Bru'n water excel document. Now i just need to figure out how to use it.

Cheers!

 

[Mike7431]

Add enough salts to get your Ca up to 50-100 ppm or so and balance the Sulfate/Chloride ratio. Then use lactic acid to adjust your mash pH from there. Easy and effective.

That does seem much easier! Haven't looked too much into adding acid to the mash, but I'm definitely going to look into it now. Is there anything that I should keep in mind if I'm going to do that?

Thanks for the reply!

 

[griffi]

Water chemistry can be a daunting challenge for the newbie. I know because I've just recently been through this. But with a little lactic acid and gypsum you should be good. Study the tabs in brunwater and you will have it under control quickly. I just pick "yellow balanced" for example, as the profile I'm shooting for and as long as you have accurately entered your water profile ( I use 100% RO), your mash water volume, and your grain bill, it is easy to see what effects a few ml of lactic and a few grams of gypsum does for you. I sometime use a little calcium chloride and Epsom Salts too since its RO water.

 

[porterpounder]

That does seem much easier! Haven't looked too much into adding acid to the mash, but I'm definitely going to look into it now. Is there anything that I should keep in mind if I'm going to do that?

Thanks for the reply!

As you have your source water values, Martin's BrunWater spreadsheet for mash additions will give you an accurate additions schedule for acid to mash and sparge water acidification taking into account buffering and other sciency stuff. It seems a bit daunting at first looking at it, but once you have your values in it is easy.

 

[Natdavis777]

+1 for Bru'n Water. Plug the numbers in and see where you stand. I wouldnt rely on historic references as we dont know how they treated there water. Brewers Friend has a nice water profile that you can input into Brun Water (Light Hoppy profile, Balanced, Light Malty, etc).

One thing I would suggest not getting attached to is a Sulfate:Chloride ratio. It has a small range where it is applicable and that is it. Actual numbers of minerals and their limits are what matters. For example a 2:1 So4:Cl could be 2:1. This could mean 20:10 or 300:150. Both will give the beer drastically different profiles. AJDelange has a good sticky in the Brew Science debunking this.

Focus on the mineral levels. If you want a balanced beer, keep So4 and CL even (say 50ppm), If you want malty, drop So4 and keep or raise the CL (dont exceed 100ppm. If you want a hop forward beer, up your So4 100 or above (I prefer 150-200ppm with 25-50 ppm CL)

Once you have these inputed in BrunWater, augment with acid until you hit your desired mash pH. If you find 150 ppm gypsum not enough, up it next time. Likewise, if you find too much bitterness, drop it next time. But It is more about the total ppm oppsosed to the ratio that counts.

 

[BigEd]

Hello everyone!

So, I made the jump to all grain brewing a few batches ago and haven't really looked too much into treating my water until now. I am using Chicago water from Lake Michigan and the ion level numbers that I received in the report are as follows:

Ca: 34
Mg: 12
Na: 8
SO4: 26
Cl: 14
HCO3: 112
Hardness: 134
Alkalinity: 101

Using the Residual Alkalinity Nomograph from John Palmer's "How To Brew", I determined that my water was best for brewing brown ales and porters, so that is what I have been doing. However, now that it is summertime, I want to brew some lighter colored, more refreshing beers.

Using the nomograph, I discovered that I would need a calcium addition of 165 ppm for my desired SRM. When I calculated the gypsum addition that I would need for that, I realized that it would bring my sulfate levels up to 431 ppm. That seems really high. Then I thought that I would add chalk with the gypsum but, while it would keep the sulfate levels in check, it would raise my bicarbonate levels to 305 ppm.

I wanted to know if there is a way to get my mash pH where I need it to be without raising my sulfate and bicarbonate levels too much. I'm very new to all of this and I'm trying to figure out if the water is worth messing with. I know mash pH is important but I don't want a bunch of off flavors from making salt additions.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated

Thank you in advance

Take a look at the info in the link below. This is a site of a friend of mine in the Chicago area who is brewing with Lake Michigan water. You might find some helpful info there.

http://www.freewebs.com/kenlenard/brewingwater.htm